Feminism: has it gone to far?

[JWAN]

The feminist movement was started to even the playing field and they did a great job of doing that. But the feminist movement has been taken to a farther, more insane level, and aimed towards female domination instead of equality, almost like the civil rights movement and how many minorities think that ALL white people owe them reparations for shit that happened in the 1800's.

And to that last group I say, "Your fucking up the work of all previous feminists by being crazy. Go away now."
--
I would also like to point out that (at least in the US) the military trains Women differently and due to the fact that we are fighting 2 insurgencies who pride themselves in attacking weaker, backwater, military installations this should not and cannot continue. But that doesn't really matter other than from a "Politically Correct" standpoint because the women Marines I know racked up about 4 dozen more enemies KIA working in the "Green Zone" than most units working out in the field just because the enemy wants to destabilize the Green Zones and spread fear. Instead the Muslim extremists are quite literally getting the living shit kicked out of them by people they once abused and used as tools. I would be lying to you if I said I DIDN'T get a great deal of enjoyment out of that and I think we should hide a few batteries of 60mm mortars and dedicate them to the sole purpose of clearing the sandies out of the wire.

 

[AgentNein]

Its funny, because nearly all pro feminist arguments I hear today are about freedom, when they wish to repress the freedom of other women because it goes against their cause.

I say fuck feminism and fuck manism and let everyone be assholes to each other. THEN we get equality.

Quote me one person who's advocating censorship or taking away freedoms of others in this thread in the name of feminism. ONE.

In fact, I'd just love it if some of these folks giving these examples of crazy rampant feminism run wild and oppressing the mans of the world can start citing some fucking sources, because a lot o these stories sound like the same old bullshit attempts to de-legitimize feminism.

A questionable story I heard earlier in this thread: A woman giving you shit for holding the door open for her (in the name of feminism), and then giving you shit later for not holding the door open for her (in the name of chivalry)? Hmm, smells like bullshit. Either that or congrats, you've ran into the one truly crazy person to do this, and now you have a fun story to tell when talking about your feminazi's taking over.

I know you edited out your reply to my post but I have to ask, what's tyo?

Haha, probably a typo, I honestly don't remember what I was originally planning on responding to you with. I just posted this reply and noticed I forgot to delete an aborted reply that obviously got posted with it.

 

[Mimssy]

How precisely did they stop them from doing it?

Also, feminists in the 1960s aren't the same feminists that exist now.

See, the whole 'is it sexist or isn't it' in terms of playboy and other forms of porn (whether soft or hardcore) is the line between being unashamed of your sexuality, and being exploited because of your sexuality. Is doing a nude photoshoot just selling yourself out for male titilation, or is it a bold statement of a lack of shame over the body? At the time, softcore porn mags were a new thing, so it was ambiguous just which of the two it was. Now it's fairly obvious. You're not making any sort of bold statement if you're in playboy - accordingly, opinion has shifted. See?

On the flipside, depending on your public image, posing could be a big political step and means of greater exposure (not a pun). Not to mention Hef really forks out when he has to.

Women are still discriminated against by the army here. Army only conscripts men, which is very sexist, so no, I don't think it's gone far enough.

What's that? Feminisist are strangely quiet on this issue? Blimey.

Physical professions will always be dominated by men. Shout about inequality but physically men and women are not equal. This fact is not chauvinist, sexist or in anyway a means of keeping women down, it's the way we are built... from day one.

A lot of people don't want to see women as a killing machine either. The US Marine Corp is not a nice place for women...

 

[Mimssy]

Ok...I don't want to start a war..or get shouted at...but I really think that feminism has gone a bit to far. I mean that I think that the feminists have done what they set out to do and now they are just trying to make them selves better then men.

Tell me what you think of feminism...and please don't flame me. Please?

Wow...
There's a difference between female supremacy and feminism. The latter of those 2 want equality with men, which has not been obtained. We are legal in the US under law, but not socially. We still do not earn equal pay for equal work, as an example. There are still many social inequalities, but since I'm guessing you are male, you wouldn't have to deal with it. You are judging us by the actions of a few. Most of my friends are male and I have no hatred of men, despite having been raped. I'm not in the minority of feminists when it comes to how we feel about men.

 

[Charli]

There is Feminism and then Femenazi-ism

Learn the boundary between the two. I think Humon of Deviant art did a nice visual for such purposes.

 

[Communist partisan]

Femenism is ok but femenazi-ism is yust too much.

 

[Serenegoose]

In summary: Equal means equal. I think in the more modern countries, women are equals now, but the annoying thing is that they keep pushing for more rights. They've become equal. What more do they want?

They're encouraged to be sexually repressed, because if you're sexual you're a slut. They're encouraged to be quiet around others because being outspoken is bitchy.

Actually, I see men who act like "sluts" as, wait for it, sluts, I refer to them as man-whores.
I also see a man who acts like a "*****" in the same negative light as a woman who acts like a *****, they're both fucking annoying, demanding, selfish etc.

Most of the stuff feminists come up with are just assumptions about what guys are thinking.

Yes, obviously, if men and women act in the same negative way we should see them in the same negative light. What I'm saying is that women are often criticised far more harshly for things that men can take for granted (and I know this for certain) - my example about being 'outspoken' in men is to have strong opinions, to be confident - if a woman is outspoken there will be a lot of people who just think she's a *****.

 

[Liquid Paradox]

Sorry, I have to point this out.
So then, men have no stupid, social stigmas attached to them by the female population?
Men are stupid, men are lazy, all guys only ever think with their dick... My sister has a sign on her bedroom door which reads: MENopause, MENstruation, MENtal anxiety... Ever notice how all our problems start with men?
The fact is that it's a double standard, and it's bullshit.
Ever see a commercial where a woman is made to look stupid, only to be shown up by her obviously more intelligent husband? I doubt it... woman's rights activists would have a field day. And yet, every day I watch a commercial where a husband stupidly stares at a little packet of dish detergent, to which the obviously more intelligent wife states "just put it in the dish washer." Another shows a man holding and revving a power drill, all ready to hook up some new feature for the television, while the more intelligent woman simply plugs it in. And then, makes some snarky comment about how her husband is really handy around the house.
So please, please tell me all about how men and women aren't treated equally. Tell me that men are loud, obnoxious, overtly sexual, chauvinistic pigs, all without the faintest bit of irony.

 

[cainstwin]

Just because a specific feminist group has done things you think have gone too far doesn't mean you should title your thread Feminism: Has it gone too far

That's like saying Capitalism: has it gone too far? It means so very little.

Dear God, the generalizations in here. "You know this one woman I met this one time, God she was such an entitled *****. It's those Goddamn feminists and they're agenda for this country."

Can some one at least try to criticize actual Feminist theorists instead of bitching about random people they know.

sorry,a touch off topic but i feel i haveto argue that in some countries capatilism has gone too far, to the point where people will put lives at risk to enforce it. The best example is people trying to block the national healthcare system proposed in the states (excuse me if this is outdated, I find reading the news depressing so i can get a bit out of touch), on the basis that a national health care system is socialist. That it may be, but it also saves the lives of people who wouldn't be insured otherwise.
OT: Generally i have no issue with most femenists, who im sure are very nice people (unfortunately i dont really know any. There are some however that do seem to go a bit nuts over the matter. On the army topic discussed earlier, I don't fully understand why women have a physical disadvantage when so many jobs in the army don't require a huge amount of physical prowess. Like bieng an engineer for a ship in the navy, can't a women do that job with equal prowess?

 

[scythecow]

Women have equal rights in a lot of places more or less, but with gender roles and culture and society there will still be inequalities.

It's fine to raise your children a little differently by gender.

Obviously there are some physical differences which lead us to segregate the sexes in a few ways. Separate bathrooms and sports teams and such. This is okay.
I'm sure we could acclimate to a world where everything is unisex, but there would be whole new issues there. Especially on the long road to achieving it, and the result isn't worth it. I don't think most women really want to share bathrooms with guys if they can help it, especially in the US.

The only thing feminists really have left to fight for is better education and parenting.

If a man does or does not hold a door open for a woman and she makes any assumptions then she's already in the wrong. Maybe he holds the door open for everyone, or he was harmlessly raised to do so for girls and a lot of ladies still like chivalry so that's fine! A big problem is people becoming overly concerned with political correctness. Courtesy towards women is just fine.

Because there are social inequalities and because the genders are both treated and expect to be treated differently, we have to embrace the differences. You can't fight certain things. It's okay for a guy to treat girls better than he does anyone else.

Feminazis who want women to have more power than men only empower sexism. They demean feminism. Humans are all very similar and power struggles are a sad thing.

I believe in equal rights. I also believe in acknowledging real differences, whether they're created by society or not. Once you acknowledge that the differences exist, you can work to change them if you like. Women should generally be paid as much as men, yes. Of course! I don't like it when anyone - male or female - is taken advantage of and underpaid.

It's the real inequalities that we should not try to equalize.

If we eliminate gender roles and women start taking testosterone or something to increase muscle mass until they're equal with the male average, and we genetically engineer all males to be capable of bearing children and ultimately make everyone a hermaphrodite then we can have more equality I guess... but it wouldn't be pretty. Literally!
And it's okay for a woman to want to look pretty according to whatever definitions of beauty she has.

So basically, feminism is fine and has not gone too far but it is undermined by psychopathic feminazis doing radical things in the name of feminism (wrongly).

 

[Neo10101]

I personally think that the scales of equality between men and women are now in women favor. It used to be the complete opposite but that doesn't automatically give women the right to take advantage of them. If a woman hits a man nothing happens or if the man tries to call the cops then they say its nothing or the woman claims he was going to hit her and hes arrested, if a man hits a woman, bam, jail time, huge fine, etc. If a divorce occurs, who gets the children? Who gets the majority of the assets/money, who HAS to pay the other one? Not the man. Ever hear of a man getting sexually assaulted by a woman, maybe, but most likely not. This is usually because the HR department wont even believe them. Yet if a woman claims sexual harassment on a man, she can get away with it usually without any hard evidence. So in a nut shell, yea I think feminists have gone a bit too far. If anything we may need masculnists.

 

[One of Many]

Feminists are fine. Radical feminists, who I like to call "Feminazis", are not. They are pretty awful people, about on par with white supremacists in their ignorance and hatred of the world around them. One good example is that totally whacked-out ***** who wrote a mind-meltingly idiotic "review" of Firefly, in which she insisted that Wash regularly rapes Zoe and that Joss Whedon rapes his own wife, among many other awful things.

Here it is, in all it's revolting glory. (I found it again just now by googling "crazy feminist ***** Firefly review") http://users.livejournal.com/_allecto_/34718.html

Reading it certainly inspired hatred in me--hatred of this woman.

I know not all feminists are like this pathetic piece of shit, but it pains me to read all the comments supporting her dementia.

I am now consumed with rage after reading the first page of her so-called "review" and really want to kill something.

Oh for the love of curds and whey! Seriously, I just read thet review and i seriously want to make sure that woman never writes anything ever again. As a woman I am really annoyed, this crazy person seems to have no concept of history, evolution, logic and REALITY! I am going to go punch something now.

I have a couple of hammers laying around the house, want to go smash her fingers?

 

[scythecow]

Sorry, I have to point this out.
So then, men have no stupid, social stigmas attached to them by the female population?
Men are stupid, men are lazy, all guys only ever think with their dick... My sister has a sign on her bedroom door which reads: MENopause, MENstruation, MENtal anxiety... Ever notice how all our problems start with men?
The fact is that it's a double standard, and it's bullshit.
Ever see a commercial where a woman is made to look stupid, only to be shown up by her obviously more intelligent husband? I doubt it... woman's rights activists would have a field day. And yet, every day I watch a commercial where a husband stupidly stares at a little packet of dish detergent, to which the obviously more intelligent wife states "just put it in the dish washer." Another shows a man holding and revving a power drill, all ready to hook up some new feature for the television, while the more intelligent woman simply plugs it in. And then, makes some snarky comment about how her husband is really handy around the house.
So please, please tell me all about how men and women aren't treated equally. Tell me that men are loud, obnoxious, overtly sexual, chauvinistic pigs, all without the faintest bit of irony.

You're right that there is a double standard. We've become overly sensitive with women in a lot of areas which opened the door to demeaning men specifically because to demean women in these sensitive times would be a nightmare of bad publicity for whoever authorized it. And so the female gender is overprotected, demeaning women in a different way. I think the whole thing only widens the rift we've created between genders. Everyone should be mocked equally!

I've run into and known a lot of girls who are quick to take issue with the entire male population over things that are not about men vs. women. I don't know if they actually believe men are evil or if it seemed like a good scapegoat. Either way, this is not the direction we want to go in.

 

[Bobzer77]

Women just want to be equal to men,

this shows a lack of ambition which is why men are better.


[small]jking jking [/small]

 

[skips]

In summary: Equal means equal. I think in the more modern countries, women are equals now, but the annoying thing is that they keep pushing for more rights. They've become equal. What more do they want?

Yeah, they get on average paid less than men for the same work.
They're more likely to be assaulted, infinitely more likely to be raped, and more likely to be killed.
They're encouraged to be sexually repressed, because if you're sexual you're a slut. They're encouraged to be quiet around others because being outspoken is bitchy.
Femininity itself is associated with being vapid (like duh), shallow (all girls think about is shoes!), meek (save me, manly mansome!) and submissive.

Think about it for a moment. When was the last time you seen a woman start one of these 'has feminism gone too far?!' threads? Yeah, because it is almost always guys saying WOMEN ARE TRYING TO BE SUPERIOR NOW.

Err... no. Sorry. Not the case.

Yes, this exactly. Thank you.

Sexism is still extremely prominent in society today. Feminism hasn't gone far enough, imo.

Of course men are negatively stereotyped as well. However, that's more in media, etc than in serious issues today (careers, education).

Also, USA/Canada != the rest of the world.

 

[cyber_andyy]

My perspective on the subject:

I believe in common sense above all, and in this case I am a full supporter on feminism. However, like all things, this isn't a clear cut issue.

Maternity leave is the best example.

Here (UK), woman can get paid maternity leave for around 6 Months generally speaking, men can get a paternity leave for a smaller amount of time.

This to me seems perfectly fare, of course it it depends on who you work for, but I see this as something the family should think about. our bring something into the world that takes a lot of care and money. The woman should get maternity leave, they need to take this time of to bond with the child, and raise it. However, They shouldn't expect a ridiculous amount of free money. Its career or child. I personally believe at least one parent should leave work to raise the child full time. Who ever this is depends on the couple, but I don't think you should expect both.

This brings me nicely onto my next area: Employment. In the UK, anyone can become anyone as long as they have the requirements for the job. Excellent yes? well...not quite. Now, as a fact of life, man is best at somethings, woman better at others. For example, I can swing that hammer harder than a woman, where as the woman can aim that hammer better. It provides an interesting choice for employers, and not only that, in the business environment, With two identical candidates bar sex, who do you choose? The woman through fear of feminist backlash? The man because of Bros before hoes? The one you got on with the best? Again, no easy answers.

Easy answers are presented, in attitudes towards women. A woman is not a slut if shes sexual. She is if she bears the title 'Village bike'. Just like a man who goes around sleeping with as many people as possible, treating women like sacks of pleasure for his convenience, is a using, man-whore pig. The problem is...this isn't really pointed out by the layman. Girls notice it, some media notices it, but my mate Nathan, My mate Will, all don't. And hence the jokes about getting laid.

Note that the definition of a 'Slut' or a Man-whore is subjective, So I wont discuss my views here...another thread, another time.

Subjective are a womans personal views on what she wants as well. Some woman hate being hit on, so love it. Its all depends. (The same could be said for guys, but the distribution is much more weighted) This could be the ignition for the OP, where one womans hostile and misguided approach leads to the impression of feminism to far.

This last paragraph highlights the problem for me. The Gun at the start of the race. Feminism has been bad mouthed in recent years. Its gotten to point where all acts of feminism are considered hostile and absurd. A very vocal minority are like this, however most aim for a good goal. Just like a very vocal - not so - minority of men think with the wrong head.

Thinking with our heads is whats needed, we need to address the real issues of sexual discrimination. To women, and in some cases men.

 

[Hatchet90]

Feminism is a just another form of nagging.

 

[Ekonk]

You're treading on the thin ice above the deep waters of sexism here...