A rant on PC fanboyism

[Tohuvabohu]

PC gamers get shitty console ports and complain about that. They actually have a reason.

And why is that, do you think?

Is it because consoles are shitty? No, actually, they are not. Not any more. They are powerful machines, with processing power well above the price point.

Have you possibly considered that the higher the system requirements, the more expensive a game is to create? And that it is much.. MUCH cheaper to create games with the expectation of a lower system requirement, because the majority of people buying the game for PC won't ever use the higher system specs? It's literally a waste of money that raises prices for no gain to the average consumer?

There are games that leverage the PC's strengths... sometimes a game is better with over a hundred buttons (MMOs, RTSs) and sometimes it's a lot cheaper to release a game with low cost with no middleman (Indy games I'm looking at you) but when you want to go Triple A... well... computers are just not the best platform for how much the company gets per dollar spent.

In an era where game development is getting more and more expensive, and PC gamers are demanding more and more shineys because of the money they put into their systems... maybe companies simply can't afford to focus on them any more. There just isn't enough money in it to justify making PC games their top priority.

There's many facets to the problem and rampant hat of consoles OR PCs doesn't help PC gamers get what they want.

But yes, a lot of it is entitlement... PC gamers feel entitled to games of quality the money they pay does not support. That's a reality that has nothing to do with consoles... be glad they have consoles to make their money from and make games at all.

Personally speaking, and I think I'm entirely reasonable when I say this; I don't want "shiney gfx" from a console port. What I want from a console port, is for it not to run like shit, and by extension, control like shit.

I think most PC gamers would agree with that. I dunno about "entitlement", but wouldn't you be extra pissed off when you buy a game that should run exceptionally well based on the listed hardware requirements, only to find out that it runs like complete ass no matter what you do? And there's almost a complete lack of video options or .ini's to try and tweak the game to run well on a system it should already run well to begin with. Wouldn't that rightfully piss you off too?

 

[scw55]

I actaully prefer playing action RPGs with a console gaming pad.
Turn based and Real time strategy I prefer on the PC.
Simulation I prefer on the PC.
FPSs on the PC.

I don't get any form of dispute between the two gaming system camps. Both systems are better at different things. Can't we leave it like that?

No, because people always enjoy poking the hornet's nest.

 

[Atmos Duality]

ATTENTION ALL FELLOW PC GAMERS: If you do not like the dumbing down of PC games, do not play the ones the get dumbed down.

Doesn't fix the problem; not while consoles remain the dominant market.
If the publishers know that they can make a big pile of money with console games, then they will make console games. Period.
PC gamers ignoring ports would indeed reduce the number of shitty port-games on PC...because the publishers would simply ignore PC as a platform entirely.

No, the only way to stop this dumbing-down of games is to make PC gaming look like the better market option, and that simply cannot happen while consoles remain as popular as they do.

This is why it's not unreasonable to suggest that PC gaming has lost, at least compared to consoles. It's certainly not going to die as a platform entirely though; that's just stupid.

 

[Treblaine]

I will reply to the post quote-boxed below because you have been markedly more mature and respectful, unlike your last posts that included you resorting to, well, this:

"Put forth why people want 'dumbing down.' You'll notice the phrase itself is loaded with 'I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND THEY SHOULD ONLY LISTEN TO ME BAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW' connotations that do not help your case. Grow the fuck up, and present your argument like a man, not like a simpering fop."

...

Do you think that is acceptable?

It is a fact that PC is better than consoles.

Better is and always will be subjective so to say as a fact that one is better than the other is nothing but crap.

However it is fanboyism to say that makes it better for everyone as a lot of people are just too casual to appreciate it or master it.

You really think that the only reason people would prefer consoles to PC is that they aren't hardcore enough? What a load of condescending horseshit. That remark truly is the mark of a deluded fanboy.

No it really is a fact. Here is a short list of facts:
-Graphical power= better on PC, look at the benchmarks
-Controls= US military and law-enforcement virtual training programs have determined Mouse + keyboard are better than ANY other input device for aiming and movement in first/third person perspective
-Customisation= undeniably better on PC
-Online= dedicated servers are STANDARD on PC, anything less NOT ACCEPTED.
-Mods= you cannot mod 360/PS3 without being banned
-Games Price= steam sales? There are no better deals in the industry.

The dealing-with-bullshit factor is zero on consoles and huge on PCs.

Running a good console system requires hooking up an HDMI cable to the tv, and plugging it, and syncing a controller. Done.

Running a good computer system requires doing those things, then making sure your system is secure, keeping that maintained, dealing with manufacturers that may or may not have proper drivers, and software publishers that may, or may not, have your hardware configuration in question...

It's called the 'dealing with bullshit' factor. PCs have bullshit you HAVE to deal with. Consoles do not.

Remember that the next time you join a 'hate on DRM' thread. You're dealing with bullshit.

And some people have no patience for the bullshit.

All those facts (that you edited out, I edited back in) still stand and make PC games so superior to console games.

Does the make ME superior? No. But the games are.

Now, I don't know what if any experience you have with PC gaming but my experience - mainly with Steam - has have not had the bullshit to the extent you describe. Not a fraction. Steamworks is a breeze and YES it is DRM, but on balance I'd rather have this lightweight DRM than the DRM that games consoles use.

Yes games consoles have DRM. That is the reason Xbox 360 DVD discs only have 6.5GB capacity, the missing 2GB is DRM anti-piracy coding. Console have the most onerous DRM in the industry, the little there is on PC is not half as bad as on consoles that absolutely prescribe how I am allowed to play games, even what networks I can play them on.

And for the few broken ports to PC - if the game REALLY is unplayable after truly exhausting all patches, drivers and tweaks, well that is not a reason to completely give up on ALL THE OTHER PC games that work perfectly.

Spoiler: And I'm sorry, but my PS3 and 360 have given me a lot of bullshit:

-360 = chews discs like billyo
-360 = one component breaks, need whole new machine (my model doesn't get extended warranty)
-360 = charges for online multiplayer with no guarantee of slot on dedicated server...
-360 = need to buy overpriced wifi adapter or drill holes for ethernet to even connect online
-360 = all the trolls and cheaters on Xbox Live. Where are the admins to moderate this?
-360 = woeful backup capability, a 16GB formatted drive? Microsoft is trolling.
-PS3 = Any aspect ratio outside 16:9 it crops or distorts
-PS3 = Month-long downtimes where my details get stolen
-PS3 = such lengthy and onerous updates before I can even even connect online

But you can buy you way out of most of these problems. The thing is abandoning PC gives up even the hope of a high standard, that's what I have patience for because I really want it. I refuse to accept compromise.

I want the best and most of the time it is attainable.

I just think you had some frustrating experiences on PC and have let it get the better of you, you have become so afraid of that frustration you are willing to give up the high standard that you know only PC can offer.

You've given up on your dreams.

I ain't going to give up. I won't lie to you, I have had some bad experiences getting some PC games to run, but I have had so many AMAZING experiences with PC I will not let that minority put me off.

 

[Noceus]

I don't really hate console, but it's still the console's fault that graphics in gaming haven't advanced as much as they could. Since games make more money on console, so it's not really a financialy good idea for a company to make a pc exclusive title these day's.

 

[devotedsniper]

Well i went over to PC gaming a few years ago after doing nothing but console gaming, can't say i really miss the 360 doesn't mean i hate it, it's just what does the 360 offer that my pc can't do? My PC back then cost me the same to build as to buy a 360 (other than the monitor which would push it over if i didnt already have one), and that could play everything at maximum at the time, so price point isn't much of an advantage if you work to a budget (since i'm now more serious my hardware has been upgraded several times but thats mainly to cope with building my programming code in visual studio rather than gaming).

Point is the only thing better about the consoles in my opinion is developers usually build games for them and then cheaply port the game to the PC which then comes with terrible support, an example would be Saints Row 2, a great game itself but a very very bad port having performance issues even on the highest spec machines due to poor porting by a third party the developer hired, this sort of thing is one of a few reasons which make us the PC gamers angry. If developers were to do ports properly (Fable 3 is a great example of this, that ran perfectly for me, only not to the same timetable F3 took), then there would be alot less of this console vs PC going on, and to be honest surely developers should feel the need to portray their game as best they can across all the platforms rather than Consoles getting better optimized versions than PC (and on the rare occasion the other way round), i know i'd be alot more willing to part with my cash if games were developed with both console and pc in mind rather than just porting the pc at the end.

Also the "dumbing down for consoles" does happen it's just everyone on the console gets blamed when really it's companies like EA which decide they want to open their games to a wider audience, and while this is fine in itself they have to make money afterall, the game usually gets "dumbed down" in hopes that the game will be brought by those who don't play that genre of game or for the so called "casual gamers" (if you want an example think back a few month with all the hate threads for Dragon Age 2). As for the controls well i'd say both are equal while yes you can have macro's set up (i've never bothered with the 18 keys i can assign them to, other than on Final Fantasy 11) and such on the PC, when it comes to standard controls there both equal really (other than the mouse being alot better for FPS's than an analogue stick, but the analogue beats keyboard for driving), i still use a 360 pad when it comes to some games, it just depends on the game really.

Oh and if anyone says the focusing on consoles is due to pirates, really? yeah it might be easier on PC (which is why everyone blames the PC) but i'm fairly certain theres gonna be just as many console pirates out there, there might be less evidence of it but the one thing you have to remember is that when someone gets a console chipped they usually have a friend or a friend of a friend do it, this person then becomes their dealer if you will selling them copied games for a couple of quid. Also something else you need to realise is while yes the console can be bricked by chipping it then going online with the console thats down to that users own fault really, it's a similar situation if a PC gamer does so with pirated game they just get banned instead, the only time a pirated game is ever playable online is if it has lan capabilites then it can be run through software such as Hamachi.

Summary, both have there advantages and disadvantages lets just leave it there, and say haters gonna hate no matter what.

 

[Assassin Xaero]

i cant think of any advantage a console has over a pc.

You don't have to worry about system requirements. Plus I think that driving games, platformers (especially 3D third person ones), and sport games are a lot better on consoles, control wise.

 

[Nobby]

snip

Exactly right. Why should PC gamers be expected to put up with/ fix with mods shoddy ports that use strangely mapped controls, incredibly poor optimization and in a few cases not even fully replacing the references to console controls in tutorials etc.

If I purchase a product it should perform as advertised. I'm not asking for more than consoles get, merely the same treatment. A few extra days spent polishing a product up to the standard of it's console counterparts isn't going to send developers into bankruptcy.

 

[Leviathan_]

I'm an ex-console gamer who switched over to PC's, best decision of my life. I love ripping on console gamers as a consolation (no pun intended) for shit like this.



I consider PC's superior as they are my platform of choice after all.


EDIT: stop victimizing yourself and just deal with it dude.

 

[Treblaine]

(1)PC gamers ignoring ports would indeed reduce the number of shitty port-games on PC...because the publishers would simply ignore PC as a platform entirely.

(2) No, the only way to stop this dumbing-down of games is to make PC gaming look like the better market option, and that simply cannot happen while consoles remain as popular as they do.

This is why it's not unreasonable to suggest that PC gaming has lost, at least compared to consoles. It's certainly not going to die as a platform entirely though; that's just stupid.

(1) that's probably what happened with GTA4 belated poor-quality port to PC... that no one bought (except me... and speedrunners). Now Red Dead Redemption doesn't seem it will ever get a PC port nor either for LA Noire. Shame.

(2) PC gaming is becoming increasingly appealing from a combination of factors:
-Steam is showing huge market success
-extended console generations mean PC is main recourse for better graphics
-Laptops (the preferred PC) graphics are approaching to be more powerful than home consoles
-scourge of pre-owned market

 

[Dys]

there was stuff here

You're complaining about PC gamers elitism yet, at the same time, linking obvious troll threads :S Using loaded words like 'fanboyism' and implying that flat out insulting those with whose opinions you disagree with is a sure way to get the angry blokes sitting on the other side of the fence to list a tediously long list of reasons why they're right.

Basically, what you're complaining about is a demographic of gamers being entirely convinced that they're platform is better, and further, that the quality of titles on their platforms is shifting downward due to the popularity (and associated focus) on other platforms. You seem to think that the 'blame' (if such a thing even exists in this context) lays on the developers, who release a product but somehow those who demand that such a product be released are somehow uninvolved. That's not the case, if Ford decide to make a incredibility stupid 'soft roaders' rather than sensible, fuel efficient family sedans[footnote]Clearly, I have no strong opinion one way or the other in this example.[/footnote] that is a response to consumer demand, and as such, the people who buy the stupid, intolerable product are as much to blame (if not more than) Ford motor company who are simply a business trying to turn a profit. It's exactly the same with computer vs console games (but consoles don't crush children, dangerously obstruct the views of other product users, destroy the environment, promise to cure SPS[footnote]small penis syndrome.[/footnote] and so on, they attract developers away from the windows based platform).

I won't say I speak for all PC gamers, but I will assume that I speak for most 'informed' people: It is infuriating when people are wrong, and the people who are passionate about their side of the argument (in this case PS3, xbox 360 or PC[footnote]For some reason everyone hates the wii[/footnote]) generally make things up. This kind of invitation for comparison gives people an excuse to voice their stupid, not researched at all and flat our wrong opinions (eg Computers are more expensive than consoles, PSN is unplayably laggy, using chat on xbox live will give you ear cancer etc).

Anyone who has been on this gaming forum longer for longer than 5 minutes is sick of it, a loaded rant only serves to make it worse. If you think you're annoyed by computer gamers acting better than you, stop and think for a moment how annoyed PC gamers must be by console gamers constantly bitching about how arrogant their gaming, elitist and generally 'holier than thou' gaming brethren are. Console gamers are not the proletarian being ruled by the bourgeoisie PC gamers, if some asshole says he's better than you for using a different platform, ignore the dumb ass and move on, don't invite more of it by whining...It's not hard.

-Laptops (the preferred PC) graphics are approaching to be more powerful than home consoles

Mid-high range laptops have been considerably more powerful than any of the current consoles for some time. Even the notoriously underpowered premium brands (that I"m strategically not naming ) are significantly more powerful than current gen consoles in all but their entry level models. That said, decently powerful laptops are still nowhere near as cheap (from what I've seen in Australia) as the consoles

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

(1) that's probably what happened with GTA4 belated poor-quality port to PC... that no one bought (except me... and speedrunners). Now Red Dead Redemption doesn't seem it will ever get a PC port nor either for LA Noire. Shame.

Heh... After the right royal buggering Take Two has had this year they might think about pressuring Rockstar to show the PC some love and scare up some sales.

 

[GoddyofAus]

"console gamers were constantly blaming PC gamers for more complicated games or the PCification of console games "

This doesn't happen. It doesn't make sense for it to happen.

I don't blame Console gamers for the dumbing down of PC games. I blame the developer.

HOWEVER.

It is, after all, the Console gamers who are funding it, and Devs will do whatever gets them funding. If half of all the console gamers switched over to PC gaming, the so-called "dumbing down" of PC games would not be taking place.

To tell the truth though, this is not a recent development. It has been happening for a looong time. The PC game market always appears to be dying, and people are looking for a scapegoat.

You criticize gamers for choosing an option that best suits them FINANCIALLY? I would be the first to say that the average PC gamer that considers themselves a "master race" gained that idea of elitism from the very fact that they are actually rich enough to afford it.

 

[Pyro Paul]

As for the "dumbing down" of PC games for the console crowd, who do you think does the dumbing down in the first place? Developers. That's who you should blame.

trying to shift blame to some one else and twist logic around simply doesn't work.

why are developers dumbing down games for consoles?
1- Because there are more people asking for console games then PC games.
2- Because the larger console community is actively demanding simplified games.

like it or not, it IS your fault...

 

[linwolf]

i cant think of any advantage a console has over a pc.

You don't have to worry about system requirements. Plus I think that driving games, platformers (especially 3D third person ones), and sport games are a lot better on consoles, control wise.

System requirements isn't really a draw back it just mean that games gets better all the time instead of in jumps, for that reason I consider it a strength.
And today most games support gamepads on the PC making the second point irrelevant.

 

[rapidoud]

Obviously the majority of PC gamers here work at many dev studios.

After all, you must have insider information if you know that PC is the lead platform, or console, or both, otherwise you wouldn't comment about multi-platform games.

This smug eliteness 'oh we get dumbed down things oh our games are so much better it's not your fault it's the devs you're all just too stupid to know any better' annoying the shit out of me.

 

[linwolf]

As for the "dumbing down" of PC games for the console crowd, who do you think does the dumbing down in the first place? Developers. That's who you should blame.

trying to shift blame to some one else and twist logic around simply doesn't work.

why are developers dumbing down games for consoles?
1- Because there are more people asking for console games then PC games.
2- Because the larger console community is actively demanding simplified games.

like it or not, it IS your fault...

It really isn't, the people I know that are console gamers are just as annoyed about the simplifying as I am.

 

[Gorilla Gunk]

A couple things I don't like about PC gamers:

-When someone makes a thread asking if they should buy an 360 or PS3 or a game on 360 or PS3 saying they can only afford one there's always a **** or two who responds with "PC." Oh I'm so sorry that wasn't one of the choices, you lose.

-That weird sense of entitlement some PC gamers have with certain developers and titles. "No this is OUR game! You can't have it!" Or when they freak out on a developer for making a console port of a previously PC-exclusive title of theirs. "No you can't do this! We made you!" And don't get me started on those twats who are constantly going on about how FPS's "don't belong" on consoles.

-Oh you can land hundreds of head shots with your mouse eh? Good for you! I can also land hundreds of head shots, only I use a controller. Oh what's that you say? You played a console FPS once for 15 minutes and your aim sucked? Well aiming with a console requires a bit more skill than using a mouse where you can just point and click and takes a bit of time and practice to get good with it so I have no idea why your aim wasn't perfect the first and only time you used a controller. It must have been broken because there's no way it could have been your fault.

-Hey I can build an awesome PC that can play Crysis for just $500? Neat-o! Just one problem: I have less then that in my bank account and I need that money to pay for bills 'n' shit and unless I start making $15 an hour working 30+ hour weeks, it's going to stay that way. And before you say "Well you paid THOUSANDS for your consoles!" I bought both of them for under $200 years apart and I pretty much live off of $20 clearance games. I would love to have a good gaming PC because there are a ton of PC-exclusive games I'd like to play but I just can't afford it, which is something a lot of PC gamers have a really, really, really hard time accepting.

 

[Leviathan_]

"console gamers were constantly blaming PC gamers for more complicated games or the PCification of console games "

This doesn't happen. It doesn't make sense for it to happen.

I don't blame Console gamers for the dumbing down of PC games. I blame the developer.

HOWEVER.

It is, after all, the Console gamers who are funding it, and Devs will do whatever gets them funding. If half of all the console gamers switched over to PC gaming, the so-called "dumbing down" of PC games would not be taking place.

To tell the truth though, this is not a recent development. It has been happening for a looong time. The PC game market always appears to be dying, and people are looking for a scapegoat.

You criticize gamers for choosing an option that best suits them FINANCIALLY? I would be the first to say that the average PC gamer that considers themselves a "master race" gained that idea of elitism from the very fact that they are actually rich enough to afford it.

Console games are expensive as fuck though. So if you really thought about the cost, you could build yourself a decent rig and play games that don't require a good graph card and play games that cost 0-30 Euro

Consoles breed graphic elitism as every PS3 and Xbox 360 has the same power, meaning that console devs will do everything they can to utilize that power with nice looking graphics. PC devs have to think about the crowd that don't have as good as a PC and create games that don't completely focus on graphs, meaning that a larger budget can be spent on other aspects of the game.