what are your "unpopular" opinions on gaming?
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Those are the reasons sure, but it doesn't change the fact that games have the potential to be much more. Ive wondered if perhaps the human mind isn't fully developed enough to truly design a game at it's full potential. Like, we have millions of years to get the idea of bashing what you don't like with a weapon, and naturally think of that as a solution to all our problems, but other, more cerebral concepts are hard enough to understand, much less make a system of rules whose emergent complexities reflect some larger truth.Manji187 said:
Of course in the mean time, shooting zombies with a flamethrower is pretty damn fun and isn't a half bad cure for existential angst, so I'm not exactly up a creek without a paddle here.
I liked Final Fantasy XIII and Metroid Other M. Granted, they're not my favorite games ever or anything, but I enjoyed playing them.
Oh, and Mass Effect 2, while good, is nothing special. Lost Odyssey remains my favorite game on my Xbox.
Oh, and Mass Effect 2, while good, is nothing special. Lost Odyssey remains my favorite game on my Xbox.
The problem is that the vast majority of the games these people consider deep aren't deep at all. Philosophy 101 may be pretty impressive to 12 year olds and stoners who grew up in a cave, but something about people going "Ohh you want a deep storyline? Try bioshock, it's all philosophical and shit and really makes you think!" that annoys the piss out of me. The only game I can think of right now that I might consider having a reasonably 'deep' storyline is silent hill 2, not because of any pseudo-philosophical bullshit we've all come up with after smoking our first joint and wondered how the rest of the world could be so blind, but because of its rather well layered fucked up-ness.Vault101 said:
Basically, I'm not saying I don't want deep games, I just don't want that to be the end-goal. Mainly because most "deep" games are shallow as hell to anyone with more than three braincells.
well I think it depends on what we mean by "deep" and I do belive there is a certain amount of subjectivityVonnis said:
also yeah mbye thease games arnt "deep" at all
but even then to me it seems very backwards to suggest we abandon the Idea of games with storys and Ideas in favour of fucking Mario, and even then "storys" and "Ideas" are nothing that new in games and arnt specific to this current gen
what I mean is I found Bioshock a million times more "fun" than Mario or saints row 2 (dont get me wrong I liked saints row 2) and I liekd bioshock better than some movies and books
I get the feeling this attitude may have somthing to do with nostalga
anyway even if you take a game thats all fun and no substance. like red faction gurrella. i had alot of fun "analyzing" it, like the fact that it plays itself so painfully straight, that the EDF are one dimensional bad guys but when you think about it the red faction arnt helping anyone eather in the long term
the game would have been really cool if they took a more satirical aproach (like starship troopers) the gurrelas are really being self-entitled twats causing more problems for everyone
anyway what I dont understand is what problems do "storys" cause? is RFG any less fun because of a bad story? no, but that preverents it from being a great game IMO
there are bigger things to worry about, liek DRM and piracey. not that more gamea arnt liek mario
I agree with you that games have the potential to be much more. But I find the concept of "full potential" rather iffy. Gaming is experimental...developers decide to try out new stuff and this is a constant and ongoing process. At no point is the full potential of gaming as a medium known, because we can't predict how future developers will experiment with the medium...opening up new possibilities that subsequent developers will take as a starting point.Xanadu84 said:
If we are doomed (for now) to be playing games that focus on killing as the measure of progress/ succes/ achievement then at least developers should do their best to provide clear, consistent and credible reasons for our massacres. It should not be enough to say....the enemy is evil because they have a leather fetish and wear helmets with glowing eyes and shoot you when they see you. So you should fire first if you want to live. Or because they are brown people from the Middle-east for that matter. Sometimes I get the feeling developers are either simpletons or just plain lazy writers.
-Halo, Gears of War, and God of War series are all pretty bland.
-The Witcher (the first one) is terrible.
-Oblivion, Fallout 3, and Fallout: New Vegas are all built on a terribly unpolished game engine that seriously takes away from the games. There isn't even a character animation for walking diagonally in 3rd person.
-Metroid Prime 3 is TERRIBLE and takes a huge dump on the entire series. The first two are amazing.
-Killer7 is an amazing game.
-The Kane & Lynch games, despite having bad game design overall, should be noted for how well they pull off the nitty-gritty action film styled aesthetics.
-Splinter Cell: Conviction, despite not being much of a Splinter Cell game at all, is a fun game.
-The Witcher (the first one) is terrible.
-Oblivion, Fallout 3, and Fallout: New Vegas are all built on a terribly unpolished game engine that seriously takes away from the games. There isn't even a character animation for walking diagonally in 3rd person.
-Metroid Prime 3 is TERRIBLE and takes a huge dump on the entire series. The first two are amazing.
-Killer7 is an amazing game.
-The Kane & Lynch games, despite having bad game design overall, should be noted for how well they pull off the nitty-gritty action film styled aesthetics.
-Splinter Cell: Conviction, despite not being much of a Splinter Cell game at all, is a fun game.
There's nothing wrong with adding well-crafted stories and ideas to a game, they make the overall experience that much more enjoyable. What I would hate to see is this becoming the most important part of a game, precisely because it doesn't work well. They should support and enrich the experience, being a means to a greater end; not being an end in themselves. Most game developers simply aren't mature enough to tackle certain ideas. If they can, great, if they can't, I'd rather they stay away from trying to add too much and just focus on getting right the stuff they know about. A very basic but well done story to me is much better than something that tries to be deeper and thought-provoking but fails miserably.Vault101 said:
Again, I'm not seeing I don't want to see storytelling in games evolve. I just don't want to see a lot of game developers try to focus on that, fail miserably, and end up with shitty games because they (the developers) were trying to do something they didn't quite understand themselves. It comes down to the industry requiring much better writers than it currently has.
fair enough, its just I feel its somtimes an attitude of (as the EC guys said) "aahhhh no I dont want games to change!" or somthing vaugley along those linesVonnis said:
I feel this somtimes comes form hard-core nintendo fans (againt you can see I'm biased against nintendo fanboys)
or to put it another way "ahhhh if they make games art then there will be no more GTA or Mario!" *facepalm* nothing annoys me more
1. Most Escapists don't know the difference between controversial and unpopular (not being held in the majority is not necessarily unpopular either). Sorry 
2. Sega should have made a handheld rather than the Dreamcast.
3. The ESRB ratings should have some application in law or the actions of the ECA to enforce it through retailers should be held "unconstitutional".
4. As someone who plays games, I think most of us play too much.
5. This is simultaneously the worst generation and the best. Online requirements, war on used and rental games, hatred (not my own) of new concepts such as motion controls. On the other hand retro games are more accessible than ever before, there's some promise of DRM-free and games have incredible life beyond the shelf. Games may be less varied than before, but are closer to realizing dreams of the past too. This could go on and on, so I'll leave it here.
Despite my #1, nice thread. Always nice seeing some less popular ideas passed around.
2. Sega should have made a handheld rather than the Dreamcast.
3. The ESRB ratings should have some application in law or the actions of the ECA to enforce it through retailers should be held "unconstitutional".
4. As someone who plays games, I think most of us play too much.
5. This is simultaneously the worst generation and the best. Online requirements, war on used and rental games, hatred (not my own) of new concepts such as motion controls. On the other hand retro games are more accessible than ever before, there's some promise of DRM-free and games have incredible life beyond the shelf. Games may be less varied than before, but are closer to realizing dreams of the past too. This could go on and on, so I'll leave it here.
Despite my #1, nice thread. Always nice seeing some less popular ideas passed around.
"unpopular" probably not the bst word, what I really ment was "tell your opinions...ANYTHING is fair game"arealperson said:1. Most Escapists don't know the difference between controversial and unpopular (not being held in the majority is not necessarily unpopular either). Sorry
2. Sega should have made a handheld rather than the Dreamcast.
3. The ESRB ratings should have some application in law or the actions of the ECA to enforce it through retailers should be held "unconstitutional".
4. As someone who plays games, I think most of us play too much.
5. This is simultaneously the worst generation and the best. Online requirements, war on used and rental games, hatred (not my own) of new concepts such as motion controls. On the other hand retro games are more accessible than ever before, there's some promise of DRM-free and games have incredible life beyond the shelf. Games may be less varied than before, but are closer to realizing dreams of the past too. This could go on and on, so I'll leave it here.
Despite my #1, nice thread. Always nice seeing some less popular ideas passed around.
WHAT?!?! HOW DARE YOU ENJOY SOMETHING I DIDN'T!!! LoL only kidding, but seriously how the hell did you manage that?Benndak said:
As for my opinions:
1. Fallout 3 is nothing more than a boring grey/brown version of Oblivion with all the interesting bits sucked out.
2. Mass Effect is dull and uninteresting with boring characters and sterile boring graphics.
Probably got more than that but that's what comes to mind right now.
1. a game can be artistic without narative
2. Not everything Yahtze and Extracredits say is infalible fact
3. Brown does not constitute an argument
and my biggest one.
4. the art and world of Wow are in no way original.
2. Not everything Yahtze and Extracredits say is infalible fact
3. Brown does not constitute an argument
and my biggest one.
4. the art and world of Wow are in no way original.
Hm. Mine must be these then:
1. SC2 isn't that bad.
2. Heroes of Might and Magic IV was better than all the other ones in some aspects, it just lacked a bit of balancing and depth (I LOVED the Heroes on the battlefield no matter what other people might say)
3. EVE is actually an ingenious game.
4. People should stop buying/playing mediocre FPS's
1. SC2 isn't that bad.
2. Heroes of Might and Magic IV was better than all the other ones in some aspects, it just lacked a bit of balancing and depth (I LOVED the Heroes on the battlefield no matter what other people might say)
3. EVE is actually an ingenious game.
4. People should stop buying/playing mediocre FPS's
Ah. Coolies, makes it a bit easier to respond to then. Except, maybe a bit too easy. Not to be too particular, but I think your thread might be going into the 'All your forum are belong to me' route.Vault101 said:
6. The best part of Yahtzee's routine is where he's not being crude.
haha what ever that means I dont think Im helping by unintentionally bumping....I think this may have been my biggest thread anyway (ugghhh that sounded like a self ego boost sorry)arealperson said:
6. as for that yeah that makes sense, its when he tones down on the comedic act and actually gives some more sincere constructive criticism, much like his "extra punctuation" section