Gay Olympics....Wtf!!

[Owyn_Merrilin]

This thread brought the humorous mental image of a guy trying to grab another guy's ass as they run a race.

It gave me the mental image of someone asking what's different about it, and the response being "well, the homo-eroticism during the greco-roman wrestling portion is no longer latent. And that's about it."

And that is indeed, about all I have to say about this.

 

[lacktheknack]

Anyone can participate, regardless of ability, age, sexual orientation, race, gender, nationality, political or religious beliefs, ethnic origins, or HIV status. Athletes represent their cities and not their countries.

This isn't the "Gay Games". This is the "Open To All" games.

I'm assuming it's just tradition for it to be the "Gay Games", then?

Also,

The Games define winning as achieving one's personal best.

Oh, for heaven's sakes. I got this enough in high school, and a fat lot of good it did me in university.

 

[lacktheknack]

*sigh* Wow.

First people have problem with a gay con. Now they have a problem with the Gay Games which are held since 1982. And they post question that can only be regarded as stupid. Why? Read the FAQ, most questions asked here are answered there. Why the need for a seperate Olympics that promotes all sexualities etc.

/golfclap

Escapist...

Pray tell, what is y'all problem with events catering to specific demographics that aren't you? Do you feel so fucking entitled to every event catering only to your tastes?

Please stop jumping on people who are saying "I don't think this is necessary" with comments like this.

It only creates animosity between the gay and straight communities.

 

[DementedSheep]

I would guess there is a Gay Olympics for the same reason you get regional or race based Olympics. I assume its a pride thing for the community. You know? show casing achievements and "heroes" and such to give members of the community people to look up to and be inspired by. Also I imagine they get shit in the regular Olympics.

Sorry if i'm completely off on that.

 

[idarkphoenixi]

Gay olympics? Are these challenges in being gay, or doing gay things?

I keep thinking of when Mr. Slave proved his skills in front of Paris Hilton in South Park.

 

[likalaruku]

I'm going to guess it's gay because it will include gratuitous nudity, pitting only man against man & woman against woman. There will be naked wrestling, mud wrestling, & jello wrestling.

 

[Zack Alklazaris]

One day the world will wake up and realize that if we just treat everyone equally there wont be any need for this bullshit. We wouldn't need a gay Olympics because there would already (and probably is) gays in the main one. We wouldn't need affirmative action because people will realize that its not minorities that need that power its the poor and uneducated, we wont need a women's rights group because people will treat them as equally as they treat a man with all the pros and cons attached. When will we stop using our differences like a badge of honor and instead concentrate society itself.

Then of course I'm only 27 I could talking out my ass and not realize it. Look I have nothing against a race, a sexual preference, or a specific class of people. I just see society celebrating its differences such as race, culture, status, sex, etc and it just feels wrong. We should not be celebrating what we are doesn't that just reinforce social division? Instead why not celebrate on who we are who we are striving to become.

 

[Something Amyss]

I think the most prevalent activists of the LGBTQ do a really good job of demonizing people who would potentially help them out. The average person is a little bit ignorant of a lot of things, but once you victimize yourself with them you PLACE them in a role that they probably never wanted to be in in the first place.

I wonder how someone might respond to that statement....

I just think it gets overexaggerated in the worst way possible, and let me explain that because I have a legitimate point.

Indeed, TomLikesGuitar, only moments before.

It sounds like another thing where the gay community is saying, "We don't feel alright around you because you are all jerks." and that's NOT how you get me to want to fight for you.

And you seem to be overly sensitive about such things, bordering on a false sense of persecution. This sort of hyperbolic statement exemplifies that.

The thing is, the LGBTQ won't get me under it's flag with this kind of bullshit.

The kind of bullshit you are making up and then flinging at them? Of course not, honey. I doubt they're trying to court that crowd, anyway.

 

[aba1]

Does there really need to be one? I don't think there's any special rule saying you can't take part in the Olympics just because you bat-for-the-other-team.

This bugs me because a lot of gay people call for being treated equally (which I think they should, though its not something I'm going to spend time protesting or campaigning for etc.) and then they do things like this (yes, I know its not all gay people). Just seems like a sign that they want to be treated different.

I wonder how this post would have looked in the 60s. "Do we really need black rights protests? Why do blacks segregate themselves like this? Just seems like a sign that they want to be treated different."

: I think many people miss the point of such ventures because they're too busy being offended.

In the 60's they fought to get rid of things separating "blacks" and everyone else not start them that is the difference.

Besides the idea behind this is nice equality and free opportunity good sportsmanship etc but the title and a few other things imply that it isn't for everyone it is for homosexuals and anyone else they will just deal with. It would be like if there was a straight Olympics but they said ohh don't worry we will still let homosexuals be there, sure anyone can join but it is made clear not everyone is really welcome.

 

[Something Amyss]

Almost nobody has a problem with The Gay Olympics.

Then what's all the whining about? Surely, it's not necessary to whine and ***** and berate people because something is deemed unnecessary, so that seems to rule out your primary statement (as this thread is rife with just that).

I would have thought the level of homophobia in the sporting world (and in the world in general) would make it obvious why gay people might want a gay Olympics.

And that's exactly right. Look at the commentary from gay athletes and you will see a lot of homophobia in the locker rooms.

I only recently signed up to the forums here, and genuinely thought people would be more open-minded.

Welcome. Sorry the as a whole tend to disappoint, but I think you will find this to be pretty common on the internet. It's the last place where people can whine about being persecuted by a minority without being laughed at.

*looks at Fox News*

Okay, next to last.

One day the world will wake up and realize that if we just treat everyone equally there wont be any need for this bullshit. We wouldn't need a gay Olympics because there would already (and probably is) gays in the main one. We wouldn't need affirmative action because people will realize that its not minorities that need that power its the poor and uneducated, we wont need a women's rights group because people will treat them as equally as they treat a man with all the pros and cons attached. When will we stop using our differences like a badge of honor and instead concentrate society itself.

Then of course I'm only 27 I could talking out my ass and not realize it. Look I have nothing against a race, a sexual preference, or a specific class of people. I just see society celebrating its differences such as race, culture, status, sex, etc and it just feels wrong. We should not be celebrating what we are doesn't that just reinforce social division? Instead why not celebrate on who we are who we are striving to become.

This is not a new or unique thought. The problem is, you have to get there first.

If celebrating diversity separates us, then we are clearly not there.

 

[aba1]

*sigh* Wow.

First people have problem with a gay con. Now they have a problem with the Gay Games which are held since 1982. And they post question that can only be regarded as stupid. Why? Read the FAQ, most questions asked here are answered there. Why the need for a seperate Olympics that promotes all sexualities etc.

/golfclap

Escapist...

Pray tell, what is y'all problem with events catering to specific demographics that aren't you? Do you feel so fucking entitled to every event catering only to your tastes?

Please stop jumping on people who are saying "I don't think this is necessary" with comments like this.

It only creates animosity between the gay and straight communities.

I agree except for the bit about the straight community. There is no straight community there are no straight groups or unified opinions or anything that would group straight people together outside the fact that we like the opposite gender which that in of itself doesn't support a entire community. A community implies we get together as a group based around being straight as a common attribute which I have never seen though I suppose it is possible XD.

 

[Canadish]

Snip

First, thanks for the good reply there. It's nice to see a reasonable argument without buzzwords and ad-hom for once.

Having read your post, I can get the comfort factor now.

It's always tricky talking about any topic like this, everyone comes into the debate with different personal experiences and there tends to be a trend of both sides assuming the other are sitting on one extreme or the other based on a few stand-out obnoxious examples.

It sounds like your own experiences with homophobia have been pretty bad, you have my condolences. It might be a cultural thing, I'm not sure where you're from (often a problem with any internet conversation) so I can't say what it's like where you live or try presume. For my own part, I've just not really seen it here in the UK in the same way it used to be about 7 years ago. It seemed to die off quite a while back.
People just don't tend to use "fag" much anymore, if ever, and "gay" stopped getting used with a negative connotation years ago. Saying most "most straight communities use it as an insult" just imminently doesn't sit right with me.
The media here has really strong representation (perhaps even a slight over-representation in honesty) and universally uses a positive and respectful perspective.
Even back when I was a school, most of the guys were happy for any of the fellas when they came out. Especially among those who'd come under the "gamer culture".

I just wanted that to be clear, so when I say I just don't understand why the gay community wouldn't feel comfortable at a normal event, you understand my perspective on it. From my own experiences, gamers are a pretty happy welcoming lot and always have been. The only place I've ever seen accusations of our community being misogynistic, homophobic and racist are on these internet news sites along with Tumblr, and the only place I've seen it in action is when I play games like Call of Duty or Halo online, and it's always just stupid kids every damn time. They're not really apart of the culture or any serious voice for us.
It would be like saying all movies are homophobic based on Transformers. It's just surface level garbage.

Gauging from what a lot of people here are saying, I'm assuming there might be a lot of other people in my boat on this. Again, I could be wrong, but that is how it seems to me. No one is giving me the Westboro baptist church vibe here.

The fact that the homosexual community wants there own game convention implies they don't feel welcome at regular gamer cons, which in turn is implying there is something wrong with the community many of us have been a part of for years and in some cases even helped build. Backed up by this recent wave of accusations of pretty much EVERYTHING under the sun lately, it feels like an attack on us, based on a false charge which most of us haven't partaken in.
We're being lumped in with a few loudmouth assholes based on our race, gender and sexuality, and from speaking to people, it's just antagonizing people who probably want to help (and being hypocritical at the same time I might add).
So the reaction is just one of confusion from most of us here, and perhaps slightly hurt.

Then it turns into a big issue when you get responses like;

I think this needs to be addressed again.

Spoiler

Immature little snide insinuations. Ad-hom attacks. Dodging the issue and the real meat of the debate.

For every great, reasonable post like yours, there seems to be 10 outraged social justice warriors calling people homophobes for just raising an eyebrow when they see the announcement of a Gaymer con filled with attacks on the gamer community and using "straight white male" like it's some kind of dirty buzzword.

Entitlement gets thrown around a lot, but I'll not open that bag of cats. Needless to say, I really don't think that is the issue at hand here. It's certainly not on my own part at the very least. It just doesn't come into this as far as I can see.
I think 90% of gamers are nice people. It's a particularly nice community from what I've seen actually, if one that likes to crack a lot of jokes. Maybe now that a lot more people are coming into it has changed that in the last 5 years, I don't know. I'm just not ready to condemn the community over a few X-Box Live kiddies and a couple of horrible stand out examples (the fat streetfighter guy).
I think most people are just passing through and catching snippets of news here, then getting confused when they're being told they're the bad guy for asking a very reasonable question.

Anyway, thanks again for the reply. Sorry for the wall of text there, but I was just coming grips with it as I was typing that out there.

All the best.

 

[101flyboy]

*sigh* Wow.

First people have problem with a gay con. Now they have a problem with the Gay Games which are held since 1982. And they post question that can only be regarded as stupid. Why? Read the FAQ, most questions asked here are answered there. Why the need for a seperate Olympics that promotes all sexualities etc.

/golfclap

Escapist...

Pray tell, what is y'all problem with events catering to specific demographics that aren't you? Do you feel so fucking entitled to every event catering only to your tastes?

Please stop jumping on people who are saying "I don't think this is necessary" with comments like this.

It only creates animosity between the gay and straight communities.

The question that hasn't been raised and truthfully does need to be raised is:

Is there hostility between gay/strongly pro-gay straight folk, and your average straight person?

It may be a sad answer, but a truthful answer to say...........yes. Yes, there is hostility between your average straight person and the gay community, and especially gay/pro-gay straight activists.

It's clear, not just on this forum but in general, from what I've seen, many straight people are finding themselves feeling victimized or interrogated and more or less looked upon like haters and stupid, if they don't go along with the proverbial demands being enforced onto them by gay/pro-gay straight individuals. Gay/pro-gay straights are tired of the inquisitions, are jaded and are becoming a lot more forceful in their position and speaking their minds.

Are their feelings valid, the straights who feel victimized? No. They aren't, but they're there, due to ignorance, confusion, feelings of threat, feelings of being rushed into something they're not ready for. We're in a weird moment in the gay rights fight. Social attitudes have progressed beyond individual attitudes. So there is still a lot of apprehension yet no-one wants to be seen as a bigot. There's simply a lot more awareness and education necessary to assuage people and help them realize that there isn't an anti-straight witch hunt in place.

 

[BlumiereBleck]

If straight people are allowed to participate does this mean it's more of a 'Happy Olympics?'

 

[Abomination]

Snip

Spoiler: SNIP

First, thanks for the good reply there. It's nice to see a reasonable argument without buzzwords and ad-hom for once.

Having read your post, I can get the comfort factor now.

It's always tricky talking about any topic like this, everyone comes into the debate with different personal experiences and there tends to be a trend of both sides assuming the other are sitting on one extreme or the other based on a few stand-out obnoxious examples.

It sounds like your own experiences with homophobia have been pretty bad, you have my condolences. It might be a cultural thing, I'm not sure where you're from (often a problem with any internet conversation) so I can't say what it's like where you live or try presume. For my own part, I've just not really seen it here in the UK in the same way it used to be about 7 years ago. It seemed to die off quite a while back.
People just don't tend to use "fag" much anymore, if ever, and "gay" stopped getting used with a negative connotation years ago. Saying most "most straight communities use it as an insult" just imminently doesn't sit right with me.
The media here has really strong representation (perhaps even a slight over-representation in honesty) and universally uses a positive and respectful perspective.
Even back when I was a school, most of the guys were happy for any of the fellas when they came out. Especially among those who'd come under the "gamer culture".

I just wanted that to be clear, so when I say I just don't understand why the gay community wouldn't feel comfortable at a normal event, you understand my perspective on it. From my own experiences, gamers are a pretty happy welcoming lot and always have been. The only place I've ever seen accusations of our community being misogynistic, homophobic and racist are on these internet news sites along with Tumblr, and the only place I've seen it in action is when I play games like Call of Duty or Halo online, and it's always just stupid kids every damn time. They're not really apart of the culture or any serious voice for us.
It would be like saying all movies are homophobic based on Transformers. It's just surface level garbage.

Gauging from what a lot of people here are saying, I'm assuming there might be a lot of other people in my boat on this. Again, I could be wrong, but that is how it seems to me. No one is giving me the Westboro baptist church vibe here.

The fact that the homosexual community wants there own game convention implies they don't feel welcome at regular gamer cons, which in turn is implying there is something wrong with the community many of us have been a part of for years and in some cases even helped build. Backed up by this recent wave of accusations of pretty much EVERYTHING under the sun lately, it feels like an attack on us, based on a false charge which most of us haven't partaken in.
We're being lumped in with a few loudmouth assholes based on our race, gender and sexuality, and from speaking to people, it's just antagonizing people who probably want to help (and being hypocritical at the same time I might add).
So the reaction is just one of confusion from most of us here, and perhaps slightly hurt.

Then it turns into a big issue when you get responses like;

I think this needs to be addressed again.

Spoiler

Immature little snide insinuations. Ad-hom attacks. Dodging the issue and the real meat of the debate.

For every great, reasonable post like yours, there seems to be 10 outraged social justice warriors calling people homophobes for just raising an eyebrow when they see the announcement of a Gaymer con filled with attacks on the gamer community and using "straight white male" like it's some kind of dirty buzzword.

Entitlement gets thrown around a lot, but I'll not open that bag of cats. Needless to say, I really don't think that is the issue at hand here. It's certainly not on my own part at the very least. It just doesn't come into this as far as I can see.
I think 90% of gamers are nice people. It's a particularly nice community from what I've seen actually, if one that likes to crack a lot of jokes. Maybe now that a lot more people are coming into it has changed that in the last 5 years, I don't know. I'm just not ready to condemn the community over a few X-Box Live kiddies and a couple of horrible stand out examples (the fat streetfighter guy).
I think most people are just passing through and catching snippets of news here, then getting confused when they're being told they're the bad guy for asking a very reasonable question.

Anyway, thanks again for the reply. Sorry for the wall of text there, but I was just coming grips with it as I was typing that out there.

All the best.

Thank you and very well put.

It is most distressing to be placed in the same camp as the most fundamentally bigoted anti-homosexual loudmouths due to a slight deviation from the perfect homosexual "ally".

Raise a question about a method and suddenly you become lumped in as "part of the problem" by a very large contingent of "social justice warriors" who can't seem to distinguish an enemy from a friendly, if neutral, party.

Being guilty due to being a "white heterosexual male" is a most grave strategic diplomatic error in the homosexuals' fight for equality. Hurling abuse and guilt ridden accusations at those who are desired to be allies.

 

[Abomination]

Spoiler: Snip

Thank you and very well put.

It is most distressing to be placed in the same camp as the most fundamentally bigoted anti-homosexual loudmouths due to a slight deviation from the perfect homosexual "ally".

Raise a question about a method and suddenly you become lumped in as "part of the problem" by a very large contingent of "social justice warriors" who can't seem to distinguish an enemy from a friendly, if neutral, party.

Being guilty due to being a "white heterosexual male" is a most grave strategic diplomatic error in the homosexuals' fight for equality. Hurling abuse and guilt ridden accusations at those who are desired to be allies.

You think homosexuality is unnatural. You are no ally and you haven't shown one hint of desire to become one. You are at most, respectful. And respectful is good. But are you apart of our team? Are you truly accepting and supportive? No, you are not.

Now to turn this into a straight white male situation, and act like a victim. You are not a victim. You need to get over yourself and start looking at this from the perspective of someone who is NOT privileged beyond what a gay man could ever hope for.

With the amount of progress we've made as a community over the past couple years, I think we're doing something right. You are a real piece of work. Patronizing, arrogant, self-centered and offensive. Get over yourself.

Like I was saying.

Hold an opinion not 100% in line with the eventual homosexual utopia and get called "Patronizing, arrogant, self-centered and offensive." and be told to "Get over yourself."

No question as to my actions, of course. No query as to the number of gay rights protests I have attended or been in support of, no question as to what legislation I have voted for that supported homosexual rights, no concern for anything practical.

Hold an opinion that isn't 100% in line and get constantly harangued by an individual.

 

[101flyboy]

Entitlement gets thrown around a lot, but I'll not open that bag of cats. Needless to say, I really don't think that is the issue at hand here. It's certainly not on my own part at the very least. It just doesn't come into this as far as I can see.
I think 90% of gamers are nice people. It's a particularly nice community from what I've seen actually, if one that likes to crack a lot of jokes. Maybe now that a lot more people are coming into it has changed that in the last 5 years, I don't know. I'm just not ready to condemn the community over a few X-Box Live kiddies and a couple of horrible stand out examples (the fat streetfighter guy).
I think most people are just passing through and catching snippets of news here, then getting confused when they're being told they're the bad guy for asking a very reasonable question.

Anyway, thanks again for the reply. Sorry for the wall of text there, but I was just coming grips with it as I was typing that out there.

All the best.

I truly value this post you made, it was very well thought out and clearly you put a lot of thought into what you wanted to type, and that has to be respected.

I just wanted to touch on a couple points. First, I don't think anyone is outright annoyed that the question "why do gay people need their own events" is being asked. It's not necessarily the question that causes annoyance. More the attitude that people are being a little dense and refusing to look at things from our perspective as LGBTQ persons. And not seeing what we have to say, not taking into account what we as people who are not straight, have to say regarding these matters. And what straight allies have to say regarding these matters.

It feels like..........."Okay, these people are being intentionally obtuse and reactionary, and want to have a problem". It feels like we're being ignored, shouted down by people who make the worst of our intentions, it feels like people just want to prove whatever bias they have against the community and jump on things like this to validate them even though this in no way is segregating straight people.

People are becoming very jaded of having to answer the same question that has been asked about 300 times the past few weeks in different ways, on this very forum. People are jaded and annoyed. And at this point it's hard to see who is asking the question out of curiosity and who is doing so to be dismissive and divisive.

We're not trying to make all heterosexual gamers feel like you're bad people. Or that all heterosexual gamers are the problem. This isn't a gay vs straight issue. It's an issue of bigotry. And although you may not see it yourself, I feel it, and so do several others here.............and that's because we're gay ourselves and we have a more direct sense of homophobia around us. We have that radar on at all times that you wouldn't have. We see the small things that you may not pick up. And it's enough bigotry to make people feel uncomfortable.

The answer to that is NOT telling people they're overreacting, it's not saying that we're wrong for feeling the way we do, and it's not telling us we're wrong for doing what we feel necessary to look out for the members in our community. The answer to the questions you may have regarding events such as Gaymercon and the Gay Olympics is listening to people who are in a better position to educate and make you aware on issues within the gay community in the gaming world, and the gay community in the world at large. Listen and learn. The constant interjections, assumptions, and judgments----not cool. It's not cool at all, it's not our fault for making it clear it's not cool.

 

[Ronin08]

Wasn't there JUST a Critical Miss about this very subject?

EDIT: That is to say, the reaction to specific groups wanting to host their own friendly gatherings/competitions, and the somewhat uncouth reactions to them as such.

 

[101flyboy]

Spoiler: Snip

Thank you and very well put.

It is most distressing to be placed in the same camp as the most fundamentally bigoted anti-homosexual loudmouths due to a slight deviation from the perfect homosexual "ally".

Raise a question about a method and suddenly you become lumped in as "part of the problem" by a very large contingent of "social justice warriors" who can't seem to distinguish an enemy from a friendly, if neutral, party.

Being guilty due to being a "white heterosexual male" is a most grave strategic diplomatic error in the homosexuals' fight for equality. Hurling abuse and guilt ridden accusations at those who are desired to be allies.

You think homosexuality is unnatural. You are no ally and you haven't shown one hint of desire to become one. You are at most, respectful. And respectful is good. But are you apart of our team? Are you truly accepting and supportive? No, you are not.

Now to turn this into a straight white male situation, and act like a victim. You are not a victim. You need to get over yourself and start looking at this from the perspective of someone who is NOT privileged beyond what a gay man could ever hope for.

With the amount of progress we've made as a community over the past couple years, I think we're doing something right. You are a real piece of work. Patronizing, arrogant, self-centered and offensive. Get over yourself.

Like I was saying.

Hold an opinion not 100% in line with the eventual homosexual utopia and get called "Patronizing, arrogant, self-centered and offensive." and be told to "Get over yourself."

No question as to my actions, of course. No query as to the number of gay rights protests I have attended or been in support of, no question as to what legislation I have voted for that supported homosexual rights, no concern for anything practical.

Hold an opinion that isn't 100% in line and get constantly harangued by an individual.

Homosexual utopia? Right. Like, how dare people not be pleased to see someone calling our sexuality unnatural yet designate themselves as a gay ally! How dare people not hope for a society where more than a plurality don't view their orientation and love lives as disgusting! How dare we not want to be talked down regarding gay issues by a person who isn't even gay themselves! We are just asking for so much, too much. How disrespectful.