Do you agree with this?

[NinjaDeathSlap]

Everyone's a victim, whether they sign up to it out of a misguided sense of patriotism or they're caught in the crossfire.

UK, huh? Yeah, you guys would think all patriotism is misguided. Suck a dick. I didn't go on tour twice for no good reason.

What in the Hell is that even supposed to mean? Xneophobe much?

And I'm really sorry to break this to you. But you did.

Some wars are unavoidable. Iraq was not(assuming your tours were Iraq, Afghanistan etc.). And believe it or not, the middle East didn't start it.

Sidenote, I'm not the guy you quoted.

(In the specific case of Afghanistan) Indeed, the middle east didn't start it, Al Qaeda did. Therefore, we are fighting Al Qaeda and the people who support/shelter/train them. Besides (again, specifically Afghanistan) this stopped being just a simple matter of retribution or justice or whatever the hell you want to call it for 9/11 a long time ago. Now it's also about fighting so that in the future little girls will be safe enough to go to school in their own country, or make their own choices about their own lives without the fear of being persecuted and killed by a bunch of maniac zealots.

I'm not naive, I know all wars, no matter how just the cause is for them, are a messy business, but can you really say that the example I've just given is 'no good reason'.

(I'm not the guy you quoted either)

 

[Ramzal]

No. No I do not agree with it. However, if a bunch of idiots can run around with flags that say "god hates fags", than I fail to see why she can't say stupid things as well.

 

[ninja51]

Wars fuck with quite literally everyone. Women arnt the primary victims in all wars, IE: World War II.

 

[Mikeyfell]

"Women have always been the primary victims of war. Women lose their husbands, their fathers, their sons in combat."
- Hillary Clinton.

I Think this is a load of crap. I mean sure, it would be bad to lose a family member but it would be a whole lot worse to die in combat. I believe the true "Victims" of war are the civilians that die when they have no part in the war. What are your opinions on this quote?

"Men have always been the primary victims of war. They always fucking die!"
- Mikeyfell

That's like saying the victims of the Titanic were the people in the lifeboats.

I'd say the people who got it the worst were the people the war is being fought over.

Like the Civil War would be the slaves, WW2 would be the Jews. They suffered longer than anyone who fought in the war.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

War hurts everybody equally. especially when they are illegal and unjust like every war since WW2 has been.

So when my country's territory was invaded by the Argentinians 30 years ago against the will of all the citizens who lived there, we had no case at all to stop them? Especially when they started brutally oppressing said innocent civilians for not conforming to the new regime?

 

[Thaluikhain]

There are no such things as "victims", anymore. No, no, the USA made sure of that after they dropped the nuke on Japan TWICE, and killed hundreds of thousands of people without a second thought. Hundreds of thousands of innocent civillians who had no part in the war, killed without mercy. The end of World War II marked the end of the era where killing civillians was unacceptable.

No, the end of World War II marked the end of needing more than a single weapon to kill a hundred thousand. Cities had taken comparable damage from bombing before, only it required a host or aircraft armed with many, many weapons.

I don't see how it'd be preferable to kill many times that number of civilians in a ground war instead, unless lots of US and allied forces also dying makes it alright? In preparation for a ground war on Japan, the US stockpiled half a million Purple Hearts to award to wounded soldiers. After 60 years of fighting around the world and awarding them, they've still got about a quarter of them left.

 

[Booze Zombie]

You've got to remember every person is trying to further an agenda when they talk politics, it's the nature of the game. If you don't agree with this particular agenda (women are suffering a lot more than men), then you'll think it's really terrible and critisize it, as is our nature.

Anyway, from my view war is a massive shake-up that works in a similar manner to the ressurection of a phoenix, which is to say once the death and destruction is done hitting everything and everyone, from the ashes emerges life and progress in spite of it all.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

From the comments in this thread, I would hate to be a soldier in the UK. You guys appear to have little to no respect for soldiers and veterans.

Well, I'm not a soldier specifically, but I am from a military family (my Dad's in the RAF fyi, in fact he's just got back from his latest rotation in Libya) and compared to a lot of other countries you're right, there is very little respect here. Not to say that there is none at all (just Google 'Wooton Bassett' if you ever need some of your faith in humanity restored).

You'd struggle to find a more devoted supporter of freedom of expression than me. I get that people have their own opinions about the moral complexities of war and should always be allowed to express them. I just think we'd all get along much better if some people realised that the only reason they have freedom of speech is because people like my Dad have put their lives on the line to defend it, time and time again. Which is why it annoys me to hear blanket, generalising statements like 'There is no just cause for conflict' or 'All soldiers have no respect for human life' when anyone who has ever opened a History book should know that it's more complicated than that.

 

[scorptatious]

Because you know, women don't go out to war. Women don't die in war. And also, women don't have mothers or daughters.

 

[Fleischer]

So when my country's territory was invaded by the Argentinians 30 years ago against the will of all the citizens who lived there, we had no case at all to stop them? Especially when they started brutally oppressing said innocent civilians for not conforming to the new regime?

Are you from the Falklands?

 

[Cyanin]

Women aren't the victims, men aren't the victims. War makes society and whole families the victims. The burden of war isn't held by individuals, it shatters towns and cities, and those left behind.

To return to Clinton's statement, women are very commonly the victims because they are, typically, the people who stay to care for families. But really, in war, everyone is a victim, and the consequences affect everyone.

 

[EightGaugeHippo]

Implying that there are people who benefit from war.
Because, truly everyone is a victim in war. Narrowing it down to just women, implies that some group of people are not victims.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

So when my country's territory was invaded by the Argentinians 30 years ago against the will of all the citizens who lived there, we had no case at all to stop them? Especially when they started brutally oppressing said innocent civilians for not conforming to the new regime?

Are you from the Falklands?

I have family there and my Dad is in the RAF, so we are friends with many people who both served in the war and were caught in the crossfire.

Does that count as well informed enough for you?

 

[GraveeKing]

It's war.
EVERYONES a Victim.
The solder shot and bleeding to death on the battlefield in pain,
The younger brother who will never see his sibling again,
The parents at home who get the sad letter hearing of how he died a 'heroes death'.

There is no primary victim, war is a terrible thing - as long as it's there everyone will be a victim.

 

[Michael Hirst]

War is cruel to all it touches, men, women and children are all hurt by it in different ways, war in itself is never a good thing but on occassion has been the only way to build a better future like fighting back against the Nazi's in World War 2.

Nobody LIKES war, if they say they do they're either crazy, trolling, making lots of money from it or just plain sick. War is the most brutal and devastating part of humanity, ultimate proof that at some deep level we lack reason and would rather see millions suffer than agree to disagree.

EVERYONE involved is the primary victim in war.

 

[Sansha]

Everybody's a victim in war, but I think the primary victims are the ones whose bodies litter the battlefields.

 

[Phoenix_XIII]

War should not be fought by soldiers, but by the politicians who start them.

We didn't start the wars. None of us WANT mass death. We didn't want any of it. POLITICIANS start wars. People in power start wars.

The victims are the people who get dragged into it all, which includes everyone in the countries, the soldiers, and those who have to die for politicians.

 

[DarkRyter]

The dead have it the worst in war.

The end of one's existence is a horrific fate.

 

[MCrewdson001]

Everybody involved n war who isnt gaining something is a victim

 

[Jegsimmons]

"Women have always been the primary victims of war. Women lose their husbands, their fathers, their sons in combat."
- Hillary Clinton.

I Think this is a load of crap. I mean sure, it would be bad to lose a family member but it would be a whole lot worse to die in combat. I believe the true "Victims" of war are the civilians that die when they have no part in the war. What are your opinions on this quote?

first thought: this sounds like crap.
saw it was from Hilary: that explains it.

seriously does anyone take her seriously? i know feminist who think she's full of shit.

also, Hilary, protip: Women are not the only ones who lose loved ones in war, also, women have been fighting along side men for a while...forgot about those brave women didnt you?