What's the deal with FF6?

[The_Decoy]

It's alot of fun, I played the playstation version last year, good times. Mechanics work well and the world is full of interesting characters. Dunno if it's better than VII, I rank them pretty much together (along with VIII).

 

[Enagan]

As I say all the time, 7<6<9.

I agree, except for me its

7<10<6<9

 

[crimson5pheonix]

The other reason I like 9 so much is because I enjoy dark story lines, and 9 was the most depressing Final Fantasy game in my opinion. I love it.

This is an interesting comment, because I've not played IX but always heard (as either a positive or negative point) that it isn't as dark as VI, VII and VIII.

I've lost count of how many times we've had some variation of "what's your favourite FF" but for the record, of the ones I've played: (VII and VIII) > VI > X > X-2.

Most people can't get past the chibi artwork thinking "It's Final Fantasy for kids!" But Kuja was the most successful villain and Quite a few people die and stay dead. There were even 2 successful genocides.

 

[JEBWrench]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

 

[JEBWrench]

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

See, now, I like Shinra. I just didn't feel they were villains.

ExDeath, there's one I really enjoyed. Of course, FFV is the FF game I still enjoy playing now and again.

I haven't played A2, but FFT sure was a lot of fun for me, and I felt all the characters were quite well-rounded for my liking. (Of course, I have this thing for the Job system, so that may also explain why the other systems bore me so much.) And, of course, tactical games like that and Fire Emblem are lately my cup of tea.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

The funny part is that A2 is by far the hardest and most balanced of the Tactics series. Shame the main story is boring as shit, but some of the side stories are pretty nice.
snip

When is it hard and balanced? I pointed out the worst example, but pretty much every late game job was horribly broken. When you can spam 1 shot AOE attacks, there is no difficulty.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

The funny part is that A2 is by far the hardest and most balanced of the Tactics series. Shame the main story is boring as shit, but some of the side stories are pretty nice.
snip

When is it hard and balanced? I pointed out the worst example, but pretty much every late game job was horribly broken. When you can spam 1 shot AOE attacks, there is no difficulty.

I said "hardEST" and "MOST balanced." Compare A2 to Tactics and Tactics Advance.

I am. There's only 2 unbalanced classes I can think of in Tactics, and they take work to get to. Also, you can still lose against certain enemies no matter how good you are.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

The funny part is that A2 is by far the hardest and most balanced of the Tactics series. Shame the main story is boring as shit, but some of the side stories are pretty nice.
snip

When is it hard and balanced? I pointed out the worst example, but pretty much every late game job was horribly broken. When you can spam 1 shot AOE attacks, there is no difficulty.

I said "hardEST" and "MOST balanced." Compare A2 to Tactics and Tactics Advance.

I am. There's only 2 unbalanced classes I can think of in Tactics, and they take work to get to. Also, you can still lose against certain enemies no matter how good you are.

...Tactics can be broken with nothing more than a horde of Monks. And once you take "they take work to get to" into account then A2 isn't anymore broken, since all the HUGE exploits do still take work to get to.

No it doesn't. Like I said, Paladin over Ninja and the challenge disappears. To truly break the original Tactics, you need a team of Something over Calculators. Even 1 Calculator makes the game easy, 4 is just silly. But it takes a long time to get Calculator abilities.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

The funny part is that A2 is by far the hardest and most balanced of the Tactics series. Shame the main story is boring as shit, but some of the side stories are pretty nice.
snip

When is it hard and balanced? I pointed out the worst example, but pretty much every late game job was horribly broken. When you can spam 1 shot AOE attacks, there is no difficulty.

I said "hardEST" and "MOST balanced." Compare A2 to Tactics and Tactics Advance.

I am. There's only 2 unbalanced classes I can think of in Tactics, and they take work to get to. Also, you can still lose against certain enemies no matter how good you are.

...Tactics can be broken with nothing more than a horde of Monks. And once you take "they take work to get to" into account then A2 isn't anymore broken, since all the HUGE exploits do still take work to get to.

No it doesn't. Like I said, Paladin over Ninja and the challenge disappears. To truly break the original Tactics, you need a team of Something over Calculators. Even 1 Calculator makes the game easy, 4 is just silly. But it takes a long time to get Calculator abilities.

It takes awhile to get anything like Paladin/Ninja too.

There's 1000 ways to break the original tactics, just due to how many different classes and abilities there are, which was scaled down a bit for the portable games. And let's not even get into Thunder God Cid.

The gameplay has gotten more refined with each new installment of the Tactics series, but the story has gotten more and more dull.

Ok, yeah, Cid was very OP, but I still maintain that A2 had more ways to break the game than the original. I actually used game breakers in the original and I could still die. I couldn't possibly lose A2 with the breaking in that game.

 

[RandV80]

Woah, I go to bed, wake up, and I find this. Easy people, no need to go at each other's throats over that Kefka guy. You can let this thread die now.

Really it's better explained with a history lesson than arguing back and forth the merits between each game.

FFVII basically but JRPG's on the map. What was a fringe genre before that saw the majority of it's games not get translated and released over here, FFVII brought in 3D graphics, FMV cut scenes, and actual commercial advertising to catch people's attention and have them try and become a fan of JRPG's. You're story of FFVII being the first JRPG you played is a common one, and it's thanks to all you people that it would be unthinkable to not translate and release a JRPG over here. Also because of this though, FFVII has a huge nostalgia factor going for it, creating legions of fan boys and 'best game/RPG ever!' opinions.

But while it was the first JRPG many played it is definately not the first JRPG made. While smaller there was a fanbase over here in the West well before FVII. Personally I enjoyed the original Dragon Warrior and Phantasy Star, though I was a little young to get far in them, but for the Snes/Genesis era played practically every JRPG that got released over here. So for my crowd, when FFVII got released while it was a great game it was nothing new and exciting, and if you ask us FFVI (or FFIII as we knew it) was better.

So that's what it basically comes down to and what the "deal" is with FF6. For JRPG players, the consensus of the pre-FFVII crowd puts VI in top spot, post-FFVII crowd picks VII. Enough time has past that both sides are adults now so it's easy to miss that distinction.

 

[Arqus_Zed]

Meh,
I can understand one would compare Halo with Halo 2, or Jak & Daxter with Jak II, Super Mario Bros. with Super Mario Bros. 3 or even Persona 3 with Persona 4...

But I find it reaaaally unlikely it is possible to justifyingly compare FF VI with FF VII, FF VIII or any other for that matter. Ever realized how much difference there is between those games? It's like comparing Shadow Hearts with Lucifer's Call.

That said, FF VI is a very good 16-bit jRPG, but that's all I can say.

btw, FF IX still tops my list of best jRPG ever, don't care about how subjective that statement is.

Vivi is epic,

Spoiler: and Amarant will own your ass.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Sephiroth was never a mama's boy until the retcons started in, and even then it was less "being a mama's boy" and more "I'm going to use her plan to wreck shit." But all the same, he's best in the original game and Crisis Core, while most everyone seems to write him (and the entire rest of the cast) off due to advent children.

I disagree with you on that part. He did his fair share of whining about Mother in the original game too.
Yes, he's best in the original game, but he was never "ZOMG BEST VILLIN EVAR" to me.

As for what you mentioned about the Tales series, Symphonia's the only one I've had long enough to play to completion. What I played of the first one, that game is fantastic, and I wanted to finish it, but I doubt I ever well.

Still, Sand. Boots. Poison. Apocalypse. Kefka wasn't a slouch in terms of being a rotten asshat.

In the original game he's controlling Jenova's corpse like a puppet though, and all he cares about is becoming a god. He's also got some genuinely dark and disturbing moments.

My position on Kefka is that while he is at least entertaining (moreso in Dissidia though, where the whole clown thing really comes out in full), he's just not as entertaining as Gilgamesh and ExDeath were, nor is he as interesting or intimidating as Sephiroth and Shinra Corp are. He's not a BAD villain, he's just not a great one.

But then, the Ivalice games will always have the best FF antagonists (barring A2 I suppose).

A2 was so broken it wasn't even funny. When my paladin was dual wielding the best swords in the game, got the first move, and could move all the way across the map, I gave up on the challenge.

The funny part is that A2 is by far the hardest and most balanced of the Tactics series. Shame the main story is boring as shit, but some of the side stories are pretty nice.
snip

When is it hard and balanced? I pointed out the worst example, but pretty much every late game job was horribly broken. When you can spam 1 shot AOE attacks, there is no difficulty.

I said "hardEST" and "MOST balanced." Compare A2 to Tactics and Tactics Advance.

I am. There's only 2 unbalanced classes I can think of in Tactics, and they take work to get to. Also, you can still lose against certain enemies no matter how good you are.

...Tactics can be broken with nothing more than a horde of Monks. And once you take "they take work to get to" into account then A2 isn't anymore broken, since all the HUGE exploits do still take work to get to.

No it doesn't. Like I said, Paladin over Ninja and the challenge disappears. To truly break the original Tactics, you need a team of Something over Calculators. Even 1 Calculator makes the game easy, 4 is just silly. But it takes a long time to get Calculator abilities.

It takes awhile to get anything like Paladin/Ninja too.

There's 1000 ways to break the original tactics, just due to how many different classes and abilities there are, which was scaled down a bit for the portable games. And let's not even get into Thunder God Cid.

The gameplay has gotten more refined with each new installment of the Tactics series, but the story has gotten more and more dull.

Ok, yeah, Cid was very OP, but I still maintain that A2 had more ways to break the game than the original. I actually used game breakers in the original and I could still die. I couldn't possibly lose A2 with the breaking in that game.

I've never once lost in the original, but I've been killed off in the very first mission on A2's hard mode.

There are gamebreakers in A2 (Item Lore+Mirror Items comes to mind), but not nearly as many as the original. In the original, you have to screw up building Ramza to die.

Actually now that I think of it, when was the last time you played the original?

A few months ago. And it's very easy for Ramza to die. Weigraf is a pain. So is Gaffgarion if you don't prepare for him. And Elmdore.

 

[Space Spoons]

Oh, yes. It's good. And here's why.
Yes, that man just suplexed a moving train. No, it's not the only such moment in this game, though it's certainly one of the best.


Of course, you'll never properly understand why it's earned such a reputation until you actually play it for yourself. Get out there and play it, man. Find an SNES, track down a copy of FF Anthologies for the PS1, even emulate if you have to. Just play the damn thing. You won't be disappointed.