Why are there no businessmen in the American comic book industry?

[dragoongfa]

But that isn't HATING the old works, it's loving them so much that you can't let them go. They honestly can't come up with an original new idea (or aren't allowed to, by businessmen) to save their lives so they retread the same stories that they read 30 years ago, over and over and over again. It's why the Killing Joke is still being referenced even though that comic is probably older than the people who buy Batgirl, it's why Wolverine or Spiderman have to show up to give new super heroes their blessing, it's why the phoenix force still comes around every couple years just so we can remind everyone that it's still a thing

That is literally the exact opposite of what you are talking about.

You just described the other half of the reason why the current US comic industry has stagnated.

I disagree however as to the 'love them so much' angle, what I described is best put down as obsessive behavior. When you are obsessed about something you forget the initial 'love' that you may have had and go to the irrational deep end. In the case of the handful of the above 'fans' I have had the bad luck to meet (thankfully only in the internet) their obsession went so deep that over half of the canonical story of their 'favorite' book series (Harry Potter) was written off as non canonical because of 'reasons' and that only their fan fic did true justice to the characters and story.

Spoiler Alert: Harry hooked up with Hermione very early and became a dominant Alpha, killed the entire Malfoy family by 'accident', resurrected Sirius, absorbed Voldermort's powers (for the greater good) and Snape was never a good guy.

I forget the name of the fanfic in question, pretty sure that it wasn't on fan fiction net.

 

[Therumancer]

At the end of the day businessmen do run the comics companies and they are using the same basic gimmick they have always used, which is to do shocking things with characters to get attention, which will then boost sales at least for a time. That and comics are one of the parts of media in general that has been heavily taken over by that "Social Justice Warrior" crowd, like a lot of other facets of geekdom in general. Given the back and forth that's been happening and the explosion that was Gamergate bringing more attention to it than ever before, it's not surprising comics are capitalizing on it in the easiest way they can, which plays to the tendencies a lot of the entrenched writers had to begin with. At the end of the day though most of this is just a bunch of temporary changes that will move books, getting praise from the left wing media for "critical success" and attention, even if the writing is horrible as some people here have pointed out, and moving comics because all of these weird changes and variant characters are potentially going to be collectible.

I've given my opinion at length about the Batgirl cover (it was not a Batwoman cover as far as I heard, they are two distinct characters) and the current state of "The New 52". It was a bad move, BUT at the end of the day it's not like anyone can force DC's hand. Actual comic readers know that the cover in question is really tame compared to things that have already happened in New 52 and to the Bat family, including Bat Girl in particular. The complaints largely being knee jerk reactions to the art from people who apparently don't read comics or they likely would have been upset about things far beyond that already. As things stand now, the attention it got, and the controversy, probably means that not publishing the cover actually gets them more attention, especially since they will later be able to release the controversial art in print (although more people have doubtlessly seen it now due to the hype than would have seen it if it had just been quietly released on a comic) and probably cash in on it a second time. At the end of the day though some bad precents were set, since DC was seen to back down, it means they are likely to see more SJWs trying to jump on every little thing they do, and heaven forbid more of them actually start reading comics, DC won't be able to blink, and odds are we'll find ourselves facing another self-imposed "Comics Code Authority".

 

[Vault101]

It pretty much is Tumblr meets WoW. I'd avoid it like the plague if you're not a fan of usual Tumblr politics.

OH COME ON...how is having a full cast of women "political"?

if Rat Queens is "political" then how it Preacher not "political"?...oh wait...IT IS...in fact its more "political" than Rat queen because [i/]*GASP* I get the impression Ennis has somewhat sympathetic veiws to solders and veterans oh lord!! The Boys is anti-corporate??? OH MY!! [/i]

oh wait...no that actually doesn't change anything, because ALL stories impart the views of the creator..in both small petty things and big things and in both subtle ways and non subtle ways

so yes actually All stories are inherently political because human beings are inherently political. Weather its "freinds good! bigotry bad!" in Harry Potter or "Liberal views are bad! garble warble!" in the Honor Harrington books

so really the only issue I could see someone having with Rat Queens is if they found something inherently abnormal about a group of varied women being main characters...almost as if they assumed the current model (male/white/straight) was some inherent world standard default and deviating from that only exists to appease some fictional committee of "SJW" and not...you know because women/POCs/gay women exist...in numbers more than 2

[quote/]snip[/quote]
I find it funny that you disliked Rat Queens yet suggest some of the most "guyish" edgy comics I've read. I mean don't get me wrong I like Ennis and even how he writes women (occasionally) but I mean....come on

 

[TekMoney]

Just to update a little bit on the whole Thor thing, it seems that her series is selling actually rather well, so from a business standpoint, I think we can rule her out as a problem- even if some people aren't keen on the writing.
http://fusion.net/story/105401/new-..._campaign=socialshare&utm_content=desktop+top

Honestly, that's debatable. The book's already lost 60% of its sales from it's first issue, which granted, isn't abnormal in comics, at the moment, I can't guess if this is a new normal level, or if interest will drop further, especially when they finally give the new Thor her origin (mystery is a great way to keep readers around). It's also quite a bit beneath the levels male Thor maintained in his post Civil War relaunch a few years back. In the big picture, well, the clone saga in Spider Man did boost sales, and All Star Batman and Robin sold very well at first, but it might not have been worth the legacy it left to the reputation of comics.

You mean the post-Civil War relaunch that a: Happened after there had been no Thor comic for a period of years, and b: Featured a huge name writer who brings his own audience with him?

 

[Vault101]

Whor

well if that's what I'm dealing with then I'm not going to waste my fucking time with a response

 

[ArcaneGamer]

Seriously, how the hell did this get through the editorial proses? That whole scene was both racist, sexist and the biggest insult to the readership since One Day More's "escapism is for losers" scene.

Can't comment on the current Thor run because I haven't read it, but I think one of the most insulting things I have ever read in a Marvel book was in the Civil War Frontline tie-in. There was a scene in one of the last issues where one of the reporters tears into Captain America about not getting modern America and it was just... painful to read. Cap just accepts it and basically agrees with her. The reporter goes on a grandstanding tirade about how you're not American if you don't check your Facebook feed and post selfies.

Then again this is from an era when the editorial staff all unanimously agreed that Captain America was a shitty character, so no one was surprised when they pissed on him and subsequently "killed" him.

Oh dear god did I hate that moment. On the bright-side it lead to this gem of a response by a fan who took issue with the My Space question (now don't that just make it dated?)

It's sad though, in Civil War's case there was the potential for a well made and crafted story with no real 'good' or 'bad' side that looked into the very relevant question of freedom vs security, and instead we got a paper-thin black and white morality story where half the heroes are turned into villains, Iron Man became a fascist who was willing to start a war with Atlantis to reunite the heroes, and the villains win the story.

1. THANK YOU. From what I know about the event, (which isn't much) I frigging HATE that event. There's a debate to be had here, yet you got what you got. A superhero army consisting of convicts and slavers?! Are you out of your dang mind?! Are you drunk? Oh wait, a minute, you're Iron Man, of COURSE you're drunk! Gah!

 

[Vault101]

What, that I'm using a derogative nickname that serves as a portmanteau of the words woman and Thor or.

[spoiler/][img/]http://i.imgur.com/qvnyn.gif[/img][/spoiler]

add an E on the end

I HIGHLY doubt you're pronouncing it "who-aarrr" or "wooo"

 

[ArcaneGamer]

Hmm... how is it plot and character wise? I've heard of it, certainly. But all I've heard is that the main cast is all female, and that's too arbitrary to really count as praise in my book. I've always had an issue getting into straight comedic or episodic works. Like I said, Order of the Stick had a slow start for me, and for all the praise I hear for Gunnerkrigg Court, I've never been able to get past the aimless slice-of-life bits. I'm a big fan of having a clear and focused plot, even if it's not always front and center.

...Looking at the TvTropes page isn't filling me with much hope. "Tumblr meets World of Warcraft" is not what I would call a flattering description.

Tumblr huh? well thats an odd descriptor (though I guess it could be fitting in a way)

it is comedic and definitely plays on all the tropes which may or may not work for everyone, probably more plot heavy since it is a print book

for fantasy that plays itself more straight I guess there's Reyn

Locke & Key is more horror than straight fantasy but that was phenomenal (seriously I could go on all day)

Mind if I throw one in there? Gladstone's School for World Conquerors". Imagine Teen Titans for a moment, only it's supervillains, mixed with bits of Harry Potter.(Think of a Hogwarts for villains.) In this world, there is a truce that the heroes and villains of that world came to after something called "The Mayday Massacre"; basically, now the fights between good and evil nowadays are about as real as professional wrestling. But their children don't know this, and think the fights are real. It's an interesting premise, the characters are likable, and the art looks cool.

 

[Vault101]

snip.

so in other words you ARE using its intended meaning

ie: a petulant, misogynistic term used by whiney man-children upset and threatened by women (real or fictional) they don't like

welp...you've told me all I need to know

 

[Aethren]

If the comic genre wants to succeed, it should take a Shonen Jump-style approach, serialize a collection of assorted comics, say, 30, into one massive publication put out weekly. Or, frankly, just give up, it's obvious America's approach failed, just let it die already.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

You seem like a nice person.