Canadian Study: Piracy Created by Greedy Capitalists
- Thread starter Greg Tito
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Good points. How many pirates "evaluate" torrented copies of games from start to finish and then decide that it's not worth paying for?Tim Latshaw said:
Videogames are, as others have pointed out, a luxury. At an earlier time in my life, it was an important enough luxury to me that I got a second job working at Babbage's just to pay for my console habit. (The discount didn't hurt, either.) Granted it left me a little less free time to play videogames, but it allowed me to pay for my hobby. And sometimes I had to wait a couple of months to buy that game I really wanted after it had been discounted.
I'll allow that people in some countries face steeper costs for their entertainment. But if you can plonk down the local equivalent of $600 or more US for a current-gen console (or God-knows-how-much for a gaming PC), your argument that the games are just too expensive is a load of crap. Buy a PS2. It can be had almost anywhere in the world at a very low cost and has a huge library of excellent games, most of which are dirt-cheap. And 100% legal.
EDIT: I also understand that there are countries where you can't get games for love or money for various reasons. Even though it's technically illegal, I really can't condemn piracy in that circumstance. How many Escapist readers does that really apply to, though?
I lol'd.HG131 said:
They must be very conflicted, considering a goodly portion of their site traffic is probably folks that have partaken in some yarr at one point or another. Realistically, shouldn't they just delete any threads with the words pirate, piracy, pirated, or any variation straight away? Point of forums is discussion. Discussion needs an opposition. No opposition = bunch of homers spouting the same opinion back and forth. Nobody expands their thinking. T'is tiring to see so very many threads about piracy, and of course every single one is littered with blanked responses from probation'd folks.
A lot of people are still seeing the subject from an "us" pointo of view.
Let's try reverting the concept.
Suppose a group of third world countries suddenly develop the ultimate love making sex kit increases quanity and quality of orgasms,and it gets all over the news and everyone and their mom starts talking about it.
Now to any person not living in one of the countries that make up these group,it will cost as much as three or four times the price,but here's the catch:
The kit isnt really that expensive and can be easily and cheaply acquired through individuals who have bought it at the origin market or can be built at home following certain instructions and getting certain materials.
Honestly say if do not feel the right to be entiteled to a novelty good that is not neccesary to survive but that everyone talks about and is expensive to get but easy to pirate.
Let's try reverting the concept.
Suppose a group of third world countries suddenly develop the ultimate love making sex kit increases quanity and quality of orgasms,and it gets all over the news and everyone and their mom starts talking about it.
Now to any person not living in one of the countries that make up these group,it will cost as much as three or four times the price,but here's the catch:
The kit isnt really that expensive and can be easily and cheaply acquired through individuals who have bought it at the origin market or can be built at home following certain instructions and getting certain materials.
Honestly say if do not feel the right to be entiteled to a novelty good that is not neccesary to survive but that everyone talks about and is expensive to get but easy to pirate.
Well they could hardly compete with the companies active right now, its not as easy as just setting it up either. Programing/game design is insanely difficult. Theres a reason alot of them are based in the States as thats where a massive amount of people with decent incomes live.zehydra said:
Changing the laws would probably be easier but then again that would hardly help either, they could probably set the blocks in place for a software industry but it would be a while yet before it grew.
But if the AAA game hot of the press doesn't sell AT ALL! wouldn't selling a cheap disk in a cheap cover for a cheaper price be an idea? I mean if the choice Between selling a game and not selling a game shouldn't the choice be to sell the game?Greg Tito said:
I mean selling a 1-2 year old game is already to late, everyone have pirated it already.
Only downside I can see to this is that people start exporting the "Cheaper Game" abroad to where we can actually pay for the games. Or that we here in the Developed world complain that our games are to expensive compared to other countries.
The first can be fixed by having Regions (more or less). The Second is harder to fix, but Adobe seems to think its okay to do so (Photoshop is twice as expensive in Europe than in the US)
I'd recommend changing that title. Immediately. It asserts Capitalism is attributable to the whole piracy epidemic in Third World countries, and it pretty much borders on Leftist rhetoric.
How about something more linked to the topic, like "Piracy created by High Prices". Seriously, at first glance, it seems that this article was going to jump into Anti-Capitalist tirades/anti-corporate rhetoric.
OT: EVERYONE knows piracy is due to high prices, compared to the low-as-fuck income of developing nations. Seriously, all this report does is provide some backing evidence.
Makes sense, but I don't really think anyone other than Valve is likely to lower their prices in these regions.
While I agree with the rest of your points, I don't really see how you can say that anime costs a fortune. Most of the popular titles are comparable to Hollywood DVD prices, and even the more expensive stuff is at least half the price it costs in its home country. Don't complain about prices until after you've seen how much a used, untranslated copy goes for in your average Japanese shop.Dexter111 said:
That's like asking "why don they make their own computers since technically speaking it is not impossible"zehydra said:
Most if not all people down here who want to make it in the games industry will either end up going indie,migrating to 1st world places where the inudstry thrives or end up as outsourced operatives for the industry.
Do try to remember south american countries don't have an american or european or japanese economical structure.
Furthermore into as what concerns Brazil,it is ridicoulous how developers continue to perceive it as yet another dead 3rd worlkd market for which support is at best negligible when it has clearly climbed it' way over the years to become the regions leading economy,not to mention a political power of it's own.
and of course the escapist fails to report that companies have to pay tariffs in those countries to sell those games there and consumers have much higher taxes in those countries....typical
It's also a problem of mentality. In Romania for example people are so used to pirating games and applications that they do it because they're used to do it. They will go out of their way and lose countless hours with poorly implemented hacks to try and pirate 1 dollar aplications. And I'm not talking about some poor kid who downloads angry birds for his PC from the torrentz. I'm talking about corporate people who can afford Apple products but don't want to pay one measly dollar for a game. They prefer to steal it because hey, if they can, why not.
More than this, they take offense with anybody who doesn't share their beliefs and act hostile towards someone who might be willing to pay for software. They see it as a sign of stupidity.
So by now, it's just natural to steal software and/or media in countries such as mine.
I don't think you can teach people to respect the work of others. You just have to make it impossible for them to steal it. Somehow.
More than this, they take offense with anybody who doesn't share their beliefs and act hostile towards someone who might be willing to pay for software. They see it as a sign of stupidity.
So by now, it's just natural to steal software and/or media in countries such as mine.
I don't think you can teach people to respect the work of others. You just have to make it impossible for them to steal it. Somehow.
I take exception to the idea that people overpricing games and then complaining about pirates are "greedy capitalists". They are, at best, incompetent businessmen. An actual capitalist would say, huh, here's a huge, obvious demand that's *not being met*. How can I meet this demand and make money off of it?
Actually, that's what the *pirates* are doing in this case--they are observing the existence of a market and servicing that market.
A few car companies realized this a few years ago, which is why they sell stripped-down super-simple cars in developing countries for what would seem (to us) to be ridiculously low prices. Granted, the vehicles don't have all the *features* of regular cars (many of which are required by law in countries like the U.S., particularly safety features).
Why can't big game companies do the same? Sell stripped-down copies lacking expensive features like manuals and nice plastic cases with artwork? I mean, these games already wind up on torrents anyway so it's not like they're really taking any *risk* by providing the disc cheap, and they at least have a CHANCE to get some use out of the demand. They can even claim (truthfully!) that this disc is the real McCoy.
It may not decrease piracy, but at least they'll be making *some* money for their efforts.
Actually, that's what the *pirates* are doing in this case--they are observing the existence of a market and servicing that market.
A few car companies realized this a few years ago, which is why they sell stripped-down super-simple cars in developing countries for what would seem (to us) to be ridiculously low prices. Granted, the vehicles don't have all the *features* of regular cars (many of which are required by law in countries like the U.S., particularly safety features).
Why can't big game companies do the same? Sell stripped-down copies lacking expensive features like manuals and nice plastic cases with artwork? I mean, these games already wind up on torrents anyway so it's not like they're really taking any *risk* by providing the disc cheap, and they at least have a CHANCE to get some use out of the demand. They can even claim (truthfully!) that this disc is the real McCoy.
It may not decrease piracy, but at least they'll be making *some* money for their efforts.
Well, in part because most of the cost doesn't come from manuals or plastic cases. To use your car example, maybe you could sell a Cadillac cheaper by swapping out the leather interior for a vinyl one but I don't think it'd be a big drop in price.JMeganSnow said:
The big cost factor in games is the payroll; all the staff required to make a AAA-rated game, for the two or three years it takes, costs in the tens of millions of dollars these days. Even releasing by direct digital download doesn't cut that cost. Add in that it actually costs more to serve overseas audiences (translation of the dialog and interface to the local language, at least) and the problem gets even worse when trying to export North American or European titles to developing countries.*
I think I remember hearing about a Brazilian company last year trying to develop a local console that could compete, though if I recall correctly the launch titles didn't look like they'd shake the industry too much. Anybody hear anything about this lately?
-- Steve
* And that's setting aside the (often large) import duties or value-added taxes charged on what is (let's face it) a foreign luxury good. These two factors, I suspect, are behind the dollars=pounds=euros pricing for US games and the ludicrous cost of everybody's games in Australia.