Doctor Who Series 6 Episode 8: Let's Kill Hitler *SPOILERS*

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Guestyman

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TimeLord said:
I was thinking it was a poor choice of words in her giving up her "remaining regenerations". Should have said something like "her ability to regenerate" if they wanted to keep things in sync with canon spin-offs...

[HEADING=1]Oh wait! This is Steven Moffat we're talking about![/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
"Remaining Regenerations" is the canon terminology. The Master is given "A new set of regenerations" in The Five Doctors, and basically every episode in the old series where the matter comes up "Regenerations" are referred to as a resource to be used up and not as an ability to be utilised an unlimited number of times.

I'd assume people would be happy that Moffat is choosing to stick with the canon of the series itself, rather than disregarding it in favour of the spin-offs. I'd also assume "fans" wouldn't try and invent things to say why the show is ruined forever and instead be... you know, fans of the show?

[HEADING=1]Oh Wait! This is Doctor Who fans we're talking about.[/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
 

Lyri

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The Dutchess said:
I agree with all you said here and above. I love Doctor Who but what was that? I actually liked Riversong and now they've ruined her too. I wish the Doctor had just taken little Amelia Pond on some adventures and left kissogram Amy firmly at home. The sad thing is I think Matt Smith is excellent or could be excellent if he had anything good to work with.
I agree with all you said about leaving Amy at home and taken the little one on an adventure.
I really can't stand Karen Gillian, she drives me completely batshit and I wish to god she wasn't in this series or her character was a little more than a short skirt.

From what I saw of the first series it was all very disappointing, I never took to Matt Smith as the Doctor and Stephen Moffat taking over, well...Nah.
I think he's trying to do to much with it all, River song has killed this series and now they're just carrying on and twisting her storyline ever more to fit in more "Epic" stuff.
Couldn't he just go back to writing great one off episodes like the Weeping angels?
 

ReservoirAngel

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First thought: I hope they release a sonic cane that I can buy... holy crap do I ever want one of those things!
 

Sampler

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Anyone else getting the sinking feeling that the Dr who dies (no pun intended) at the beginning of the season is the flesh version? He somehow escaped an acid bath and the monster, lived his life but as flesh couldn't regenerate and probably had a time limit, coming to the end of his time he decides to let River kill him to set her free from the control of the silence.

Hence the flashbacks of the Dr's life at the beginning of the season that haven't come to pass, it's another Dr's life.
 

tomtom94

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May 11, 2009
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Loved this episode; thought Mels' introduction was a bit of an ass pull but otherwise loved it. Funny and an all-round romp. Want to see the Antibodies back: "You will experience a tingling sensation, then death."

Think people complaining about there being "too much emphasis" on the plot are probably the same people who complained about Russell T Davies' inability to plot well. How can a better storyline be a bad thing?
 

Ldude893

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Apr 2, 2010
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It was nice. I wonder how Rory will comprehend punching Hitler in the face and locking him in a closet?
 

imnot

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Guestyman said:
TimeLord said:
I was thinking it was a poor choice of words in her giving up her "remaining regenerations". Should have said something like "her ability to regenerate" if they wanted to keep things in sync with canon spin-offs...

[HEADING=1]Oh wait! This is Steven Moffat we're talking about![/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
"Remaining Regenerations" is the canon terminology. The Master is given "A new set of regenerations" in The Five Doctors, and basically every episode in the old series where the matter comes up "Regenerations" are referred to as a resource to be used up and not as an ability to be utilised an unlimited number of times.

I'd assume people would be happy that Moffat is choosing to stick with the canon of the series itself, rather than disregarding it in favour of the spin-offs. I'd also assume "fans" wouldn't try and invent things to say why the show is ruined forever and instead be... you know, fans of the show?

[HEADING=1]Oh Wait! This is Doctor Who fans we're talking about.[/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
Stop littering you dang kids!
Ldude893 said:
It was nice. I wonder how Rory will comprehend punching Hitler in the face and locking him in a closet?
*sees avatar*
I have a great Idea for an episode!

Come on kotick get in the closet
 

Outlaw Torn

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I thought it was a pretty dull episode, following on from the anticlimax of the Demons Run episode I was expecting a lot more. I was expecting a lot more from the last episode from the first half of the series but figured they would at least hit the ground running with the second half, alas no.

The instant 'Mels' hit the screen I knew I would dislike her and I did. Considering that she was supposed to be Amy and Rory's BFF why can I not remember her being in any of the other episodes? Was she even at their wedding? You know, one of the most significant events a couple can have in life (maybe that's undermined a bit with the space-time travelling and all).

The title of the episode was also kind of misleading. Hitler played a pretty miniscule part, so much so that you could almost have set it anywhere and anywhen and you wouldn't have noticed the difference besides the terminatron thing randomly being there for no reason (unless you pick a random time with time crims of course). The episode could have been called any of the following and still made more sense: "Take off your clothes", "Fish fingers and custard redux", "Hitler in the cupboard", "Apocalypse of the robo-jellyfish", "Little red corvette", "The Hardy Boys and the smugglers of Berlin".

The only major revelation was that the TARDIS taught River to pilot the TARDIS and not The Doctor.
 

The Eyeball Moose

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Riesel87 said:
The Eyeball Moose said:
SNIP x2 COMBO
Exactly. All of that. I'm already so tired of Amy and Rory and would very much like it if they left after this season, but it doesn't look like they're going to. I was already pissed when they didn't leave after Smith's FIRST season because, for me, it ruined Rose's importance as a character. I liked how she was in the show for two seasons instead of the usual one I thought was set aside for each companion, like with Martha and Donna. This just makes it redundant.

Right now I'm stuck trying to figure out who the enemy was in that episode. It certainly wasn't the robot. It was busy in the background bringing justice to criminals. I wouldn't consider River the enemy since by now it's 100% obvious she will become a friend of the Doctor. Was it Hitler? I would have loved it if Hitler broke into the side of the building in a giant robot suit. That situation would have made me forgive that entire accident of an episode.

Is it just me or is the Doctor going soft? Wait, no, forget I asked that, he's gone COMPLETELY soft. He used to outwit his enemies in a spectacular fireworks show of brilliance. Granted, he outwitted River several times when she was trying to kill him, but that was little more than a plot driver. At the climactic scene of the episode, he's a disabled little crying pansy trying to get River to save the day for him. What the hell. That's not the Doctor I know. What has Moffat done?!
 

Nostalgia Ripoff

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Sampler said:
Anyone else getting the sinking feeling that the Dr who dies (no pun intended) at the beginning of the season is the flesh version? He somehow escaped an acid bath and the monster, lived his life but as flesh couldn't regenerate and probably had a time limit, coming to the end of his time he decides to let River kill him to set her free from the control of the silence.

Hence the flashbacks of the Dr's life at the beginning of the season that haven't come to pass, it's another Dr's life.
If it was Flesh, it would turn to goop after being shot. Besides, he was in the middle of regenerating when he was killed.

OT: I enjoyed it. It wasn't the conclusion to A Good Man Goes to War I would've liked, but it was fun. It could've used more Hitler, though. Never thought I'd have to say that...

I do think there are too many plot heavy episodes so far, though. The strength of Doctor Who that drew me into the series was its ability to manage to have an overarching story while keeping most of the season episodic. That seems to be missing in this season.
 

uberhippy

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I guess that Hitler has always been uncharted terreritory for the time-traveling adventurer, a bit to risque for the happy-go-lucky Doctor.
Glad that after so many years we can all sit back and have a good laugh at it!
(though honestly, i was expecting a bit more Hitler..)

Also, yes, terriffic way to start of a new demi-series. Answer a question or two, and magnificantly raise a few more to intrest us in it.
(and yes, i just love River Song more and more every time I see her :) )
 

MercurySteam

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I live in Oz and I have no idea when the hell the ABC will broadcast it. Hopefully soon...
 

Thyunda

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Am I really the only person to notice that 'Let's Kill Hitler' as a title actually has nothing to do with Hitler? It's a reference to time travel. 'If you had a time machine, wouldn't you go back and kill Hitler?'
It's supposed to be representative of Mel's irresponsible character and as an excuse to get them out of present-day to somewhere dangerous and conducive to River Song's dress sense.

What I did NOT like was her attempts at being an 'action heroine'. Mel was an awful character. She was clearly not somebody who Rory and Amy would hang out with. She wasn't even a realistic character. What, am I to believe that she stole an American sports car and raced across a cornfield, before pulling a great big pistol out of her ass?
This is a tiny village in England. Nobody has a sports car, and guns are certainly not THAT easy to get your hands on. What I DID like was the Doctor arriving with the newspaper and saying, "Really?"
That was funny. That's the reason I feel complimented when people compare me to him.

Going to Nazi Germany to 'kill Hitler' was a comment on irresponsibility and why the Time Lords enforced their rule of only watching. Those time-police idiots were a symbol of that, too.

While I hated the fact that the Doctor was just so easy to kill in this episode, I suppose it shows that there's a deeper reason for his reluctance to have any kind of contact with women...though you'd think he'd have a backup plan.
I hate River Song. I just hate her character. She does not look like a badass action heroine, she looks like an old woman having a mid-life crisis. Doctor Who is not about gun-toting warriors. It never has been. It's been about the Doctor solving problems with his ingenuity and time-travelling spaceship. When you start bringing guns into it, it just doesn't work. And for a girl programmed to kill the Doctor, she does a pretty poor job of it, spending only this episode trying to kill him.

And nice dodge on the genocidal humans. In the first episode of this series, the Doctor tricked the Silence into getting the people to kill them. So kill all Silence on sight. Fortunately, the Silence is a cult, rather than a race. Except they all look the same anyway, so good luck with that.

So...yeah...in summary - the episode was not about Hitler, it was about why Time Lords had to police the time stream, because otherwise you get people going back in time to stop Hitler. River Song is a stupid character and had better not show up again. I like Rory, and I like Amy. Rory's growing more into his own character, and I think his time of being envious of the Doctor is helping him become a more blunt, straightforward version of his rival. I think since the Doctor made him rescue Amy in his centurion uniform, he's starting to see the Doctor as a partner, rather than a love rival, after his little jealous phase.
 

TimeLord

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Guestyman said:
TimeLord said:
I was thinking it was a poor choice of words in her giving up her "remaining regenerations". Should have said something like "her ability to regenerate" if they wanted to keep things in sync with canon spin-offs...

[HEADING=1]Oh wait! This is Steven Moffat we're talking about![/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
"Remaining Regenerations" is the canon terminology. The Master is given "A new set of regenerations" in The Five Doctors, and basically every episode in the old series where the matter comes up "Regenerations" are referred to as a resource to be used up and not as an ability to be utilised an unlimited number of times.

I'd assume people would be happy that Moffat is choosing to stick with the canon of the series itself, rather than disregarding it in favour of the spin-offs. I'd also assume "fans" wouldn't try and invent things to say why the show is ruined forever and instead be... you know, fans of the show?

[HEADING=1]Oh Wait! This is Doctor Who fans we're talking about.[/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
I get that, I was just pointing out that the regenerations limit was thrown out the widow intentionally in a line by Matt Smith written by RTD. That's about as canon as you can get outside the main series.
 

The Dutchess

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Lyri said:
The Dutchess said:
I agree with all you said here and above. I love Doctor Who but what was that? I actually liked Riversong and now they've ruined her too. I wish the Doctor had just taken little Amelia Pond on some adventures and left kissogram Amy firmly at home. The sad thing is I think Matt Smith is excellent or could be excellent if he had anything good to work with.
I agree with all you said about leaving Amy at home and taken the little one on an adventure.
I really can't stand Karen Gillian, she drives me completely batshit and I wish to god she wasn't in this series or her character was a little more than a short skirt.

From what I saw of the first series it was all very disappointing, I never took to Matt Smith as the Doctor and Stephen Moffat taking over, well...Nah.
I think he's trying to do to much with it all, River song has killed this series and now they're just carrying on and twisting her storyline ever more to fit in more "Epic" stuff.
Couldn't he just go back to writing great one off episodes like the Weeping angels?
I'm glad I'm not the only one who dislikes grown up Amy! I mean even the Doctor is thoroughly disappointed in what little Amelia Pond has become. I'm still waiting for the moment a light dawns for Rory and he breaks free of this awful marriage and makes his own way in the world. I doubt Amy would be all that bothered.
Please go back to the original formula where the main plot was a mere subtle background whisper to the current episode's hilarious highjinks and engaging singular plot. Where the deus ex machina weren't so horribly obvious and levered in to make things wobble back onto the rails. Back when the Doctor actually had chemistry with his companions and thought the world of them rather than being mildly terrified of their sexual advances.
Ok ok, I'll just go watch David Tennant's Doctor and pretend he never regenerated. *cries in a corner*
 

Verlander

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Dull. Continuity is the story, nothing else. If I liked that I'd read more DC comics...
 

Shakomaru

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ZeoAssassin said:
well that was...err interesting

Having the plot point about poisoning the Doctor and then "killing" him was pretty pointless considering what we saw at the start of the season. Actually i REALLY hoped for a Matt Smith version of THIS scene to play out...
Rory was bad-ass of course "SHUT UP Hitler, now get in the closet" was probably the best line as well as the HAIL HITLER *punches him in the face moment.
Yeah I was hoping for that too. the problem is, he didn't know about the poison (what kind it was). Everyone uses Cyanide, but whatever River used was, as the TARDIS said, incurable. also the heil punch has been done a million times in the three stooges, but it never gets old. I loved this episode, and I can't wait for more Doctor.
 

Guestyman

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TimeLord said:
Guestyman said:
TimeLord said:
I was thinking it was a poor choice of words in her giving up her "remaining regenerations". Should have said something like "her ability to regenerate" if they wanted to keep things in sync with canon spin-offs...

[HEADING=1]Oh wait! This is Steven Moffat we're talking about![/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
"Remaining Regenerations" is the canon terminology. The Master is given "A new set of regenerations" in The Five Doctors, and basically every episode in the old series where the matter comes up "Regenerations" are referred to as a resource to be used up and not as an ability to be utilised an unlimited number of times.

I'd assume people would be happy that Moffat is choosing to stick with the canon of the series itself, rather than disregarding it in favour of the spin-offs. I'd also assume "fans" wouldn't try and invent things to say why the show is ruined forever and instead be... you know, fans of the show?

[HEADING=1]Oh Wait! This is Doctor Who fans we're talking about.[/HEADING]

*throws a pile of paper in the air and walks away*
I get that, I was just pointing out that the regenerations limit was thrown out the widow intentionally in a line by Matt Smith written by RTD. That's about as canon as you can get outside the main series.
Eh, once RTD stopped being the showrunner for Who, I started taking the canonicity of subsequent SJA and Torchwood eps as regards the mother show with MASSIVE grains of salt. Por Exemplo, I do not think Miracle Day is happening in the same Whoniverse as Rory and Amy's Crop Circle Shenanigans (For reasons that should be obvious) Likewise Death of the Doctor isn't the best source for what's going on in Moffat!Who as SJA is RTD's show and he doesn't need to (and probably wouldn't) consult with the Moff over stuff like the throwaway line Smith has about the regen limit. (Also: Rule 1, the Doctor lies. He might not have been telling Clyde the truth)

Or, to put it another way, blaming Moffat for not keeping *his* show in line with what Rusty has written after having left the show might be a tiny bit unfair to the Moffster. Spin offs should try to keep in canon with the source material, source material should not be bound to the constraints of spin offs.

Also: On reflection, my quoting your words and formatting back at you like that was a bit of a dick move, and the lack of body language and vocal tone inflection might have made me come across as less flippantly amused and more irritated vengeful uberfan. Please accept my uncondtional apology for any way in which I was or appeared to be a dickhead on the internet.
 
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1. I do hope they rap up this whole "Silence/River" thing at LEAST by the end of this season. Really, River was introduced all the way back in season 4. This has gone on long enough. I want to get back to good old Doctor & Companion adventuring. I don't hate River Song, I just miss how Dr. Who was before she showed up.

2. That being said, it was still a good episode. I certainly enjoyed it. Interesting seeing River before she was River. Also, the giant robot/tiny people thing was cool. I love it when people here complain about an episode being "too goofy" or something like that. Have you ever SEEN Dr. Who?

Here is a list of things that HAVE appeared on Dr. Who, and just in the new series:
A blob of living plastic taking over the world with gun-handed mannequins. An invasion force of fat aliens who can't stop farting. A race of robots who's main weapons consist of a plunger and an egg beater. A spaceship stalking a woman in the 16th century with time travel, which led to the main character riding a horse across time and space THROUGH A MIRROR. A bomb that was made to destroy everything in every universe ever. Space rhinos looking for a vampire on the moon. A villain who turned everyone on Earth in a clone of himself. A werewolf from space that wanted to infect the Queen of England so he could wage war on the world with steam-powered missiles. A spaceship pretending to be the second floor a one-story building. WWII-era planes taking down a spaceship. IN SPACE. Pig-people working for evil robots in the 30s. A little girl who can make people disappear by drawing them because there's a telepathic dandelion seed in her head. A country-sized spaceship built on the back of a whale. An alien invasion controlling people through their blood. Cat people in the future. A slab of living skin with a face. A gameshow where the losers are disintegrated, complete with an android telling them "You ARE the weakest link". Monsters from another dimension that only show up if you change time, and go around eating people until you fix it. A guy who transforms himself into a giant scorpion monster trying to live forever. The space-titanic. Lizard people from the center of the Earth. A spider-alien woman trying to bring back her armies of children, also in the center of the Earth. Robotic Santas with weaponized musical instruments. Weaponized Christmas trees. Weaponized Christmas tree ornaments. A sonic screwdriver that can do pretty anything, include make it possible for a normal cell phone to call anywhere in all of time and space with no additional instructions other then the phone number. Shakespeare banishing some alien witches with the word "expelliarmus". People from the future getting stuck in an automated freeway, where it takes years just to travel a few miles. Also, giant crab monsters. Alien midgets who take over the world using special GPS systems on cars. A giant alien wasp who kills people in the style of a murder mystery. Vincent Van Gogh fighting an invisible space monster, and then painting the end of the universe because STONE HENGE TOLD HIM TO.

Aaaaaaand that's all I got for now. But seriously, do you people even WATCH this show?