by tomorrow, mostly all of you will be breaking the law.

[historybuff]

Oh c'mon, really?

People always find ways around every law. You're just fear-mongering. It probably will add up to nothing. The attempts to be edgy and connect everything back to Big Brother and all this other crap is just silly. This sort of thing happens over and over again, I doubt it will actually be a big deal.

 

[JoJo Bizzaro 7]

Oh c'mon, really?

People always find ways around every law. You're just fear-mongering. It probably will add up to nothing. The attempts to be edgy and connect everything back to Big Brother and all this other crap is just silly. This sort of thing happens over and over again, I doubt it will actually be a big deal.

It's easy to say that everything will probably be alright, but you have wonder if it won't. That's what we're (for the most part) doing. Enlightening the ignorant, thinking about the causes, and possible solutions.
However, I really hope you're right. Truly.

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

Um... it doesn't look very likely that this will pass... It pretty clearly violates human rights charters in most countries around the world and judging by the response many world governments are in agreement that it does such.

 

[Cynical skeptic]

The point I keep hammering is ACTA makes it illegal to use a web browser. So while people stammer on about how unenforceable/unrealistic/ineffectual it is, the reality seems like those involved already have a business model ready for application once ACTA is ratified. Time Warner gets to say, "our content only goes on our internet and our internet only hosts our content." Basically, every ISP becomes a walled garden composed only of what it has explicit distribution rights. Meaning ISPs gain the ability to force those with copyrights to pay to use the internet. So anything currently free, ceases to exist.

Net neutrality was a shitstorm a couple years ago because it was seeking this exact goal. It blew over because it wasn't worded properly. Time warner and other cable companies were being clear and concise about their plans for a "new" internet where ISPs were in control over all content and all access.

 

[JuryNelson]

Don't you see? The political parties have no choice. It's called lobbying.

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

Probably not. I think it means the big companies paying the politicians to get the legislation they want.
What does it actually mean?

Big companies pay individuals to convince the politicians to pass the legislation they want. The politicians have a choice.

We still get the laws the rich pay for as opposed to the laws the poor need, though.

Right. But if the politicians are bought and paid for, it's their own fault. They deserve to be held accountable.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Copyright law has its ups and downs.

Welcome to a new low for capitalism, everyone.

Socialism, actually. Remember, Obama wants everything "fair" for everyone, note the air-quotes.

Nope, this is definitely capitalism (read: a small group of people controlling all the money and screwing everyone else over to make more) as opposed to socialism (read: everyone being supported by the government)
I actually believe socialism would improve the world greatly; not least America, but unfortunately America's current generation is also the generation that was brought up to believe communism was the greatest evil in the world.

Communism is one of the greatest evils in the world. It is a dictatorship that forgot to take off its Socialist Costume after the Masquerade. To cut what could be a long rant short and paraphrase George Orwell a true Socialist. Communism does nothing but damage the true cause of Socialism. That being said Socialism/Centrally Planned Economy can be just as bad as Free Market/Capitalism as Solcialism creates a monopoly. This lack of competition leads to a decrease in quality of goods and services. It also means they can charge what they please.

 

[hawkeye52]

200 years ago it was illegal for a man with dark skin to look a man with white skin in the eyes.

You're right.

Because of idiocy and racism in the past we should make no attempts to improve things today.

I don't need to worry about eating healthy or learning. There's kids in Africa with no food and no education.

Thankyou Kair. You've really put things in perspective.

i think he was making a statement over the absurdness of this law by putting it in contrast with another absurd law rather then the points you decided to bring up for some reason.

Sounds unlikely. Adding a far more absurd law makes this one pale in comparison.

I think the points I brought up are directly related to what he was saying, or my argument towards it.

I was certainly doing a better job responding to him than he was to this topic.

we have progressed beyond state authorised racism in most developed countries the point is though that ACTA is seeking to bring us back a step in social evolution by putting us in a state of fear of doing things on the internet kind of like what china does with their internet

Except evolution cannot go backwards by definition.

My countries proposing a non-transparent firewall. At least this treaty has a shred of legitimacy. I get the point of the thread but Kairs post, unless he clarifies, does not reflect the sentiment we share.

i suppose you are right on that but you understand the point im trying to get across which is what is inteded by it

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

well, time to pack my shit and move to japan!

Um... Japan is pretty heavily involved in the treaty, in fact the final negotiations will be taking place in Japan around the end of the month.

 

[tomtom94]

Copyright law has its ups and downs.

Welcome to a new low for capitalism, everyone.

Socialism, actually. Remember, Obama wants everything "fair" for everyone, note the air-quotes.

Nope, this is definitely capitalism (read: a small group of people controlling all the money and screwing everyone else over to make more) as opposed to socialism (read: everyone being supported by the government)
I actually believe socialism would improve the world greatly; not least America, but unfortunately America's current generation is also the generation that was brought up to believe communism was the greatest evil in the world.

Communism is one of the greatest evils in the world. It is a dictatorship that forgot to take off its Socialist Costume after the Masquerade. To cut what could be a long rant short and paraphrase George Orwell a true Socialist. Communism does nothing but damage the true cause of Socialism. That being said Socialism/Centrally Planned Economy can be just as bad as Free Market/Capitalism as Solcialism creates a monopoly. This lack of competition leads to a decrease in quality of goods and services. It also means they can charge what they please.

Serj Tankian's song Money comes to mind.

In essence, every system of government seems to work fine on a small scale but fall apart as soon as it becomes global...

 

[chinangel]

I still don't think this is going to work.

 

[PhiMed]

It's a treaty, which is a law that governs governments, not individuals. Treaties have next to no influence on individuals, and have very little power for the most part.

If you're thinking that this is going to create some sort of shadow organization that's going to come to your house and send you to jail for your ripped CDs, I think you're being a bit dramatic. The purpose of this is primarily to help curb copyright and patent infringement in countries where pirating is rampant and relatively unregulated, like China, Russia, and India.

Think about it. I mean, when's the last time the World Trade Organization had any direct effect on anyone you know? International governing bodies have no real authority, so I think you're jumping the gun a bit in declaring freedom dead.

 

[ReincarnatedFTP]

wow. noone has put that much effort into making me feel like a dick before. good work.

You really shouldn't, as I could see where you would get your conclusion without knowing Orwell's background.
It's just a very annoying misconception.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Serj Tankian's song Money comes to mind.

In essence, every system of government seems to work fine on a small scale but fall apart as soon as it becomes global...

Ye that is just people not really the system. I personally prefer mixed Economies as the Gov provides essential services while Private Enterprise does Supermarkets and Retail and Manufacturing where competion is needed. Well for economic systems but for Gov and political there is not ever going to be a perfect one or even one to come anywhere near perfection unfortunately

 

[etherlance]

I've heard that the internet group called Anonymous are declaring war over this thing and have made pubic videos about it on youtube that they are trying to do something to stop this from happening.....good luck to them seriously.

 

[RandomPerson5309]

Well, I just registered here to see if maybe I could get a question answered. Just how afraid of this ACTA thing should I be?

I don't download movies games or music illegally, except for a brief time during which I used Limewire a bit, nor have I ever uploaded any such file, but all of the things I've heard about this treaty thing are just pure paranoia fuel. I'm afraid that something I do online might come across as suspicious to somebody somewhere and that there might be some item I downloaded long ago and forgot about sitting in my hard drive. Does there exist, somewhere in this vast sea of chaos that we call the internet, a translation of his ACTA into plain english? Are my fears unwarranted or am I at risk of being financially ruined by something I might have done in years long passed?

If anyone can help me out and ease my sleepless nights I would be much relieved.

 

[Wandering hobo]

Wait when is this actually planned to be inforced

 

[oliveira8]

Well, I just registered here to see if maybe I could get a question answered. Just how afraid of this ACTA thing should I be?

I don't download movies games or music illegally, except for a brief time during which I used Limewire a bit, nor have I ever uploaded any such file, but all of the things I've heard about this treaty thing are just pure paranoia fuel. I'm afraid that something I do online might come across as suspicious to somebody somewhere and that there might be some item I downloaded long ago and forgot about sitting in my hard drive. Does there exist, somewhere in this vast sea of chaos that we call the internet, a translation of his ACTA into plain english? Are my fears unwarranted or am I at risk of being financially ruined by something I might have done in years long passed?

If anyone can help me out and ease my sleepless nights I would be much relieved.

Nothing bad will happen to you. Nothing bad will happen to most of us. Seriously, nobody is going to drag you to prison by watching youtube videos or download firefox(What?), no company is going to cut access to your internet cause you downloaded the new Shakira video clip.

That or just read PhiMed response a couple of posts before yours.

The internet isn't going to die.

 

[Atmos Duality]

Among statements Orwell made during his life:
"a real Socialist is one who wishes ? not merely conceives it as desirable, but actively wishes ? to see tyranny overthrown"
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism, as I understand it."

In summary, Orwell did show that most anti-capitalist movements just end up being authoritarian governments who want power, however he said nothing of capitalism being good.

He would have been a big fan of Ortega then, who determined that as government influence increases, it requires more and more power/resources from its citizens.
I do believe that we are seeing such a ploy play out on a global scale for the first time this century.

 

[Kair]

200 years ago it was illegal for a man with dark skin to look a man with white skin in the eyes.

You're right.

Because of idiocy and racism in the past we should make no attempts to improve things today.

I don't need to worry about eating healthy or learning. There's kids in Africa with no food and no education.

Thankyou Kair. You've really put things in perspective.

I think you completely misinterpreted my comment.

Then I apologise and claim that your post was ambiguous.

I can not see how you would interpret it as saying we should not improve.
I said it to prove that today's or the past's laws are not universal and always correct, and those who follow them are not necessarily good and innocent people.