Women and 'sensitive' men

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DoW Lowen

Exarch
Jan 11, 2009
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Women I?m sure most of you have encountered this. The guy you know, he is popular among his friends, he is masculine, probably has a bit of a bad boy streak to him and he rarely seems like the sensitive type. But when he is around you or a woman, he is quite the teddy bear. He is open and honest and bares his soul to you. How endearing?

Allow me to shed some light on these types. They are chauvinistic and do not think very much of you, worse off they probably are not aware of it. The god honest truth, and whether a fellow male out there will admittedly stand by me or not ? it?s true.

Men are egocentric, power hungry and seek to be dominant.

Any male who does not exhibit these behaviours in some form or manner is not male, I do not speak in the biological sense, rather from a framework which see?s gender and it?s social expectations and sexual anatomy as separate. To be those qualities is to be a man ? and this is from an evolutionary stand point. Women find door mats to be very unattractive as they could never provide the security and comfort a woman needs. Women like men they can rely on, and the alpha male who is confident, strong and never afraid to be assertive is much more of a viable dating option than the ?nice guy?.

Nice guys finish last. It?s survival of the fittest. Between the brute and the gentlemen, the brute will have a higher chance of surviving and procreating.

But enough about this, I?m sure any woman with some wisdom or experience is well aware of this. As for younger girls, if you?re wondering why you might be attracted to the bad boys, this is why. But this little segment was for my fellow male escapees. I?ve seen my fair share of relationship posts, you guys are really nice even if you can be a bunch of smartasses, but I?m will to wager that for many of you ? you have wondered why even though you?re a nice guy and you?d treat the girl with love and respect she deserves, why does she only consider you a friend and continue to date guys who are VERY unlike you. Just consider what I just said.

Back on topic now with the bad boy with a sensitive soul.

I may just be generalizing and you may probably scream at me saying ?but the guy I know is nothing like you say?. Well you may just be the exception to the rule; either that or you?re just not looking close enough.

The male species are great performers, I mean theatrically not in the dirty sense. They can put up a façade and keep up appearances so well they can fool themselves. They sometimes have a soft smile and a sensitive look that only women can tune into and find. Males will generally not delve into soulful and heart to heart conversations with their fellow males. A lot of them will ? but I?ll get into that later. But with a woman they will open up like a Christmas present, and you women will find this adorable.

The truth is men never want to appear weak in front of other men, including their friends. Which is why men are generally ?rough? with each other. In competitions they will have no inhibitions about crushing their best buddy in the ranking ladder. They?ll never admit it, but almost all well adjusted men think that they are slightly superior to their male friends in some aspect.

But why is it with a woman that they are not afraid to vulnerable. Why is it that when other people will call a man shallow assholes, there is some woman out there other than their mother who will defend them claiming they are ?complicated, misunderstood, more than meets the eye?? It?s simple really, those women can see the vulnerable side the men consciously or unconsciously chooses to show them. Everything I stated leads up to the next statement ?

A lot of men don?t value a woman?s opinion, which is why they are not generally afraid to show them weakness.

Men think that all women are suppose to have a nurturing soft soggy heart, and men will have little reservation vomiting all their thoughts and feelings into them. The same thoughts and feelings they refuse to share with their friends. Because once their friends know, that?s it ? the power politics has shifted in their favour. Men think they have to be stoic which is why their brethren can never know. However if a female is aware of the feelings, the male will seriously not care if that woman?s perception of him changes. Because in all honesty, it?s probably changed for the better. Men think all women are sympathetic, and women think the same thing. Women actually are a lot more sympathetic and nurturing than men. But men believe that means that women will feel affection and pity for almost anything.

All the men reading this, honestly think back when you told a woman something you would never tell your buddies. If her perception of you changed, would you care? If she thought less of you, than you?d probably try to rationalize it in your mind that she is just a ***** and you should never have trusted her. But if she thought you were not as stoic, as strong, as iron willed as you appear to others, would that slow you down for a second? But if a few of your mates thought the same thing could you shrug that off? If she told you she thought you were weak, you would think something along the lines of ?like your opinion matters to me? but if you?re mates said that you?d feel more insecure.

Now for men who have the heart to heart with their buddies. That is probably a true honest moment that you?ve had. More so than compared to when you told the same thing to a woman? Think about it.

What I?m trying to show is that there are very subtle sexisms among most of us; we just may not realize it because they aren?t so clear cut as sexual harassment and oppression. So men, really think twice before you claim you treat men and women the same. Because do you really?

EDIT : When I say masculine types, why do many people here assume I talk about jerks, beef heads, jocks, uncaring assholes? If that's the first thing you think of than perhaps you should examine what your general conceptions of what you consider to masculine and feminine before you're quick to shoot down my argument.
 

Buffoon

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Sep 21, 2008
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Huh. This is one of the best posts I've read on an Internet forum in ages. Well done.

Anyhoo, I am a nice guy, I'm a doormat, I'm a poor specimen of masculinity. I learnt quite some time ago that it's not doing my lovelife any favours. Ah well. That's just me, I'm afraid. I'm all for personal growth but I'm not going to change something that's essential to my character, for better or worse, just to win over the ladies.
 

wewontdie11

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May 28, 2008
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You're making an awful lot of generalisations and great leaps of logic there.

I behave in near enough the same way around both my male groups and female groups of friends (as I'm not currently dating anybody), in fact I'm probably more open and emotional around my male friends because I feel like I don't have to put on as much of a show around them as I do my female friends, where I make a greater concious effort to be more sarcastic, funny and generally confident.

I don't see being a bit emotional in front of my male friends as weakness at all. Maybe you just don't have very good friends but when the time calls for it everybody in my group of mates has had sensitive problems and everybody is always there to talk to them about it and help them through it. We're not a bunch of bro-fisting, nerd punching arrogant jocks you know.

I only value the opinions of those people I truly like regardless of gender.

I pretty much think the total opposite of all of what you just said except for the part about dating.
 

Kiutu

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Sep 27, 2008
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I stopped here "Men are egocentric, power hungry and seek to be dominant."
 

cainx10a

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May 17, 2008
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One of my 'jock' friends did open-up to me. He is a girl magnet, knows how to treat them well and is not afraid to get into a fight when needs be. That's a real man, not your presumption of what a man is.
wewontdie11 said:
You're making an awful lot of generalisations and great leaps of logic there.


I behave in near enough the same way around both my male groups and female groups of friends (as I'm not currently dating anybody), in fact I'm probably more open and emotional around my male friends because I feel like I don't have to put on as much of a show around them as I do my female friends, where I make a greater concious effort to be more sarcastic, funny and generally confident.

I don't see being a bit emotional in front of my male friends as weakness at all. Maybe you just don't have very good friends but when the time calls for it everybody in my group of mates has had sensitive problems and everybody is always there to talk to them about it and help them through it. We're not a bunch of bro-fisting, nerd punching arrogant jocks you know.

I only value the opinions of those people I truly like regardless of gender.

I pretty much think the total opposite of all of what you just said except for the part about dating.
This.
 

high_castle

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Apr 15, 2009
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You make a lot of generalizations. Not every man is as you describe. But yes, if it walks like a jerk, talks like a jerk, and smells like a jerk...it's a jerk. If a guy acts two completely different ways around his friends versus you, you should probably question which--if either--is the genuine personality.
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
Legacy
Jul 18, 2009
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What if you're gay?

Then your whole little theory goes down the drian.
 

RamzaHyral

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Sep 7, 2009
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Whoa. Pretty harsh dude. I don't know how it works for you, but I pretty much act the same no matter who's around. I've never really had a problem opening up to either gender...they're just people. If I were to tell anyone (even a random person walking down the street) something about myself, and that changed the way they valued me as a person, then they could suck it hardcore. Regardless of their downstairs mix-up. And as a side note, I actually value the female opinion MORE than the opinion of my fellow jockstrap wearers. I dunno, maybe I was always too busy living life to worry about 'power politics' and the like...
 

Maze1125

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Oct 14, 2008
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After reading your post, I have come to the following conclusion:
You are a very very sexist person, and you likely made this topic in an attempt to rationalise that sexism by making out that everyone else was sexist too.

Yes, almost everyone is sexist to some extent, but they aren't all sexist in the same way.

Women find door mats to be very unattractive as they could never provide the security and comfort a woman needs. Women like men they can rely on, and the alpha male who is confident, strong and never afraid to be assertive is much more of a viable dating option than the 'nice guy'.
I wanted to respond to this bit in particular, because it is a misconception that many hold.
In general, women lust after the alpha male, but love the nice-guy.
Why? Because the nice-guy is far far more likely to look after any children that have been born, but equally, a child is far more likely to survive it they have strong genes. So, evolutionarily speaking, the best thing to do is have sex with the tough-guy but be in a relationship with the nice-guy.

This means it very much looks like nice-guys finish last around dating age, but ultimately, nice-guys are going to end up having a lot more meaningful sex than the tough-guys.
 

Kpt._Rob

Travelling Mushishi
Apr 22, 2009
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A general rule of any science, but of Psychology in particular, is that one ought not to make bold blanket assumptions. Next time, you might be wise to stop for a second and ask yourself "Is that really how it is, or is that just how I've convinced myself it is?"
 

Arcticflame

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Nov 7, 2006
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I read that post, and can honestly not identify with any of it.

I'm not a particularly masculine guy, but I'm not feminine in any way either, but barely any of it applies to me.
 

Destal

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Jul 8, 2009
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I suppose next you'll imply that there is a subtle racism amongst everyone?

You're entire post is one generalazation after another, and each one seems more wrong than the last. I was a jock in high school and I'm in the military, however, I would also be considered a "nice" to everyone who meets me. I'm married with two kids now. If you can't speak openly and honestly with your significant other, you're with the wrong person. A lot of men will speak openly with their significant other because that is what the relationship is based off of, why would you not share everything, good and bad, with the person you love the most?
 

gh0ti

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Apr 10, 2008
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Hmmm. Very well written and quite persuasive, but as others have said, generalisations abound.

Girls are attracted to successful men - and not all successful men are asses. They intuitively seek out males who can provide for them, or at least not take any caring after beyond their supposed emotional 'problems'. This doesn't mean being a jerk, but combining being fun-loving as well as hard-working. My friends that have the greatest strike rate when it comes to women are not get-out-of-my-way, self-centred pricks. They're the easy-to-like types with the best jobs.

Being a 'nice guy' doesn't equate to being a doormat. A doormat is a person who goes out of their way, routinely sacrificing their own happiness for the happiness of others. A nice guy gains happiness by making other people happy. He does it more sparingly, more targetted. He weighs up whether helping his friend (or prospective girlfriend) out is more important to them than it is off-putting to him. Being a jerk might get you laid once in a while, but only a small percentage of women stay with jerks in the long run.

"Men are egocentric, power hungry and seek to be dominant."

And if you believe this, then I think it is you who is being chauvinistic. Women exhibit these characteristics as well. Part of the reason they seek out strong men because they like showing their own power among their peers; the, "I attracted the best husband" complex.

Despite that, I do agree with your main point. We are all a little sexist. We recognise (or expect) that heterosexual men will treat women differently than they treat other men, because we want different things from them. From male friends we want loyalty, camaraderie, jokes and good times. From women we want sex (well duh!), companionship, emotional support. Think about it, we treat old people different from young people, young people different from children - because we have different expectations and different objectives from those relationships. Why should the great dividing line of gender, that separates and guides our lives from birth, be any different?

EDIT: Of course, that's not to say we want sex and all that jazz from all our female friends. Just the ones we're attracted to.
 

Nmil-ek

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Dec 16, 2008
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Im sorry your points seem unabashedly biased towards the point that you feel all men are made of the same mould or fit the same personality/sterotype. Everyone puts on a fascade in everyday life the way we are outside of our social circles/at work/with our loved ones even is rarley who we really are its just as easy to judge women by the same flawed criteria I am not the same guy I am when I'm tossing insults or having a laugh with mates deep down.

And I really hate this nice guys finish last argument, bollock s I say what justifys a nice guy manners? Friendliness? Kindness? Charity? Alot of people have these traits in one way or another some are jsut far less apparent than others, I think I'm a nice enough guy as fallable as anyone else but I try but finish last? Hell no whos the judge of that? Being nice means I underperform, means I cant be selfish, petty, steal, lie to get ahead? No if anything I would glady do more of those things to keep the ones I love in a good position.
 

DiamondJim

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Sep 27, 2008
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Baseless rant is baseless.

All of that is one, giant, assuming generalization. So much of people's social interactions depend on personalities. What you just put down is basically how old school Hollywood would have you view it. I dunno what kind of friends you have, but I'm fine acting the same way around either genders. It hasn't affected my love life adversely, and doesn't skew my friends view too greatly.

This is not to say there aren't people like that, though. I've met plenty of assholes in my day that love to pose for their girls like they really care. Trust me. But saying that all men are like that is just a load of bullshit, frankly. I take my all of my friend's advice and opinions with equal care. Why?

Because they're my friends. I wouldn't care so much otherwise.
 

Jirlond

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Jul 9, 2009
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Yeah if you can't get a woman without being a dick then it's your fault for not being interesting enough.

I admit that now and again I sporadically become annoying with any lady friend I am involved with to keep things interesting, but my charm keeps me out of major trouble.
 

Craig FTW

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Mar 25, 2009
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Wow it sounds like you had some bad experience with something like this..

..Prompting you to generalize every man in the world.

What's wrong with nice guys? They get girls in different ways than the tough guy. Tough guys are just there for women to lust after, but actual good guys are there for the long haul. Guys can act different towards women than how they act with their guy friends. Although if it's drastic, that could be a problem. They show affection differently, which is normal.

I'm not terribly masculine, I don't play sports and stuff, but I have a lot of guy friends and a lot of girl friends and I can talk to women easily(usually)
I don't know if I'm truly femenine, but being an 'emo' in a jock's eyes makes me femenine I guess.
Also I contemplate whether I'm bi or not frequently.
 

Gurppa

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Jul 22, 2009
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high_castle said:
You make a lot of generalizations. Not every man is as you describe. But yes, if it walks like a jerk, talks like a jerk, and smells like a jerk...it's a jerk. If a guy acts two completely different ways around his friends versus you, you should probably question which--if either--is the genuine personality.
+1
And besides... Personally, I don't treat all my friends the same ways, doesn't matter if they're female or male. You don't go talk about how much you love meat with a vegetarian, do you? (just an example)

But it's natural that your friendship is different with a male than with a female. But how about females? From my experience females also rely on the opposite sex when dealing with problems (often/mostly). I'm not sure why it is like this though. So it's not so simple as you say....