Why are people so against 'feminism' in gaming?

[Moonlight Butterfly]

le snip

.... You have won this thread, However I feel it right to say that you shouldn't have to beg to ask like that to be included. And feel obligated at this point to point out that this thread itself isn't merely going to solve the issue. Best scenario it changes a few extremiests minds.

*fights urge to make 'don't you like a woman on her knees joke'*

Sorry if it had a begging feel to it but it just gets so depressing that you come on to these forums and theres a thread like this to remind you that you aren't one of the gang, you're different, every day.

 

[JUMBO PALACE]

Besides, women get their panties in a twist over damn near every female character that is hotter than they will ever be. How many times you heard a dude ***** because the male protagonist is a walking slab of muscle instead of a glasses wearing, unkempt, cheeto covered, fat bastard?

In short. Males have to deal with bullshit in games too. We just whine less.

This post is pure awesome. Someone had the balls to put it out there. I agree.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Besides, women get their panties in a twist over damn near every female character that is hotter than they will ever be. How many times you heard a dude ***** because the male protagonist is a walking slab of muscle instead of a glasses wearing, unkempt, cheeto covered, fat bastard?

In short. Males have to deal with bullshit in games too. We just whine less.

This post is pure awesome. Someone had the balls to put it out there. I agree.

I like chubby men they are cuddly. :3 Also am I the only woman who wants to see a fur bikini and cloak combo for my skyrim character I bet I'm not *sing song voice*

Edit: Sorry I just invisioned that on a female Khajiit standing atop a slain dragon and had an awesomegasm :<

 

[Venereus]

Besides, women get their panties in a twist over damn near every female character that is hotter than they will ever be. How many times you heard a dude ***** because the male protagonist is a walking slab of muscle instead of a glasses wearing, unkempt, cheeto covered, fat bastard?

In short. Males have to deal with bullshit in games too. We just whine less.

This post is pure awesome. Someone had the balls to put it out there. I agree.

I concur!

True that! But it's not just different amounts of whining. When it comes to idealized gender images, the social pressure on women is stronger, more widespread and comes in many more shapes than on men.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Like a leather biki with fur lining that would be so cool. I just want to see the look on the grey beards faces hahahahaha. (sorry for the offtopicness)

I will behaive now.

 

[volcanblade]

Besides, women get their panties in a twist over damn near every female character that is hotter than they will ever be. How many times you heard a dude ***** because the male protagonist is a walking slab of muscle instead of a glasses wearing, unkempt, cheeto covered, fat bastard?

In short. Males have to deal with bullshit in games too. We just whine less.

This post is pure awesome. Someone had the balls to put it out there. I agree.

I concur!

True that! But it's not just different amounts of whining. When it comes to idealized gender images, the social pressure on women is stronger, more widespread and comes in many more shapes than on men.

Completely agreed. (I think this is the first time in this thread that a mutual understanding has been made)

 

[Angry_squirrel]

Femenist already has a meaning, the word was coined to mean a woman who wants equal rights to men. A sexist female is a Misandrist. There are a few misandrist women working under the lable of Femenist because they think all men are Misogynists, these are a vocal minority. You cant say that you have an alternate definition of the word, that is part of the problem.

Also, its funny that you should mention Duke Nukem, as the Duke himself is a rampant sexist. This is an odd case however as the creators themselves acknowlege this and have even offered for femenists to use the character in their campaigns.

Misandrist? Never heard that before.
Look, the "alternate definition" that I am using is simply what I've grown up with. Call it slang if you must. Either way I cannot be bothered with another argument, I dislike Misandrists who call themselves feminists then.

All I'm saying is that it's a bad idea to associate a movement with that definition, it just hurts their credibility. I'm starting to think what they need is a rebranding, a new name without all the negative connotations. I would recommend the term Radical Feminist for when your referring to the aggressive types, that way other people wont pick up that use aswell.

Sorry. I'm tired, in a bad mood, and probably making a prick of myself. You're right.

 

[razelas]

This is how I interpret the word based on my experience with many people calling themselves feminists, I made a point to say that it is my opinion, not fact. Nor did I ever go "Telling people what they really are"

Please explain how "interpreting" a group identity (based on anecdotal evidence no less) is different from telling people that the identity they use is incorrect.

I also tried to make it very clear that I do support equal female rights. I get the impression that this is what you're arguing for, so why with the aggression?

You support equal female rights but you think feminists are sexist women... even though feminists have done more than you could ever "support" for equal female rights? lolwut?

I get the impression that you're in a very bad mood and taking it out on the wrong person. Seriously, you're getting at me for my perception of a word? I'm not saying it's right and that that's the one and only way that the word can be interpreted, I'm just pointing out what comes to mind when I hear it said.
Perhaps I have just had bad experience with feminists, but really you are doing nothing to change my opinion.

I'm sorry if I'm coming off as aggressive, but you do realize the logical disconnect when you claim to support equal female rights and then condemn feminism as a whole based on personal experience? It would be akin to me saying that I support equal treatment between colored and white people, but I think the 1960s civil rights movement was racist because my father told me he got assaulted at one of their protests because he was white.

Have you ever considered the possibility that maybe there are just as many sexist women as there are sexist men? Well that is how you are coming across to me, as a sexist woman who hates men. If I am wrong, please prove it to me. Stop with the aggression and calmly tell me why you disagree with what I've said, rather than attacking everything I say.

Again, I apologize if it seems like I'm attacking you, which is clearly not my intent. I'm used to a kind of "hardball" debate style where if I'm not careful and precise about getting a point across, my argument gets deconstructed into logical fallacies very quickly by people much smarter and older than I. What you see as attacking and insulting is just intellectual sparring to me.

With that said, you know I'm a guy right?

And in an undeniably patriarchal society such as in the US, it's highly improbable that women at brought up to believe female is the superior sex.

 

[angelsmash]

Have to laugh that a thread about women in video games turns into a discussion about what would be cute for a polygonal barbarian to wear

 

[Ironman126]

I'm a girl and feminism annoys me most of the time. i dont understand why were suppose to band together against men or something. i understand if sexism is involved and the comradship is great.

i get annoyed about being harassed by other girl games with the whole " Girl Power!" attitude, sometimes i just want to play a game with my friends and clan, which consist of guys and girls.

I'm a guy, i'm am really confused. What exactly is this "feminism" being referred to? Is it the "women should be equal to men" feminism that i support adamantly or the feminazi "Men are evil and will hurt you, so we should kill them all" kind that pisses me off?

OP: Feminism is so opposed because there is a sect of "feminist," and i use that term very lightly, who would like to see women be made the sole rulers of humanity and do away with men as a whole (where i come from, that's known as "facism") for reasons i still cannot fathom, perhaps it's the fact i posses a Y chromosome. Feminism didn't used to carry this connotation, but now the words "feminism" and "feminazi" are used synonymously, which is, frankly, bullshit.

Of course, sexism isn't something i condone and games like Duke Nukem and Dead or Alive confuse the hell out of me (and yes, i am straight). I think back to an Extra Credits i watched not to long ago (not going to bother with the link) that touched on this same issue. Personally, i don't see the problem with making games based around female characters and not in the sense that the characters can be either gender.

That said, some games lend themselves to being gender exclusive, like military shooters based around US soldiers. Women don't officially serve in front-line combat, so it makes sense that the player character is male. However, i would like to see a shooter with a female PC, but i digress.

TLR: Feminazis bad, sexism bad, gender neutrality and diversity good. Want a game with a strong, exclusively female lead, who isn't wearing a thong.

 

[Thaluikhain]

All I'm saying is that it's a bad idea to associate a movement with that definition, it just hurts their credibility. I'm starting to think what they need is a rebranding, a new name without all the negative connotations. I would recommend the term Radical Feminist for when your referring to the aggressive types, that way other people wont pick up that use aswell.

Erm...the term "Radical Feminism" is already in use, it refers (basically) to those feminists who desire a re-ordering of society to do away with existing gender roles.

Sorry if it had a begging feel to it but it just gets so depressing that you come on to these forums and theres a thread like this to remind you that you aren't one of the gang, you're different, every day.

I sympathise. These threads do crop up very frequently and tend to follow the same pattern.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I think women just get more media coverage. That might sound like a radical opinion, but it's something I hold firm to. Most of my friends are male, and most of them have more self-esteem issues than I do. Two of my male friends are models, and still think they need to diet, smoke and exercise more than is humanly possible to look good.

This is true my friend who is in a wheelchair works out like a mad man to look good (and boy he does /lick) and my skinny friend thinks he is ugly for no good reason. I think men have just as much pressure.

Have to laugh that a thread about women in video games turns into a discussion about what would be cute for a polygonal barbarian to wear

You know you want the bikini. RAWR

 

[Venereus]

Besides, women get their panties in a twist over damn near every female character that is hotter than they will ever be. How many times you heard a dude ***** because the male protagonist is a walking slab of muscle instead of a glasses wearing, unkempt, cheeto covered, fat bastard?

In short. Males have to deal with bullshit in games too. We just whine less.

This post is pure awesome. Someone had the balls to put it out there. I agree.

I concur!

True that! But it's not just different amounts of whining. When it comes to idealized gender images, the social pressure on women is stronger, more widespread and comes in many more shapes than on men.

I don't necessarily think it's stronger. How many men take steroids to achieve the modern ideal of the "perfect" male body?

I think women just get more media coverage. That might sound like a radical opinion, but it's something I hold firm to. Most of my friends are male, and most of them have more self-esteem issues than I do. Two of my male friends are models, and still think they need to diet, smoke and exercise more than is humanly possible to look good.

How many men take steroids to achieve the modern ideal of the "perfect" male body? Not that many. What I was thinking when I said stronger was the fact that females enforce it on themselves and their peers more than men do.

 

[Lead Herring]

Truth is

Thing is there is a large percentage of the videogame fan base IS female, as large as 40% some sources say.
http://edugamesresearch.com/blog/2008/07/23/esa-survey-malefemale-gamer-ratio-is-6040-average-age-is-35/
People have got to stop saying things based on assumptions instead of doing the research

If you actually read the study, it's far less impressive. Think about it: it's a 1,200 sample phone survey, and they intentionally sought households that owned a console. Of course the sex split will be roughly equal: any question would under those circumstances. Not only that, but their definition of "video game" apparently includes not only Bejeweled and Diner Dash but Mahjong. With a pool this wide, you could just about say everyone dips their toes into the video gaming pool.

Truth is, I read the ststistic in Game Informer and I just threw that link in to support my opinion. I dont think that its a good idea just to assume that most female gamers are causual gamers. I mean sure, it would make sense, but these days it's not safe to assume these things if it means excluding a sizable minority.
And just for good measure http://www.slashgear.com/the-herald-says-the-number-of-female-gamers-is-growing-1911682/

 

[razelas]

I maintain that equality is on its way.

Here's a quote you may find interesting:

Source [http://www.africa.upenn.edu/Articles_Gen/Letter_Birmingham.html]

We know through painful experience that freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor; it must be demanded by the oppressed. Frankly, I have yet to engage in a direct action campaign that was "well timed" in the view of those who have not suffered unduly from the disease of segregation. For years now I have heard the word "Wait!" It rings in the ear of every Negro with piercing familiarity. This "Wait" has almost always meant "Never." We must come to see, with one of our distinguished jurists, that "justice too long delayed is justice denied."

It's easy to say "wait" when you're not the one waiting.

 

[angelsmash]

Truth is, I read the ststistic in Game Informer and I just threw that link in to support my opinion. I dont think that its a good idea just to assume that most female gamers are causual gamers. I mean sure, it would make sense, but these days it's not safe to assume these things if it means excluding a sizable minority.
And just for good measure http://www.slashgear.com/the-herald-says-the-number-of-female-gamers-is-growing-1911682/

To be honest, what initially tipped me off that the survey was a stinker wasn't the stuff about girls but the factoid that supposedly 94% of parents supervise their kids when they buy games. I mean, come on!

 

[angelsmash]

You know you want the bikini. RAWR

You could make a great one piece out of a grizzly bear's butt.

 

[lacktheknack]

Oh man, ive been running into this alot. Some people HATE when females actually do things like grown ups.


Theres this one video on youtube, about how this one guy looks like a girl, so when he talks some guys actually tell him he needs to be quiet and hes being a ***** for saying something. And he correctly points out how thats dumb, girls are allowed to talk, duh.

The comments are ASTOUNDING "HOW DARE YOU, YOU HATE ALL MEN! YOU WANT TO DESTROY MEN! ARRRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHH! ARRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHH!"
amazing.

Have you ever seen someone melt into a viscous puddle of laughter, slowly flowing out of their chair onto the floor and waking up the entire house with peals of hyena giggles?

Because your description of the commenters just made me do that.