Favourite Star Trek captain?

[Molikroth]

Jellico turned his whole crew against him for pointless effeciency. A crew willing to follow where you lead is more important than phasers pumping out enough energy for you to forget about them and just place mines around ships... talk about a disappointment...

They were Starfleet officers and would've obeyed his commands. Unlike under Picard however they'd dig their heels in at every turn and cost time arguing and complaining.

I'm all for getting your crew loyal to you as a person as well as a superior officer, but it isn't necessary. If the crew had disobeyed Jellico, while they could attribute his caustic personality as the cause, in the end they'd be the ones court-martialed and Jellico wouldn't lose a thing.

Picard was a man of the arts, which I respect about the character, and all-round intelligent guy, but being easy to get along with isn't something I'd take into account when deciding which the better captain was, and if being easy to get along with meant you run a ship that isn't running in optimal condition 24/7 - especially the flagship - you'd lose points.

I just remembered - someone earlier said Jellico was arrogant. Picard's "Make it so!" command had always struck me as an extremely arrogant phrase - along with how he holds up his own values to be the be-all and end-all of any subject.

 

[Resistance205]

To be honest im not that big of a Star Trek fan but in my opinion i think Picard was the best.

 

[Eyclonus]

I just remembered - someone earlier said Jellico was arrogant. Picard's "Make it so!" command had always struck me as an extremely arrogant phrase - along with how he holds up his own values to be the be-all and end-all of any subject.

In comparison Kirk beats Picard when it comes to arrogance.

I guess Picard's popular for being Competent in space navy that seems to be half moronic buffoons.
If the Federation's internal politicking was as bad as any current human society then I'm pretty sure Kirk's actions alone would've lead to a strike by the redshirts. Citing poor OH&S standards and the possibility that they're literally being used as a meatshield by their superior officer.

That duel between Kirk and Khan is another example, with the Enterprise rising behind Reliant like a submarine to take the final shots...

 

[fix-the-spade]

it has to be picard and it's mostly because of this [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjNKyoRudOQ]

Oh dear...
That makes Picard the greatest captain in Sc-fi history, nevermind star Trek.
Gotta love Patrick stewart's sense of humour.

 

[Devil's Due]

Picard.

I mean, really, he's so awesome. There's so much I could say about him, but why should I? When this song [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6oUz1v17Uo] sums it all up. Yeah, that's how awesome he is.

PS: Probably been linked already, but still, why not?

 

[Uncompetative]

Kirk.

 

[Wyatt]

They were Starfleet officers and would've obeyed his commands. Unlike under Picard however they'd dig their heels in at every turn and cost time arguing and complaining.

I'm all for getting your crew loyal to you as a person as well as a superior officer, but it isn't necessary. If the crew had disobeyed Jellico, while they could attribute his caustic personality as the cause, in the end they'd be the ones court-martialed and Jellico wouldn't lose a thing.

Picard was a man of the arts, which I respect about the character, and all-round intelligent guy, but being easy to get along with isn't something I'd take into account when deciding which the better captain was, and if being easy to get along with meant you run a ship that isn't running in optimal condition 24/7 - especially the flagship - you'd lose points.

I just remembered - someone earlier said Jellico was arrogant. Picard's "Make it so!" command had always struck me as an extremely arrogant phrase - along with how he holds up his own values to be the be-all and end-all of any subject.

your missing the key here though and that is its up to the guy in command to do just that, COMMAND respect not DEmand respect. thats the difference between Picard and jellico.

Jellico expected his neck pips and his commission papers to impress the crew, Picard expected his crew to follow because he was worthy of leading. he didnt just stand there and stamp his foot having a hissy fit saying "you have to follow me because i have the title waaaaaaaaaa" wich is about what Jellicos command style ammount too.

the KEY difference between a mearly ok commander and a ledgend like Picard.

 

[ala dente]

Janeway wish this was a true poll

 

[Molikroth]

Wyatt - Jellico was considered a fit replacement for Picard by Starfleet. Surely that should count for something to the crew? Whether or not they felt he deserved their respect, they're Starfleet officers which means the guy wearing more pins gets to order them around whether they like it or not. In today's military - hell, in almost any organization with a rank-based command structure - you follow your commander's orders first and whine in writing to the guy above him once you're finished.


Besides which, during the two episodes Jellico was captain of the Enterprise, he was met with unnecessary resistance and complaints just because the crew could complain. Geordi whined that he couldn't make a change Jellico demanded, even after Jellico and Data had told him it was feasible. Riker was just upset his father-figure captain was going and there really was no excuse for Troi not wearing a uniform to begin with.

I'm seeing a lot of "Picard was awesome!" but not a lot of "This is why Picard was any better than the average captain".

 

[TerraMGP]

Wyatt - Jellico was considered a fit replacement for Picard by Starfleet. Surely that should count for something to the crew? Whether or not they felt he deserved their respect, they're Starfleet officers which means the guy wearing more pins gets to order them around whether they like it or not. In today's military - hell, in almost any organization with a rank-based command structure - you follow your commander's orders first and whine in writing to the guy above him once you're finished.


Besides which, during the two episodes Jellico was captain of the Enterprise, he was met with unnecessary resistance and complaints just because the crew could complain. Geordi whined that he couldn't make a change Jellico demanded, even after Jellico and Data had told him it was feasible. Riker was just upset his father-figure captain was going and there really was no excuse for Troi not wearing a uniform to begin with.

I'm seeing a lot of "Picard was awesome!" but not a lot of "This is why Picard was any better than the average captain".

Picard was better because he had respect for his crew. Yes as dumb as it is you always must do what the guy who has the rank says but Picard was good because he didn't take that authority given to him for granted or think that the others under him were less for it. Jellico was a horrible person who was obsessed with rank and doing things his way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePTiYrARlsc

Said better than I ever could.

 

[Assassin_Thunder]

picard 100%

 

[Jamanticus]

Janeway wish this was a true poll

Any particular reason you think Janeway was the best? I'm not refuting you, but we like hearing reasoning here.

Oh, and welcome to the Escapist forums, ala dente!

 

[Molikroth]

Terra - Jellico went to Riker, spoke to him man to man without hiding behind his rank. Note that he said he wouldn't order him to fly the shuttle - he asked. He could have ordered and Riker would have obeyed - partly out of his usual sense of duty and partly because his superior officer gave an order.

Jellico didn't treat the crew with respect because they didn't earn it. He took command of the flagship, saw its disgraceful state and went about correcting the issue. He didn't need to listen to Gerodi's objections about improving the engines because Geordi's objections were stupid: "they're adequate according to Starfleet". Adequate might have been enough for Picard but Jellico wanted the flagship in optimal condition, which I can't fault at all - particularly considering the bad relations between the Federation and Cardassians at the time.

His treatment of the Cardassian ambassador was certainly different - but it was calculated. Jellico wasn't particularly violent, but understood how acting like it could work to his advantage in negotiations with Cardassians. Picard would have gone out of his way to remain polite and ignore any jibes the Cardassians made, and the Cardassians would've gotten cocky for it. Jellico put them in their place and remained dominant throughout.

For another example of Picard's arrogance (if "make it so" wasn't enough) look at how he treats Q. Q, a being who could wipe out humanity from time and space so the universe existed as if humanity had never come about, was treated dismally by Picard, who was meant to be representative of humanity. Picard was rude and arrogant - as was Q, of course, but one of the two had the power to exterminate all life in all universes. One of them had every right to be arrogant and hold himself above petty notions of politeness. It wasn't Picard.

 

[perfectimo]

For another example of Picard's arrogance (if "make it so" wasn't enough) look at how he treats Q. Q, a being who could wipe out humanity from time and space so the universe existed as if humanity had never come about, was treated dismally by Picard, who was meant to be representative of humanity. Picard was rude and arrogant - as was Q, of course, but one of the two had the power to exterminate all life in all universes. One of them had every right to be arrogant and hold himself above petty notions of politeness. It wasn't Picard.

I have a question for you, Is Q anything like Charlie from the original series? From descriptions of him they sounds similar.

 

[TwistedEllipses]

I'm going to say Janeway just to annoy all the Picardians out there...(even though Picard is the best)

 

[TerraMGP]

Terra - Jellico went to Riker, spoke to him man to man without hiding behind his rank. Note that he said he wouldn't order him to fly the shuttle - he asked. He could have ordered and Riker would have obeyed - partly out of his usual sense of duty and partly because his superior officer gave an order.

Jellico didn't treat the crew with respect because they didn't earn it. He took command of the flagship, saw its disgraceful state and went about correcting the issue. He didn't need to listen to Gerodi's objections about improving the engines because Geordi's objections were stupid: "they're adequate according to Starfleet". Adequate might have been enough for Picard but Jellico wanted the flagship in optimal condition, which I can't fault at all - particularly considering the bad relations between the Federation and Cardassians at the time.

His treatment of the Cardassian ambassador was certainly different - but it was calculated. Jellico wasn't particularly violent, but understood how acting like it could work to his advantage in negotiations with Cardassians. Picard would have gone out of his way to remain polite and ignore any jibes the Cardassians made, and the Cardassians would've gotten cocky for it. Jellico put them in their place and remained dominant throughout.

For another example of Picard's arrogance (if "make it so" wasn't enough) look at how he treats Q. Q, a being who could wipe out humanity from time and space so the universe existed as if humanity had never come about, was treated dismally by Picard, who was meant to be representative of humanity. Picard was rude and arrogant - as was Q, of course, but one of the two had the power to exterminate all life in all universes. One of them had every right to be arrogant and hold himself above petty notions of politeness. It wasn't Picard.

Do you remember the rest of that episode? yes he did go to him man to man, but in spite of that his actions have shown the man to be egotistical and self centered. He didn't like Riker but he respected him enough to ask, which is ok, but he still was the kind to pull rank. Picard was a good captain because he didn't have to. Picard would have listened to his first officers objections and given a reason why he was not going with them. He knew he was a man, that rank means little especially if your all dead over one mans foolish pride. Jellico was a very small man who in spite of his service record was convinced that his way or the highway was the best way to run things.

I think though that your mention of Q is the absolute perfect example though. If you notice Q seems to respect those who stand up to him more than anyone else. He is omnipotent and as such must already have a good idea how Picard will react. I offer that Q chose Picard BECAUSE he treats Q the way he does. Picard is the representative because he does not take crap, because he won't be bullied by Q. It is not Arrogence so much as it is an understanding of how to be both cordial and strong at the same time. Jellico is the kind of man who would have cowtowed to Q right away and frankly most likely have delivered the ultimatum to stay. Do you think if that was what the Q wanted that it wouldn't happen already?

Q, I feel, wanted more than anything to avoid human complicency regardless of what his initial goals may have been. Q could respect picard because Picard refused to back down in the face of this power. That was what they needed. As I said before Jellico was a small man and most likely would have agreed with whatever Q demanded. Frankly I could see Q then removing us from history simply because we didn't have the drive to push out into the unknown.

Jellico was a horrible officer because he demanded to be seen as the strongest and treated as the strongest which really implies that he was in fact weak and scared. He had to have things done his way because he didn't trust anyone else. He depended on the order of Starfleets structure to let him stay on top as much as he could and viewed rank as paramount because without it he would have nothing and he knows it. Picard was human, he had his flaws, but he knew how to deal with others, how to trust others and how to show strength with dignity which makes him a far more qualified officer.

 

[jim_doki]

am i SERIOUSLY the only one who likes Archer?