DmC looks great, what's with all the hate?
- Thread starter throwmeawaykid
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You're missing the point so completely that I really don't think you had a good argument.
He wasn't trying to make his fandom into an authority, for one.
And two, to make an analogy that you wont miss the point on.
Its like a chef having an opinion on a dish.
Yeah, everyone has different tastes, but chances are he knows what hes talking about.
"Opinions are like assholes" Oh boy. That's such a tired concept. You reject discussion based in personal taste, and instead opt to criticize others for having an opinion to begin with.
Don't know if you know this, but companies are not infallible.
Trying to make DmC edgy and mature by having the main character smoke and FUCK YOU FUCK YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOU'ing around is hilarious.
The attitude from Ninja Theory has been pretty damn crappy. Insulting the old games, insulting people who criticize them. They really shouldn't drive away the old fans like this when Enslaved sold abysmally.
Still gonna play it though. 30 FPS and focus on air combos aside. I like revamps, even if they try to make them as COOL AND EDGY as possible. But I'll buy it 2nd hand. From everything I've seen, I'd rather not support Ninja Theory (And by extension Capcom's idea of rebooting DMC).
The attitude from Ninja Theory has been pretty damn crappy. Insulting the old games, insulting people who criticize them. They really shouldn't drive away the old fans like this when Enslaved sold abysmally.
Still gonna play it though. 30 FPS and focus on air combos aside. I like revamps, even if they try to make them as COOL AND EDGY as possible. But I'll buy it 2nd hand. From everything I've seen, I'd rather not support Ninja Theory (And by extension Capcom's idea of rebooting DMC).
I really doubt every individual posts messages on the internet stating their dissatisfaction with the express intent of influencing the developers decisions.Draech said:
I personally have no problem with people expressing their dissatisfaction, and if the developers decide to take note of a significant level of rage, good for them.
I personally don't like it because while I'm not against change the stuff they did change is mind blowingly stupid.
First off is how Dante looks like some goth kid with no fashion sense it just doesn't seem right to me seeing as style is a big thing in DMC.
The dialogue...me and my buddy have made an in-joke of the scene where Dante and the succubus tell each other to fuck themselves (it's facepalmingly bad)
The story is an unnecessary reboot I thought Dante's backstory was pretty simple and didn't need a game to explain it (unless Crapcom changes shit in this one)
The gameplay seems really slow and pretty simplified (I thought 2 weapons were meant for COD and its clones)
The nitpicks (more of the petty reasons) Where was that chainsword in 3 that would have helped against those ranged enemies with cheap damage, you start off with air hike and air dash those are supposed to be rewards for playing the game enough, the devil angel thing seems unnecessary, its cel shaded (doesn't work for DMC), the demon world seems cartoonish.
First off is how Dante looks like some goth kid with no fashion sense it just doesn't seem right to me seeing as style is a big thing in DMC.
The dialogue...me and my buddy have made an in-joke of the scene where Dante and the succubus tell each other to fuck themselves (it's facepalmingly bad)
The story is an unnecessary reboot I thought Dante's backstory was pretty simple and didn't need a game to explain it (unless Crapcom changes shit in this one)
The gameplay seems really slow and pretty simplified (I thought 2 weapons were meant for COD and its clones)
The nitpicks (more of the petty reasons) Where was that chainsword in 3 that would have helped against those ranged enemies with cheap damage, you start off with air hike and air dash those are supposed to be rewards for playing the game enough, the devil angel thing seems unnecessary, its cel shaded (doesn't work for DMC), the demon world seems cartoonish.
i think the hate stems from the fact that the new game is different enough from the original, that it would be a higher quality product if they would get some original ideas, instead of twisting a preexisting brand into something different
to me this looks like someone wanted to make a game, and decided to capitalize on the name, instead of having the balls to try something new
stamping the name of an old product onto a new similar one is a trick to get some initial sales up
however doing that usually ends up making an inferior product, and it results in a negative attitude, which will be greatly amplified if the game isnt good
the fans are angry because they see a pattern, this has happened before, many times, and more often then not it ends up with a bad product
the fans are vocal, not because they are entitled(ok some are), but because they can see the shitstorm of dissapointment coming, and are hoping they can get the developer to notice that, since it appears that the fans noticed this long before the developer has
complaints in this case are often valid, because if the developer listens, we will end up with a better product for it
yes a lot of complaining is just entitled whining, but that dosnt mean no complaining is ever valid
have you guys noticed yet that trying to shut everyone up for complaining removes a lot of legitimate(helpful to developers) complaints, however does NOT stop the truly entitled whiners, who never had any intention of listening to others in the first place
to me this looks like someone wanted to make a game, and decided to capitalize on the name, instead of having the balls to try something new
stamping the name of an old product onto a new similar one is a trick to get some initial sales up
however doing that usually ends up making an inferior product, and it results in a negative attitude, which will be greatly amplified if the game isnt good
the fans are angry because they see a pattern, this has happened before, many times, and more often then not it ends up with a bad product
the fans are vocal, not because they are entitled(ok some are), but because they can see the shitstorm of dissapointment coming, and are hoping they can get the developer to notice that, since it appears that the fans noticed this long before the developer has
complaints in this case are often valid, because if the developer listens, we will end up with a better product for it
yes a lot of complaining is just entitled whining, but that dosnt mean no complaining is ever valid
have you guys noticed yet that trying to shut everyone up for complaining removes a lot of legitimate(helpful to developers) complaints, however does NOT stop the truly entitled whiners, who never had any intention of listening to others in the first place
Hahaha, OMG!Draech said:
You are not done till you stop this bullcrap. I'm not going to tolerate your disrepctful attitude. You have yet to contest with me about why they can't have their opinion. In fact, you haven't argued any thing once again.
I take back the childish comment and replace it with flat out ignorant.
Also, you couldn't be any more of a hypocrite. You know you are complaining about people complaining right? And then backing up your opinions with fluff. Basically, I could say you're the one whining now, and trolling, and embarrasing himself, etc.
Yeah the whole "FUCK YOU!" back and forth is cringe worthy.
Get over it. Seriously, with the way people are harping on about that you'd swear a game never had a piece of shitty dialogue. Oh wait......
Anyways, personally I'm cautiously optimistic. I hated it as much as the next guy but as I started to see more of the level design and saw that the cutscenes could still have the kind of ridiculousness I'd expect, my way of thinking about it started to change. I can even get behind the whole Angels and Demons thing because it's kind of weird that they'd have 4 games of demons and Hell and whatnot and just leave angels out of it. The whole "Demons hiding among us" thing is pretty damn cool too.
Besides, it's got Mundus. I've wanted more Mundus ever since Devil May Cry 1.
Get over it. Seriously, with the way people are harping on about that you'd swear a game never had a piece of shitty dialogue. Oh wait......
Anyways, personally I'm cautiously optimistic. I hated it as much as the next guy but as I started to see more of the level design and saw that the cutscenes could still have the kind of ridiculousness I'd expect, my way of thinking about it started to change. I can even get behind the whole Angels and Demons thing because it's kind of weird that they'd have 4 games of demons and Hell and whatnot and just leave angels out of it. The whole "Demons hiding among us" thing is pretty damn cool too.
Besides, it's got Mundus. I've wanted more Mundus ever since Devil May Cry 1.
No, he's not. His first point is that he believes (And I agree) that fans would've preferred a sequel to tie together the plot. His second point is pointing out that they've already done a younger Dante. The third point is the most grounded in your unreasonable want to quelch any kind of critique of the design choices. This is strictly based on his tastes. His fourth point, the one I think you have the most problem with, is the one thats the most true. When someone says "I don't like something." responding with "We don't care" when we're talking about a product. Its bad PR. And yes. This developer does have to answer to us, since we hold the purchasing power. If they fail or not, is still to be seen, though.
I also don't think you understand what a Straw Man is. I refuted your argument. Then implied something about my perception of your belief. If anything, its ad hominem, but reality, its just how I saw your attitude. If its incorrect, then you aren't stating your position well enough. I didn't give you a false analogy, you just missed the point of my analogy, also. Or rather, didn't have an argument for my point so tried to deflect pointlessly.
Most of the hate comes from that fact that it's "different", really.mister_redgrave said:
Honestly, if any game franchise needed a total reboot, it's Devil May Cry. Besides the 3rd game, which was the best in my personal opinion, all three of the other entries ranged from 'good but very flawed' (DmC 1 and 4) to 'what the hell am I playing?' (DmC 2). I know some people don't play DmC for the story, but the 3rd game is the only one where the story felt... coherent.
I mean, look at Devil May Cry 4. It's clear that they were running out of things to do with Dante, to the point where they had to make a new character that, coincidentally, looked just like him. Dante was basically a cameo in DmC 4. He just re-ran through levels Nero had already beaten and got a few new weapons.
So yeah, if they can make a more interesting story and world by doing a prequel, or rebooting it completely, I say have at it. It's the gameplay that matters in a Devil May Cry game. So long as it plays well and Dante is suitably badass, I think it'll be a perfectly fine entry into the series
Personally, my greatest hope is that there is, one day, a Devil May Cry/Bayonetta crossover. That would be the most insane and awesome action-game ever.
My concern is that the inevitable bombing of this game will mean no more proper Devil May Cry sequels. Like I said, I might be wrong, it might have an amazing combat system and all the bosses except the one they showcased might be brilliant but I just don't see that happening.WoW Killer said:
Fighting him on DMD mode will remove any and all feelings of excitement to see that attack spamming too-much-health too-much-damage cheating prick again.anthony87 said:
"I had to make you trust my advice, had to keep you alive and of course had to avoid having a direct confrontation with you so I dressed myself up as a clown even though you hadn't ever seen me before and had no reason to mistrust me, taunted you every time I saw you, set the most annoying enemies in the game on you and directly confronted you no less than twice." I mean I liked the game too but WHAT?!rcs619 said:
It's not whining. It's called feedback. As the people who have played the games before, we can suggest what can improve it, as logically we'd be the people ninja theory is trying to sell the game too. Unless they market it how they market a new IP and just say fuck it.Draech said:
That doesnt make our comments "more important by default". Because every peice of feedback, whether you're a fan of the old games or not, are just as valid.
Yeah. If was trying to Straw Man, I would've circumvented your argument and used this point as the basis of any counter argument. But since I didn't do that, I'm not using a Straw Man. I countered your argument on its own merits. Nevermind that I never implied that this was the basis of your argument to begin with, so in reality, there is nothing about that statement that is remotely a straw man.Draech said:
And the fact that you still didn't understand the point of my analogy baffles me. Its such a simple analogy, and you just keep missing the point. Its about knowledge. Its about an expert opinion versus average opinion. Again, your Batman analogy doesn't work because it assumes that Ninja Theory is Christopher Nolan, which its not. They aren't a proven studio. Nevermind that his complaints aren't demanding of any change. Simply pointing out aspects he doesn't approve of. He never once says. "Don't make Dante like this." He merely says "I don't like that Dante is like this."