The vice president of the confederacy said it spesifically started because of slavery. States rights to leave the union because they wanted to keep slavery and disagreed that slavery was wrong.BioHazardMan said:
You don't know that, someone may like the pointy hat! "It's like being the mystery pope!"Nurb said:
Your just someone who likes to hold grudges. Probably one of those ultra-tolerant people I loathe so much.Nurb said:
Racism was the foundation for the confederacy, not "part" of it.Irony said:I won't disagree that racism was part of the Southern culture at the time. Poor white trash was still seen as better than a slave and should be better. But how can say that the war was fought on a pro-slavery/anti-slavery split when there were several states that remained in the Union that were slave states? And what about the huge amount of racist northerners? Abolitionists were prophets of truth in the north and mouthpieces of the devil in the south, they were radicals everywhere. The only reason why Southern racism is so well known is due to the high concentration of people of African descent living in the area. Race wasn't that big of an issue up North because blacks were few and far between. So of course those in South would need to "worry" about race so much, they had to deal with it every day. Of course it would be easy for the Northern states to abolish slavery within their borders (those that did, once again the war was not split free states vs. slave states), their economy didn't depend upon it.Nurb said:Not only was the start of the civil war about slavery (feared reversal of chattlehood policy), the confederacy was founded on racism; the idea that black people were in their rightful position to the superior white race because that's how God wanted it and needed to break away like the founding fathers intended them to do under that tyrant Lincoln. It's in their consitution and spoken about by their vice president.Irony said:
"States rights" is a smoke screen to attempt to obscure the real reason. Just accept it and move on.
"The new Constitution has put at rest forever all the agitating questions relating to our peculiar institutions ? African slavery as it exists among us ? the proper status of the negro in our form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution. Jefferson, in his forecast, had anticipated this, as the 'rock upon which the old Union would split.' He was right. What was conjecture with him, is now a realized fact. But whether he fully comprehended the great truth upon which that rock stood and stands, may be doubted. The prevailing ideas entertained by him and most of the leading statesmen at the time of the formation of the old Constitution were, that the enslavement of the African was in violation of the laws of nature; that it was wrong in principle, socially, morally and politically...
Our new Government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to the superior race, is his natural and moral condition."
-Confederate Vice President Alexander Stephens, Cornerstone Speech, March 21, 1861.
/Discussion on start of civil war
You can't take this war out of context and claim to know it's origins. There were years of cultural and political divide between the South and North as well as a pro-centralize government/pro-decentralized government argument that had existed ever since the original 13 colonies decided to break ties with Great Britain. As I mentioned before, the Kentucky and Virgina resolutions had existed for quite some time and were used to argue that the individual state governments had the right to overturn any federal laws that they deemed to be stretching the boundaries of what the federal government could do. The Southern economy was mainly based upon agriculture and slaves were used in great amounts as to help along. The North on the other hand was moving towards an economy based in industry (which lead to it's own form of economic slavery).
No not "/Discussion on start of civil war". Begin education about the true origins of the war, not what close to 200 years of separation have lead us to believe. Slavery was an important factor that lead to the begining of the American Civil War, true. But only because it had become entangled with some much older divides and issues.
>Confederate supporterBioHazardMan said:
Exactly.moretimethansense said:
Where do you read that? And how would you explain that, when there were black plantation owners even in the south? The Constitution agreed that a slave was counted as 3/5s of a person, not that they were meant to be slaves.Nurb said:
The only guy that the Union really cared to listen to before/during/after the war besides Davis was Robert E. Lee, and he didnt support slavery. he in fact was anti slavery, and only fought for the South for Virginia. If Virginia had stayed in the Union, Lee would have made huge advancements. Just cause the Vice President (who no one at all remembers of the top of their head) said something doesnt mean anything.Nurb said:
You dont? Cause there's a difference between ainstantbenz said:
I should have clarified, the Confederate constitution said thatemeraldrafael said:
Then I guess he was fighting for the wrong team then wasn't he? He could be anti-slavery all he wanted, but if his new constitution said that blacks were in their rightful place, then it doesn't matter what he thought does it?
"This (slavery) was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution."
Racist Lincoln!Nurb said:Racism was the foundation for the confederacy, not "part" of it.Irony said:I won't disagree that racism was part of the Southern culture at the time. Poor white trash was still seen as better than a slave and should be better. But how can say that the war was fought on a pro-slavery/anti-slavery split when there were several states that remained in the Union that were slave states? And what about the huge amount of racist northerners? Abolitionists were prophets of truth in the north and mouthpieces of the devil in the south, they were radicals everywhere. The only reason why Southern racism is so well known is due to the high concentration of people of African descent living in the area. Race wasn't that big of an issue up North because blacks were few and far between. So of course those in South would need to "worry" about race so much, they had to deal with it every day. Of course it would be easy for the Northern states to abolish slavery within their borders (those that did, once again the war was not split free states vs. slave states), their economy didn't depend upon it.Nurb said:Not only was the start of the civil war about slavery (feared reversal of chattlehood policy), the confederacy was founded on racism; the idea that black people were in their rightful position to the superior white race because that's how God wanted it and needed to break away like the founding fathers intended them to do under that tyrant Lincoln. It's in their consitution and spoken about by their vice president.Irony said:
"States rights" is a smoke screen to attempt to obscure the real reason. Just accept it and move on.
"The new Constitution has put at rest forever all the agitating questions relating to our peculiar institutions ? African slavery as it exists among us ? the proper status of the negro in our form of civilization. This was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution. Jefferson, in his forecast, had anticipated this, as the 'rock upon which the old Union would split.' He was right. What was conjecture with him, is now a realized fact. But whether he fully comprehended the great truth upon which that rock stood and stands, may be doubted. The prevailing ideas entertained by him and most of the leading statesmen at the time of the formation of the old Constitution were, that the enslavement of the African was in violation of the laws of nature; that it was wrong in principle, socially, morally and politically...
Our new Government is founded upon exactly the opposite ideas; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery, subordination to the superior race, is his natural and moral condition."
-Confederate Vice President Alexander Stephens, Cornerstone Speech, March 21, 1861.
/Discussion on start of civil war
You can't take this war out of context and claim to know it's origins. There were years of cultural and political divide between the South and North as well as a pro-centralize government/pro-decentralized government argument that had existed ever since the original 13 colonies decided to break ties with Great Britain. As I mentioned before, the Kentucky and Virgina resolutions had existed for quite some time and were used to argue that the individual state governments had the right to overturn any federal laws that they deemed to be stretching the boundaries of what the federal government could do. The Southern economy was mainly based upon agriculture and slaves were used in great amounts as to help along. The North on the other hand was moving towards an economy based in industry (which lead to it's own form of economic slavery).
No not "/Discussion on start of civil war". Begin education about the true origins of the war, not what close to 200 years of separation have lead us to believe. Slavery was an important factor that lead to the begining of the American Civil War, true. But only because it had become entangled with some much older divides and issues.
I don't get why this is so hard to accept
"It wasn't about slavery!"
"The vice president said it was all about slavery"
"States rights!"
"Ugh.."
And racism there is fueled by the holdover of Jim Crow laws, KKK terrorism, lynching, anti-civil rights demonstrations and laws that said interracial marriages were imoral and deviant. They're bitter, and so are the sore losers who can't stand they were wrong, so it just becomes a fucking cycle
Davis teaches his slaves advanced skills so that they may better integrate with free society!
Yes, because one man mentioning it in the constitution means that it was entirely about it. I wouldn't be surprised if the Vice President was chosen to help bring the support of those who were very involved in slavery and it's continuation.Nurb said:
Then I guess he was fighting for the wrong team then wasn't he? He could be anti-slavery all he wanted, but if his new constitution said that blacks were in their rightful place, then it doesn't matter what he thought does it?Nurb said:
"This (slavery) was the immediate cause of the late rupture and present revolution."
emeraldrafael said:
