You forget socializing or relaxation. Going to a range and running through a couple hundred rounds with a friend is fun. All we usually do is punch holes in paper. Nowhere in there were we using the gun to murder someone, scare off a criminal, or hunting for food. We were enjoying the company of a friend and relaxing.Booze Zombie said:
An Armed Society is a Polite Society (?)
- Thread starter DiamondJim
- Start date
Recommended Videos
Murder rates in the USA are higher than in the UK, however all other violent crimes are higher in the UK. I live in the UK and personally I wish I could own a gun legally.
I really love the USA because gun legilisation makes everyone equal and makes the country a fair place to live in some respect, people have the power to kill your or badly injure you yes, but you have the power to do the same to them. In the UK if some 6'4 bloke built like a brick wall wants your wallet, you give it to him, he then punches you in the face breaking your jaw, you tell the police and they do fuck all about it. In the USA if a 6'4 man wants your wallet, you give him a bullet. Some might use the counter-arguement here that he too could have a gun, but myself and a gun against a 6'4 meathead and a gun is a much more fair fight than myself against a 6'4 meathead.
Most of the violent crime in the UK is little gobshites who do it because they know they can get away with it, I guarente if they didn't know who was packing a 9 and who wasn't they wouldn't kick-off at random passers by. The people who are responsible for most of the vioelnt crime in the UK don't want to kill people or be put in any danger, they just want to look hard.
So yea, I'm all for the right to bear arms, and this is coming from someone living in England.
I really love the USA because gun legilisation makes everyone equal and makes the country a fair place to live in some respect, people have the power to kill your or badly injure you yes, but you have the power to do the same to them. In the UK if some 6'4 bloke built like a brick wall wants your wallet, you give it to him, he then punches you in the face breaking your jaw, you tell the police and they do fuck all about it. In the USA if a 6'4 man wants your wallet, you give him a bullet. Some might use the counter-arguement here that he too could have a gun, but myself and a gun against a 6'4 meathead and a gun is a much more fair fight than myself against a 6'4 meathead.
Most of the violent crime in the UK is little gobshites who do it because they know they can get away with it, I guarente if they didn't know who was packing a 9 and who wasn't they wouldn't kick-off at random passers by. The people who are responsible for most of the vioelnt crime in the UK don't want to kill people or be put in any danger, they just want to look hard.
So yea, I'm all for the right to bear arms, and this is coming from someone living in England.
So, one guy murders a rapist and you think everyone else is justified to shoot someone who's just half-inching an easily replaceable item?CapnGod said:
"Stop, I'll MURDER you (in self-defence) if you take that 90 dollar television (which is insured)."
Not everyone who breaks into your house wants to kill you. In fact, it's bad business to kill people. How can you work if you've got the cops trailing you for a murder?
You're worried about psychopaths, not career criminals.
So, what you're saying is... you use guns the same way as drugs or beer? Doesn't that mean you could just not spend money on guns and ammo and just instead get drunk or stoned?CapnGod said:
So, should I request a CV or a resume if someone breaks in to my house? I'm sorry, sir, are you here to merely rob me of valuables or are you here for a more nefarious purpose? I'm not saying that I'm necessarily going to shoot someone, but in the case that someone is in my house, well, that's a risk THEY have taken. But, I do give fair warning. My shotgun has nothing in the chamber. It's a Remington 870, and happens to have an amazing deterrent... the sound of a shell racking in to the chamber. I'd rather not shoot someone, and will give ample opportunity to scare them off. Same reason my Sig doesn't have anything in the chamber around the house.Booze Zombie said:
As far as the relaxation goes, I can go to the range with a friend, practice a skill, and then drive home. I don't have to worry about impaired judgment while driving. Now, don't get me wrong, I love to go out and have a beer, but it's another form of relaxation. I thought you'd realize that. Apparently I'd hoped for too much. Also, getting stoned is illegal. Not to mention that I just don't enjoy it, and haven't since I was young and stupid. So, I show that guns have another use besides murder, defense, or hunting, and you mistake the intent and suggest that I break the law or risk breaking the law. Sure thing.
By equipment I mean not just armour and weapons but all the radios and communication equipment meaning they can fight as a coordinated unit rather than a unguided mob. Also, I'm sure the SWAT situation you mentioned would be different if the SWAT team are just there to massacre the villain, rather than disarm and arrest him.Sane Man said:
The comparison with Afghanistan is a bit blurry too because they have the advantage of living in the area that the US and UK troops invaded, our troops had no idea of the culture, types of housing, what people are saying, etc
But US troops in the US would be a different story, they understand what people on the street would be saying, they would know the general layout of what an average house / hospital / shopping mall, etc would be like.
Still this is all a thought experiment, nothing of the sort would realistically happen in this day and age.
99% of the police in the UK are armed with only CS spray and a telescopic baton. There are some ideas for tasers to be introduced, but that's a fair time away. CO19 are armed with machine guns and pistols but they are only there to respond to firearms situations, which are quite rare outside of the very big cities like London and Manchester.CapnGod said:
You mean something like this? [http://resources.bplondon.org/images/antiinspiration/peace-through-superior-firepower.jpg]
I'm going to be quite contraversial here and say, what about the homeless heroin addict who is stuck in their situation. They need the money for food and for drugs, they don't want to hurt you they just want to break in and steal something to sell to survive. They don't mean to hurt anyone, your house insurance would cover anything stolen.CapnGod said:
See, that's very different from here. Every cop has a piece. And a taser, and a baton, and some sort of spray, too, I think. Pretty sure they all wear body armor, too. Even places where you think it'd be unnecessary, because it's better safe than sorry.Maurauth said:
I'd say you're quite a minority, in England. Going upon your disdain for the police and your age I'd say it's down to lack of life experience.-Orgasmatron- said:
Wait, so you have a choice between letting someone perpetuate their own suffering while letting them support the main source of violence in first world countries (The drug trade, before you go off on some tangent), or killing them, ending their suffering, protecting your valuables, AND removing another source of revenue for the above mentioned drug trafficking?Maurauth said:
Also: I'm (mostly) kidding.
Over here the body armour that is standard everywhere, for all uniform, anytime is just a knifeproof vest.CapnGod said:
Controversial? Meh, perhaps. I sympathize with the sentiment, I suppose, and it's a shame, but I come first. I don't know who is breaking in. Now, I'd like not to shoot someone, and if, upon hearing me rack a shell into the chamber, they decide to leave, fantastic. I really don't WANT to kill anyone. I'd rather they never broke the law or into my house. I'd rather they leave me and mine alone. If threatened, though, I'd rather be able to respond in kind. And if that means my 12ga mag, so be it.Maurauth said:
You don't request a CV but you use common sense, how could you live with yourself if the moment you see someone in your house that you don't know, you pull out your piece and shoot them? There's a fair amount of difference between someone there to steal your TV as someone about to rape your daughter (especially when the second is so incredibly rare).CapnGod said:
To the non-kidding part, that's not your decisionKoeryn said:
How about I change the heroin addict part, to a mother who has 3 kids, and no financial input for whatever reason, but needs to steal to feed her kids.
This is where the problem lies in the legislation, if it is written how it has been expressed in this thread; that you can shoot to kill anyone in your house. You should have to prove in court that you used reasonable force because you thought your or your families life was in danger. E.G. they were in one of your bedrooms, they were also armed, they threatened you, etcCapnGod said: