Valve disses Microsoft by selling L4D+L4D2 for $6.79

[ProfessorLayton]

Probably not an intentional dig at MS, but the numbers are true, so that made me laugh either way.

And I don't even have L4D. I thought 6.79 was too expensive for it

If i can pay 100$ for a game like bioshock 2, that i'll finish in about 10 hours, i can sure as hell pay 6.79 for a game i so far have 80 hours of.

Just passed my 200th hour on Left 4 Dead 2. It was worth the $45 I paid for it (pre-order).

 

[Treblaine]

I might have my issues with Valve but this is just great stuff right there.

So, yeah. Microsoft clearly needs to learn something from these guys.

Like what? That they should start giving stuff away for free instead? Won't hold my breath.

Stuff for free? Hell, no.

However, treating the people who foolishly bought your version of the game like sheep and making them pay additional money is not a good PR strategy, especially when it goes against the will of the original developers.

Right, that sounds like the case against Microsoft... but what should Valve be doing differently?

 

[DigitalSushi]

I might have my issues with Valve but this is just great stuff right there.

So, yeah. Microsoft clearly needs to learn something from these guys.

Like what? That they should start giving stuff away for free instead? Won't hold my breath.

Stuff for free? Hell, no.

However, treating the people who foolishly bought your version of the game like sheep and making them pay additional money is not a good PR strategy, especially when it goes against the will of the original developers.

Right, that sounds like the case against Microsoft... but what should Valve be doing differently?

Making Episode 3 would be nice.

 

[Treblaine]

I might have my issues with Valve but this is just great stuff right there.

So, yeah. Microsoft clearly needs to learn something from these guys.

Like what? That they should start giving stuff away for free instead? Won't hold my breath.

List of free games on Steam:

-Half-Life 2: Deathmatch (ATI/GeForce users)
-Half-Life 2: Lost Coast (ATI/GeForce users)
-Portal: First Slice (Geforce Users)

-Alien Swarm
-America's Army 3
-BattleForge
-Between
-Codename Gordon
-COIL
-Mightier
-Moonbase Alpha
-Peggle Extreme
-Sam & Max: Episode 4
-Spacewar
-TrackMania Nations Forever

Not including scores of Steam delivered Mods.

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=851573

I can't think of a single free game on Xbox 360, PS3 or Wii. In fact PC as a platform there are hundreds of really high quality free games every year especially if you include games that are free-to-start with micro-transactions to level up like Battlefield Heroes. Oh yeah and all those browser based games.

 

[Treblaine]

I might have my issues with Valve but this is just great stuff right there.

So, yeah. Microsoft clearly needs to learn something from these guys.

Like what? That they should start giving stuff away for free instead? Won't hold my breath.

Stuff for free? Hell, no.

However, treating the people who foolishly bought your version of the game like sheep and making them pay additional money is not a good PR strategy, especially when it goes against the will of the original developers.

Right, that sounds like the case against Microsoft... but what should Valve be doing differently?

Making Episode 3 would be nice.

I can think of supposedly "more reputable" games companies that have gotten away with far worst.

 

[JourneyThroughHell]

Right, that sounds like the case against Microsoft... but what should Valve be doing differently?

Oh, I thought he was asking what Microsoft should've learned from Valve.

But, if he meant to ask what my issues with Valve were - well, the TF2 Xbox 360 version comes to mind, although that's mainly Microsoft's fault.

But, the main part for me is Machinima licensing which Valve has refused and refused for a long, long time for no good reason given. Their behaviour in that field already cost me a series I regularly watched and continues to do so.

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

I just hope that sooner or later they do some sort of GoTY edition which contains all the DLC. I'd pay full price again for the two games if they did that.

(Yeah, I don't like DLC, it's complicated.)

 

[TilMorrow]

But remember they did this just after the TF2 Man-economey update which will be bringing in more money for them. Also doesn't valve get a cut of all their DLC that is sold on XBL?

 

[Treblaine]

Yeah I hear you need friends for L4D to be awesome. Or put up with the verbal diarrhea on Xbox live. So since my friends have already long moved on to other games, I will likely never own L4D regardless of price point. That is in opposition to the fact one could call me a Valve fan boy. I am conflicted.

A little more OT: does anyone know how much the rake on Xbox Live Microsoft takes and what Valve gets?

Industry standard seems to be 70:30 from Apple's App store to Steam to XBLA and PSN though it may be negotiable. 70% to the rights owner of the content (in this case Valve) and 30% to the distributor (Microsoft owned and run XBLA). This is still a HELL of a lot better than the retail model where it is more the reverse, the distributors get 70% of the final price and the actual publisher gets only 30%.

The thing about XBLA is unlike those other digital-download services they are far more able to set the price and terms of release, which sounds a lot like price fixing and probably is only able to avoid those charges thanks to billions dollar legal office and the obfuscation of the Microsoft-Points "currency".

Of course it is in Microsoft's interest to set the price as high as they can, to increase the amount of money they get from their cut. But not necessarily in the game publisher who may want to use free or incredibly cheap DLC to advertise their game rather than additional revenue.

No one raves about premium DLC as much as free DLC, have you any idea how much ad companies would pay for positive exposure of their product like that? A LOT. I think it's more effective than a high production value superbowl ad.

 

[CrystalShadow]

Eh.

Good going valve. I guess.

But it's Microsoft we're talking about.

The original 'evil empire' of the computer software world.

Seriously, what do you expect from a company whose business strategy was once summed up in the words:

Embrace
Extend
Extinguish.

Not that it really means anything other than Microsoft has bad PR... Plenty of other companies are just as bad, just... Smaller. (I'm looking at you, Apple. ;p)

 

[Treblaine]

Right, that sounds like the case against Microsoft... but what should Valve be doing differently?

Oh, I thought he was asking what Microsoft should've learned from Valve.

But, if he meant to ask what my issues with Valve were - well, the TF2 Xbox 360 version comes to mind, although that's mainly Microsoft's fault.

But, the main part for me is Machinima licensing which Valve has refused and refused for a long, long time for no good reason given. Their behaviour in that field already cost me a series I regularly watched and continues to do so.

I can't find the link but I think I have an explanation on Valve not wanting Machinima: they are trying to make a name for THEMSELVES in that media format.

I remember Gabe saying that if there was ever going to be a Half Life, Team Fortress or Portal movie or whatever then they much rather do it themselves than just hand over the licence to some schmuck who'll likely just fuck it up in hope of a quick buck. Consider how increasingly sophisticated to 'Meet the Team' videos have become, from 30-second promotions to 5 minute dramas you can see they are developing fast. And their comic books and other media, including those for Left 4 Dead.

They are refining their art. If there is going to be any Valve Licensed movie or TV series coming then they are likely going to make and release it themselves, maybe only in publishing partnership with a company like Pixar or Dreamworks.

Think about it, Team Fortress (2) as an Animated feature film MADE BY VALVE! Valve could expand on the good relations with Apple from the "steam on Mac" détente and exclusively distribute any movie or TV series via iTunes to bypass the conventional distribution methods that would eat a new movie publisher alive. Or maybe just via Steam. Who knows what the future holds.

But where would licensed Machinima fit in that? It wouldn't, not very well, there would be brand confusion with the public as if the James Bond name and licence was sold to every TV station to be used all over the place.

 

[Treblaine]

I just hope that sooner or later they do some sort of GoTY edition which contains all the DLC. I'd pay full price again for the two games if they did that.

(Yeah, I don't like DLC, it's complicated.)

HUAHHHHH?!?!?

EVERY edition of L4D 1 & 2 on PC is effectively the GOTY version, as every version automatically includes all the latest "DLC" which is more like an update on PC. Just install the game normally and all the extra content is right there, and as more content is added the game gets automatically updated.

 

[JourneyThroughHell]

snip

I think I mean license in a bit of a different way. I mean, look at Microsoft. They've licensed Halo 3 for machinima purposes yet no machinima is official Halo media.

Valve is just stopping people from creating their own material, largely unconnected to their own games.

They want to make TF2 trailers. Fucking fine. But I'd rather they didn't curbstomb aspiring video makers like that.

Look at Blizzard. Beautiful, fantastic trailers and they could make movies out of that no problem. Yet their engine is licensed for usage in film purposes.

There's zero reason Valve shouldn't follow along.

 

[MelasZepheos_v1legacy]

I just hope that sooner or later they do some sort of GoTY edition which contains all the DLC. I'd pay full price again for the two games if they did that.

(Yeah, I don't like DLC, it's complicated.)

HUAHHHHH?!?!?

EVERY edition of L4D 1 & 2 on PC is effectively the GOTY version, as every version automatically includes all the latest "DLC" which is more like an update on PC. Just install the game normally and all the extra content is right there, and as more content is added the game gets automatically updated.

X-Box owner here. I haven't PC gamed in a long time and I'm not likely to start. (Again, it's complicated)

I just wish that Valve would do something like the Fallout 3 GoTY edition, where all the DLC was included.

 

[Worgen]

Yeah I hear you need friends for L4D to be awesome. Or put up with the verbal diarrhea on Xbox live. So since my friends have already long moved on to other games, I will likely never own L4D regardless of price point. That is in opposition to the fact one could call me a Valve fan boy. I am conflicted.

A little more OT: does anyone know how much the rake on Xbox Live Microsoft takes and what Valve gets?

thats another reason is better on pc, Ive only rarely met asshats on the pc, hell more then a bit of my steam friends list is made up of ppl Ive met on l4d or l4d2

 

[Ken Sapp]

I picked up that deal. But I don't think it was a dig or attack on MS in any way, just a different market model. Valve knows that they sell far more copies of games and such by cutting the price for a few days as people will buy it who otherwise wouldn't have and it keeps eyes coming back to the store page on a daily basis. It is effective publicity that ensures that whatever you are advertising is going to be seen by the most eyes possible.

And as for the price difference.... Bits are cheaper than plastic discs. If you want to play it on Xbox you have to buy the base game on a disc which has to be burned, packaged, shipped, stored and displayed. If you purchase it via digital download then you are just copying bits. Both involve the copying of bits but one has a larger, more costly intermediate path to get the bits onto your machine than the other.

 

[Ken Sapp]

The thing about XBLA is unlike those other digital-download services they are far more able to set the price and terms of release, which sounds a lot like price fixing and probably is only able to avoid those charges thanks to billions dollar legal office and the obfuscation of the Microsoft-Points "currency".

No, it is because they are a distributor and Distributors are generally free to set the price of their products as high as they like. If Gamestop wanted to set the price of every game on their shelves to $500 they can do so perfectly legally. Whether their customers will actually pay those prices is another matter. Price fixing is generally when a group of distributors get together and agree to offer their products at the same price usually either artificially low to drive a mutual competitor out of business or artificially high so they all make enormous profits.

 

[DeadEy3]

Yea i just bought l4d2 when it was on sale. Love steam sales!

 

[BENZOOKA]

That's a nice bit of good news. Haven't heard about this, yet I do window shop at Steam every other day.

 

[LastMondaysHangover]

Suddenly, I feel very bad for ripping on Valve for abandoning the Half Life series (even though I know it's not true)