good to see someone does at least, however I'm not faithful enough in mass effect fans as a whole to believe that.DoPo said:
You people are ridiculous
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I simply eat burgers without cheese anyway, thus I can feel smugly superior while I save money.
This also applies for DLC I suppose.
This also applies for DLC I suppose.
Oh god, no. I assumed Mass Effect fans would be reasonable, then I took an...Internet...to the eyes. OK, I'll stop now. Anyway, until I saw some actual ME fans I didn't think much of them. But some actually claim that ME's story is somehow superior to, I don't know "everything" or "mostly everything" else. Or something along those lines. I'm not saying the story is bad but, really, "superior"? I would classify it as decent (I might be undervaluing it but not by a lot). The gameplay is also nice. So all in all, the ME games were worth the money I paid. And I got the first one for £2.50. ME1 and 2 were around £10-£12 in total. There is no way I'm paying full price for the third one. I'd like a conclusion (inb4 endings are blah-blah) but I don't value the story that high. And the DLC doesn't give me anything I require.him over there said:
Also, get this, the some ME fans claim that the DLC is crucial to the whole plot. And you can't have the game without the DLC. I can just play it without to prove a point, if I wish.
So, you believe that a lot of people - voice actors, animators, story writers, developers and so on, come together put a year and whatever much it took to make the game, than sit there and wait to get money from people buying it? Maybe they can only afford food thanks to the preorders.Matthew94 said:
That's not how it works, is what I'm trying to say. If you work a job and you do something extra - overtime or something, or take an additional responsibility, do you not expect to be paid more? In your words - not, because your customers couldn't care less if you did extra work or not.
The cheese is not worth 99c. I don't want to buy food that is trying to rip me off in that fashion when it's not worth it.
I am going to wait until I get a McDonald's voucher, where it will be worth my money. But guys don't complain about it if you're going to buy it anyway!
I am going to wait until I get a McDonald's voucher, where it will be worth my money. But guys don't complain about it if you're going to buy it anyway!
Yeah, it kind of ceases to be "downloadable content" when you aren't actually downloading everything, but that's actually rather pedantic when you look at the heart of the problem.OhJohnNo said:
Still, I can't help but feel that I'm getting screwed when I realize the data I'm paying for is already there on the disc, and that the cost of "hosting/distributing" it was technically already paid for (by me).
*On topic:*
After discussion with more level-headed individuals (you know who you are, and thank you), I'm going to posit that this is simply economics in action.
Mass Effect 1 was a hit, EA noticed the increased demand, they hiked prices for the full experience. Cue that Cerberus Code/Network nonsense. People bought it. It was a success. Cue even MORE Day 1 DLC for ME3. Of course, since it's a price hike, some people are calling EA out on it.
Please keep in mind THAT THIS WOULD HAPPEN EVEN IF THE DEVELOPMENT BUDGET BETWEEN ME1 AND ME2+ME3 STAYED EXACTLY THE SAME*. Increased Demand? Well, even though Supply isn't limited here, the fact that Demand is higher means that Demand is more willing to pay more for the same thing.
This happens for a variety of reasons. (Popularity and inclusion foremost. Assurance of quality amidst mediocrity, or at least the perception thereof...hype is a very powerful marketing force that can cause prices to rise via the logic of a Network Good. It also helps that most of the market STILL perceives games as products instead of services.)
Fact is: EA is going to continue gradually hiking prices in such a manner until it blows up in their face.
In short: Yeah, gamers are getting exploited, yet enough gamers enable it anyway despite the grumbling. Look at their competition, be more frugal if you want better deals. That's all the advice I can provide there.
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To address the "controversy" of the subject more directly:
Well, the complaints about Day 1 DLC are expected; Customers don't like higher prices in general. No shit, right?
However, complaining about it is ultimately futile.
Why? Because the new standard has been set, loathe as I am to admit it.
The fact that a lot of other people are causing this to happen against my wishes (and the wishes of many others) is the source of great animosity, (as all the recent DLC hate topics may testify) because logically, we who don't support this sort of DLC have nobody else to blame for its rise in popularity, and the subsequent rise in effective costs.
It causes backlash.
Hell, this topic is a backlash to THAT backlash.
Personally, I'm tired of all the people throwing around the word "Entitled" as a cop-out argument, since it makes no sense when you look at the truth of the matter.
No, really. Before you reply to disprove me in your furious, zealous fervor, just stop and think for a minute about what you're actually arguing here.
What makes a Supplier's "Greed" different or "more justified" than Demand's "entitlement"?
Nothing. The argument is pure raging, hyperbolic nonsense FROM EITHER SIDE (this is why I say the complaints are futile).
In fact, economics RELIES on the presence of these two forces to work, to find/approach the marginal cost, and to crash when one side takes too much from the other.
Unless our social behavior changes radically to be less self-centric in general (not happening), that is what we're stuck with in a free market.
You say the cost of DLC is justified because YOU think it's worth the money and everyone else who disagrees is acting childish?
That argument is 100% subjective, not definitive. Not fact. We all occupy different parts of the Demand curve. Some are more willing to pay than others, for whatever the reason.
So telling people to "Shut the fuck up" over it (or any other such argument) is no less presumptuous or childish, no matter how irritating the deluge of topics on the subject has become. You are sinking to their level when you argue that.
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Good fucking grief I miss the days when topics on these forums were more civil...even if just a little.
Personally, I think it has less to do with "rising development costs" since Bioware is paid the same no matter what up to launch (which includes development of Day 1 DLC, despite being done in effective overtime). That's how studio contracts work in general, and it's something of a point of controversy among developers because it enables legal loop holes in labor laws (which EA loves, and has been sued for before), though that strays a bit too far off topic here.
I don't mean to exclude rising fixed costs for development entirely (which has been a HUGE topic in itself over the years, though I feel as though the costs have plateaued with the limitations of current console hardware being reached), but in this case it's fair to call it a Red Herring, given the enormous financial success of Mass Effect 1 in spite of its LACK of Day 1 DLC.
I don't mean to exclude rising fixed costs for development entirely (which has been a HUGE topic in itself over the years, though I feel as though the costs have plateaued with the limitations of current console hardware being reached), but in this case it's fair to call it a Red Herring, given the enormous financial success of Mass Effect 1 in spite of its LACK of Day 1 DLC.
Blah, is Gaming Discussion so flooded with Mass Effect that the dam broke and it's now leaking into Off-Topic? Come on, guys, I don't want to talk about Mass Effect butthurt anymore, that's why I'm in Off-Topic.
I do think that picture is a little unfair - it's not as if all, or even most, games companies are doing that. And even in this case, it's not in a big way.Matthew94 said:
For a lot of games, DLC more takes the form of expansion packs. Mass Effect 2 had plenty of DLC like this (Lair of the Shadow Broker, most notably). Most multiplayer shooter map packs fit the category, too, for all the flak they get.
Pulling it, back, calm down.Micalas said:
Sorry. I snapped. Look. You are WRONG. You do not OWN those files. They are not yours. They are subject to a license. You did not pay for ALL of the content on the disc, you paid for part of it. Some of the content is subject to a separate license which you must agree to and pay for.
