What fighting game(s) did you guys play to make you hate fighting games so much?

[Lufia Erim]

Yeah, it's not about any particular game ruining the genre. It's that you eventually to get to the point where you've played enough fighting games that they start to look the same. The thing about fighters is that they all operate on one basic mechanic: press a button, character attacks. There is nothing else to them, or else they wouldn't be fighting games.

Secondly, the only way to compete at anything beyond party game level is to invest just absurd amounts of time into them. Just learning one character in one game well enough to play online takes days, even weeks. It's REALLY not worth the time when there are so many other games that offer more complex and variable experiences.

Well the reason i said that was because, In my experience, mashing never works. Like ever. So went people say that games are mashfests, i'm confused and wondering what games they are playing because i never seen mashing work. Second was the memorisation of long combos. While combos are inportant in most fighting games. Very few games are long combo fests. Take Soul calibur V AND SF4. The combos in those games are rarely longer than 4-5 hits. Anything more are flashy non-optimal combos for swag. While there are games like blazblue and UMVC3 who are combo heavy, most games aren't.

That being said. To paraphrase Destiny, i could tell you how fighting games are complex and viariable experiences ,but i won't. Out of curiosity, what was the last fighting game you played?

 

[SquallTheBlade]

There are a couple reasons for me, none of which are tied to any specific game:

1) The tutorials are ass. Seriously, the best you get is the training room with a dummy and a screen prompt. "Hey, do a guard cancel, here's how" it says. "Ok," I say, "what's a guard cancel and what do you use it for?" "Now do this other thing" the game replies.

I kinda get how to execute a command, but almost no specifics for when or why I'd want to. Start adding in a moveset with 30 different attacks for each character and, well, no.

You mean something like pic related?

Spoiler

Blazblue has some pretty good tutorials on all the aspects of the game and gives you pretty good examples of when and where to use all the mechanics introduced in the game.

2) The "friend who knows how to play" problem. I've got a couple of friends who know how to play and like fighting games. And that's great. Do I sit down and play against them? Hell no! I can kinda-sorta play Ken alright, but I've got nothing besides basic specials and maybe the super move. My friends will take me apart like a Ken potato-head. For a brief, shining moment I may be able to hold my own when a game is brand spanking new, but after that fades, handing me the controller just means I get frustrated losing 40 times in a row. With no Blue Justice in the game to spice things up, it's a no go. (Opposite happens with me and my friends in racing games. I get to a point where racing me isn't very fun for them unless they've got a way to wreck my shit. "Realistic" racing games are right out.)

Well you certainly don't have the mindset of your regular fighting game fan then. They'd be happy to go against someone who is better than them. It's a good chance to get better after all.

Whenever I play online I usually lose like 15 times and then I might win a match or 2. This is due to fact that I'm actually learning the match ups and getting better. One night I even won 5 times in a row in a full lobby! Man that felt good. It was definitely worth it.

My point is, losing doesn't matter. You can always improve even if you lose.

So yeah. I actually kinda like fighting games when I get to do the whole story thing, but as a multiplayer endeavor? Rather play Kart or Smash with all the items turned on and random tracks/arenas.

Eh, I'd consider story a added bonus to fighting games. Not something you should focus on.

 

[SquallTheBlade]

Secondly, the only way to compete at anything beyond party game level is to invest just absurd amounts of time into them. Just learning one character in one game well enough to play online takes days, even weeks. It's REALLY not worth the time when there are so many other games that offer more complex and variable experiences.

Not true at all. I can pick up a character, mess around with it on training mode for half an hour and I'm good to go. Will I win matches? Propably not. Will I have fun and improve? Most likely if I like the character. I don't see how you would need days and weeks to check out all the moves the character has and check few bnb combos. That's all you need to play.

And about "complex and variable experiences". I think fighting games can deliver that too.

 

[laggyteabag]

I actually really like fighting games, but I am just not very good at them. Here I am, pulling off the occasional combo, and then you look at a professional player, and they are bouncing around the room, hitting combo after combo, juggling their opponent, blocking and countering at exactly the right moments, and then I realise just how bad I am. I have this fear of playing online that when I start playing, I will immediately get roflstomped before I can even land a hit.

I do play Mortal Kombat X now, and I am having a lot of fun with it, but I will either fight AI, friends, or nobody at all. Screw randoms over the internet.

 

[Sniper Team 4]

This thread is already a real eye-opener. Only 13 posts in and I'm already really frustrated.

I mean...

I pulled the game out, stuffed it back in its case, and tossed it under my dresser so that I wouldn't give in to the whole, "Okay, THIS time I'll get him!" mentality.

Why would somebody do that?
You could've done if you kept trying, and learnt something along the way!

And you seriously cannot mash in any of these games that've been mentioned. Especially Smash Bros... I can't even conceive of how you could do that. You'd just end up jumping on the spot and Side-B-ing off the stage!
Argh!

Anyway, I know the question isn't aimed at me, but my first fighting game was Clayfighter 63 1/3 and I love fighting games. Seems it's more about winning and losing rather than which game it was.
I reckon people whose first fighting games are modern would find it much easier to get into them, just because they can almost always find somebody around their skill level online.

Like I said, I could rarely get to Seth. This went on for a month. A whole month of beating my head against a wall. As I said, I'm not good at fighting games, but I can usually at least beat them, even if I'm forced to cheat and set it on easy. Street Fighter IV did not work that way. I can only take disappoint and frustration for so long before it's no longer worth it and it starts to become unhealthy. Thus, why I put the game in a hard-to-reach place so I wouldn't keep punishing myself. There's pushing through when you have hope and see some progress, but this was not the case with me and this game. It wasn't like it became easier and easier for me the longer I played. It really was just me constantly dying while Seth barely had any damage.
I ended up giving the game to a friend as a gift and moved on.

 

[2HF]

I dislike fighting games because I'm not any good at them.

My thumbs are too clumsy for the combos on standard controllers and I don't care enough to invest in a fight stick.

I did enjoy Dead Or Alive for a time because of how beautiful and fluid the animations were. A perfectly timed counter attack had punch and a deep sense of satisfaction. I got good enough to beat anyone who might happen to be in the room, but that was it.

I could maybe get better, I don't want to. I don't want to give my time to it when I could give that time to something I know I enjoy and am good at.

 

[Zen Bard]

And then I played Street Fighter IV. And I couldn't beat it. Even when I set it on easy, I still got my teeth kicked in...

That is because Street Fighter IV cheats. I'm convinced of it.

Now I'm no whiz at Street Fighter, mind you. But I'd gotten pretty solid at pulling off the combos. And pretty soon, I was able to slice my up to the top with my ol' buddy Sagat.

And then, like you, I got to Seth and was routinely demolished. Took a run at it for about three weeks before flipping it down to easy.

But in that time I noticed something. I could swear there's a slight delay between the time you pull off your combo and when you character executes it. Meanwhile the AI for the Seth has already spammed the blocks or counters for the move that the game hasn't let you pull off yet! Maybe it was the frustration. Maybe it was paranoia. Or maybe I'm just a poor sport.

Anyway, I finally beat him ("on Easy") by jumping around, not using combos and switching up the attacks mid way. "Stick ad move", as they say.

But by then, I'd had enough. I sold it back to to Movie Trading Company.

And that basically killed my appetite for the genre.

 

[TheVampwizimp_v1legacy]

Yeah, it's not about any particular game ruining the genre. It's that you eventually to get to the point where you've played enough fighting games that they start to look the same. The thing about fighters is that they all operate on one basic mechanic: press a button, character attacks. There is nothing else to them, or else they wouldn't be fighting games.

Secondly, the only way to compete at anything beyond party game level is to invest just absurd amounts of time into them. Just learning one character in one game well enough to play online takes days, even weeks. It's REALLY not worth the time when there are so many other games that offer more complex and variable experiences.

Well the reason i said that was because, In my experience, mashing never works. Like ever. So went people say that games are mashfests, i'm confused and wondering what games they are playing because i never seen mashing work. Second was the memorisation of long combos. While combos are inportant in most fighting games. Very few games are long combo fests. Take Soul calibur V AND SF4. The combos in those games are rarely longer than 4-5 hits. Anything more are flashy non-optimal combos for swag. While there are games like blazblue and UMVC3 who are combo heavy, most games aren't.

That being said. To paraphrase Destiny, i could tell you how fighting games are complex and viariable experiences ,but i won't. Out of curiosity, what was the last fighting game you played?

The last fighting game I played was Soul Calibur 4. I used to play the early Tekkens and one of the BlazBlue games, but SC4 is the only one I play anymore, and that's just with my friends on the couch. And even that gets old after an hour or so, because it is just the same one-on-one matches over and over.

And I know that a fighting game CAN be a deep and rewarding experience, but here's my issue. You need to put in a lot of work to really compete with anyone beyond average skill, and no matter how good you get there will always be better players. I just don't want to spend so much time losing to people to get good, and then still lose to that random master of the game. Plus, when I do lose, it's nothing but frustrating. I don't feel like it's a learning experience, I just feel like I got stomped by some jerk I don't know and gained nothing from it.

Maybe my problem is that I don't have the patience or control over my temper to lose over and over and over, and all for a relatively simple video game experience. No fighting game could ever match the complexity of a Dragon Age or a Borderlands with my buddies. At least not without weeks of frustration and anger.

 

[Lufia Erim]

And then I played Street Fighter IV. And I couldn't beat it. Even when I set it on easy, I still got my teeth kicked in...

That is because Street Fighter IV cheats. I'm convinced of it.

Now I'm no whiz at Street Fighter, mind you. But I'd gotten pretty solid at pulling off the combos. And pretty soon, I was able to slice my up to the top with my ol' buddy Sagat.

And then, like you, I got to Seth and was routinely demolished. Took a run at it for about three weeks before flipping it down to easy.

But in that time I noticed something. I could swear there's a slight delay between the time you pull off your combo and when you character executes it. Meanwhile the AI for the Seth has already spammed the blocks or counters for the move that the game hasn't let you pull off yet! Maybe it was the frustration. Maybe it was paranoia. Or maybe I'm just a poor sport.

Anyway, I finally beat him ("on Easy") by jumping around, not using combos and switching up the attacks mid way. "Stick ad move", as they say.

But by then, I'd had enough. I sold it back to to Movie Trading Company.

And that basically killed my appetite for the genre.

Ai cheats. Especially seth. That being said, when i first got into SF4 vanilla, i had the same problem. I returned the game 2 weeks later. Then i bought AE2012, and i realised, i didn't know how to play street fighter. Like at all. I literally had to relearn EVERYTHING i though i knew. Frames, spacing, links, FADC, i learn everything back from square 1. The problem was i thought i knew what i was doing but i didn't have a clue. A humbling experience it was . I know not everyone has the time and patience for that though.

And here a video of maximillian beating it on the hardest difficulty. Watch it, it's entertainiń i swear.

 

[lacktheknack]

treallyweirdfw I appear to be the only person who's first fighting game was Street Fighter IV and it sold me on the genre

 

[Foehunter82]

Fighting games just aren't my thing. I haven't been interested in them for around 15 years or so. I tend to agree with this:

My real problem with fighting games is that i really feel that I am playing 1/3 of a game.

My opinion is that fighting games are really just a mini-game within a larger, more encompassing, and more interesting game. I won't buy a fighting game to play it, but if they, for instance, had put a "Commander Shepard's Punch-Out" portion into Mass Effect, I would have totally been into it.

Yes, I am aware that there's a brief sparring match between Shepard and Vega in Mass Effect 3.

 

[Matt Dellar]

My first fighting game was some version of Tekken at a friend's house, back before I had a computer or console of my own, and I can confidently say that, to a degree, I hate fighting games as a whole.

This isn't due to any inherent design flaw--I recognize that Street Fighter is well-designed and skillful, yet I dislike it because it doesn't fit my idea of a "fight." I want my opponent to stay down when I uppercut him 10 feet in the air--I don't want him to pop back up with a sliver of his health gone because I didn't do enough quarter-circles. I don't want to stab a guy through his skull and keep fighting him in Mortal Kombat. I want him to die from that move, because it should have killed him, and no amount of suspension of disbelief is going to help me enjoy it.

"Muh realism."

Kinda. I want a fighting game to be realistic enough to convince me that I'm fighting, but I don't need it to be gritty and grimdark or anything. Gang Beasts is a fun little brawler that is way too unpolished to compare to a masterpiece like Street Fighter (4?), but I like it more because knockouts and death come quickly. Same with Overgrowth (again, alpha state, but arguably more polished than the previous example). I feel like physics-based fighters are more my thing than any iteration of Tekken, Mortal Kombat, or Street Fighter.

TL;DR: Traditional fighters seem to lack impact; huge, intricate combos seem like a byproduct of massive health pools (or vise versa); as a filthy casual, I think physics-based systems can deliver combat with a much more weighty feeling.

I suck at explaining things.

 

[JohnnyDelRay]

Street Fighter 4. Up until then, I was the biggest SF fan, on all platforms. Since I played SF1 in the arcades as a kid. I loved plenty of fighting games, and all the iterations of SF (except for the Alphas, they introduced some weird mechanics that I couldn't maximize). I loved the Neo Geo fighting games, from KoF, Last Blade, Fatal Furys.

I used to pride myself on being somewhat above average, as in being able to do several decent combos with most characters on demand. Especially in Street Fighter EX and Warrior's Dreams. Somehow, when I started playing SF4, I just couldn't even get through the challenge mode. It seems the timing is all off. Maybe because in earlier SF games, it's more about sequence of buttons, the timing only matters in the first hit. Whereas in SF4, it's like each and every hit needs to be timed, and that killed it for me.

SF4 isn't even that hard - I managed to beat Seth on Normal in about 3 tries, on my first go. But I feel like I've hit a brick wall because of the new combo system. I'm not off fighting games completely though, I still play a bit of Mortal Kombat, and might pick up MKX if the price goes down and the characters aren't as paywalled (i.e: Komplete Edition)

 

[Zykon TheLich_v1legacy]

I don't, I just got bored with them and times changed. I used to play SFII, Tekken 1-3, original DOA, Soul Blade and would try the occasional oddment that came along. I think by the time DOA 2 came out I had lost interest, although I think I'd pretty much stopped playing computer games in general by that time.
Why I don't play now, 2 characters on a screen hitting each other doesn't have enough to it for me, it's pretty narrowly focused. I play on PC so fighting games aren't much of a thing and I don't have a group of friends that sit around playing games to play against in local multiplayer and most fighting games are a bit too animu for me.

Anyway, last one I bought was probably DOA2, played it about 3 times. Probably also the last one I played, bar sticking SF2 on with an emulator for 5 minutes out of nostalgia/curiosity.

 

[iller3]

I only played the best ones. SF2 & MortalKombat. Still didn't prevent me from getting sick of the whole concept really early on in life. FinalFight however, I couldn't get enough of. So I guess that's the answer right there?

...Arena fighters lock you in a stupid arena the whole match and it doesn't feel like you're going anywhere. It's the same reason so many people couldn't get into DeepSpace9. I LOVE twitchy fast paced complex heavily meta'd PVP games to this day even though minor studies say I shouldn't even still have the reflexes to play any of them well as I do. But with arena fighters, I dunno. I guess I'm just not a fan of 1 on 1's? Probably says something about intimacy issues and why I never married

 

[Ronald Nand]

While I don't hate fighting games, I stay away from the hardcore titles, simply because its demands too much investment in learning all the quirks and basic fighting game concepts. I do like more casual pick up and play fighting games where you need to only learn a couple of simple things and you can play any character decently, stuff like Naruto Ultimate Ninja Burst 3 or Playstation Allstars. I do like how fighting games don't demand too much of your time though, you can play a few rounds and just stop, unlike other games which demand at least an hour to be fulfilled by them.

 

[Lufia Erim]

While I don't hate fighting games, I stay away from the hardcore titles, simply because its demands too much investment in learning all the quirks and basic fighting game concepts. I do like more casual pick up and play fighting games where you need to only learn a couple of simple things and you can play any character decently, stuff like Naruto Ultimate Ninja Burst 3 or Playstation Allstars. I do like how fighting games don't demand too much of your time though, you can play a few rounds and just stop, unlike other games which demand at least an hour to be fulfilled by them.

The time investment seems to be a reccuring theme in this thread. And that's an argument i can understand and even agree with. I'm actually glad that , contrary to what i thought, it's not ( all )misconceptions about combos and mashing. That being said, while it's true being open to learning a games unique quirks will help greatly, no one is really expected to learn everything all at once. Even pro tournament players are constantly learning the longer they play a game. UMVC3 for example is a very different game now then when it first came out, even within the first year. And this is true for every fighting game. And again, unless you aspire to be a tournament player, no one is expecting perfection .


On a side note. I'm quite surprised no one complained about the community. While they probably aren't as bad as say MOBAs, the fighting game comunity can be pretty repulsive.

 

[Ronald Nand]

While I don't hate fighting games, I stay away from the hardcore titles, simply because its demands too much investment in learning all the quirks and basic fighting game concepts. I do like more casual pick up and play fighting games where you need to only learn a couple of simple things and you can play any character decently, stuff like Naruto Ultimate Ninja Burst 3 or Playstation Allstars. I do like how fighting games don't demand too much of your time though, you can play a few rounds and just stop, unlike other games which demand at least an hour to be fulfilled by them.

The time investment seems to be a reccuring theme in this thread. And that's an argument i can understand and even agree with. I'm actually glad that , contrary to what i thought, it's not ( all )misconceptions about combos and mashing. That being said, while it's true being open to learning a games unique quirks will help greatly, no one is really expected to learn everything all at once. Even pro tournament players are constantly learning the longer they play a game. UMVC3 for example is a very different game now then when it first came out, even within the first year. And this is true for every fighting game. And again, unless you aspire to be a tournament player, no one is expecting perfection .


On a side note. I'm quite surprised no one complained about the community. While they probably aren't as bad as say MOBAs, the fighting game comunity can be pretty repulsive.

I'd probably be more open to learning quirks and techniques if they were less intimidating, for example I used to play Guilty Gear X2 Reloaded and it was simply too daunting and complex with you needing to learn unique techniques in that game like Roman Cancel, Dust Cancel as well as characters whom used completely different playstyles. It looked too daunting and difficult so I didn't bother going deeper in the game and stuck to a handful of characters I knew how to play somewhat effectively, the best my skill got was consistently pulling of half and quarter circle moves. If the game had good training mode I might have invested the time into learning it but with no help I had no chance.

That's why I like playing the Naruto game, its mechanics give room for a bit of complex moves, but it was easy enough to learn the shared core moves everyone had and just play with whichever characters I liked best in the Anime.

While Guilty Gear was definitely a much better and deeper fighter, I simply enjoyed Naruto more as it demanded less time and skill.

 

[SonOfVoorhees]

Rise of the Robots 2. Worse fighting game ever. Seriously though it was a DOA game I had rented from Blockbusters. Just found it really hard to block or land a hit - very tricky. I now stick to Mortal Kombat and Soul Blade/Caliber games.