Give me a reason to play Dota 2 (EDIT: entire new OP)

[Lyri]

Now that I've already locked in at the wrong difficulty though because common sense would dictate that the game means what it says, the game is now completely ruined and I will never enjoy it. GG.

Also, you say that one game isn't enough. Maybe for the nuances - but the arcane method of buying items (or rather that it is arcane) is not exactly a nuance.

Just play, it doesn't matter if you get crushed this is a moba game and every moba is just as much about losing as it is winning.
Play against the bots if you really want to learn the game and how items interact and what heroes do, they're just as punishing as people honestly.
Infact the easy difficulty is a lot easier than bots - I found this out first hand.

No, it isn't enough and don't try to justify it either. In a game that requires knowledge of the game itself to play, learning is absolutely vital to the enjoyment.
I've never played Risk, if I go and play a game of it now and lose without understanding how the game is meant to be played do you think I'd enjoy it or just end up frustrated?
DotA is known for having a difficult entry level, if you ignore that and throw yourself into then you're just asking for the experience that you suffered.
An unpleasent first game that makes you flustered and not want to play.

This isn't like an FPS where you can pick up a grenade launcher and know what to do with it (hint: Point and shoot) but instead you have to decide if you really want that Black King Bar or if you want to get a Desolater instead.

An item that costs 2150 gold with a 3 second cooldown when you take any sort of damage, costs 75 mana, and has a 10+ second cooldown after use,

14 second cool down on Blink dagger mate, not ten.

I still laugh my ass off when you post almost the exact same thing when it comes to league of legends over and over.
I don't know what ax you have to grind, but I think it's funny I've seen pretty much the exact same post at least 5-6 times; might want to fix those blatant inaccuracies.

Look up what pay to win is, arguing that League is in any way pay 2 win is absolute nonsense. There are no flat out advantages you can buy over another player. Runes are only bought with points that you get for playing the game, you can't buy them with money. And even most people have full runes pages, so I don't see where there is this mythical pay 2 win/cash shop you constantly decry LoL for having.
The argument for pay to win is that people who don't pay don't have access to the full champion roster or page bundles with the immediacy that paying users do. Thus the paying users can afford to buy the relevant top tier champs, the non-paying users don't have access and hope that they have a counter to use. Basically it just drums down to who gets what faster, I dropped over £500 on League when I played (pretty skins ;_ there is an advantage to having any champion you want to pick at your disposal.

Rant about no mana burn or good disables...yea might want to check out those champ abilites again...there are an insane amount of diverse abilities/disables. Oh so what there is no mana burn, considering a heafty chunk of the champs in leauge don't have mana I'd hate to be rolling a champ with mana burn. And even then why does 1 MOBA game have to have the exact same ability as another?
Heroes with a manaless resource system is pretty broken in all honesty. It's true though there are only few disables in league and the heroes are pretty similar over all. Couple of heroes are neat though but not many.

Then some rant about blink? Yea there is no "blink" ability in league. Though an item with blink in it that has an obscenely short cooldown does come to mind...it's in DOTA though...

Yes they both blink you away, completely different mechanics though and it's having flash from the start of the match on any hero you want completely breaks the ability and makes it a joke.
Blink dagger isn't something you just pick up,it's a little more involved than "Lol both games have blink hur durr"

The rest is just rant.
Quite

Bold text adding to the quote

 

[NerfedFalcon]

So you're saying that saying "LoL is bad and you should feel bad" isn't also kicking a hornet's nest?

When did I say that?

Look at your first post again.

I did, still not seeing it.

So you like LoL and you want a reason to play DOTA?

It's not shit.

/thread

~wall of text snipped~

That wall of text was basically about why my opinion was wrong. (Edit: No longer confused), or do I need to un-snip the wall of text, drudge through your condescension and bold additional key quotes?

 

[NerfedFalcon]

This isn't like an FPS where you can pick up a grenade launcher and know what to do with it (hint: Point and shoot) but instead you have to decide if you really want that Black King Bar or if you want to get a Desolater instead.

Not what I meant. To buy items at base (without even getting into the badly-explained 'courier' system), you have to right click them. There is no other way of buying items. This is never explained anywhere in-game. Not even in a tooltip. This is not an action that common sense would dictate randomly testing. I was not talking about what the items do.

Besides, everyone who's ever played a game against bots in any MOBA knows that MOBA bots are bad and get you into bad habits.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

That wall of text was basically about why my opinion was wrong. Still confused, or do I need to un-snip the wall of text and bold additional key quotes?

Considering you have 4500 posts you should know my bad jokes when you see them.

Considering you have almost 7000, you should know what Poe's Law is. Also, just because I have that many posts doesn't mean I've interacted with you specifically that much.

By the same token, you should know that I take offense easily when I mistake people's jokes for being serious.

 

[Lyri]

Not what I meant. To buy items at base (without even getting into the badly-explained 'courier' system), you have to right click them. There is no other way of buying items. This is never explained anywhere in-game. Not even in a tooltip. This is not an action that common sense would dictate randomly testing. I was not talking about what the items do.

Besides, everyone who's ever played a game against bots in any MOBA knows that MOBA bots are bad and get you into bad habits.

So you have a habit from League of Legends and you're calling that a bad point for DotA two because you couldn't figure out to click the other mouse button?
You must be joking.

My point about your lack of knowledge about the game is all summed up in your last sentence.

Besides, everyone who's ever played a game against bots in any MOBA knows that MOBA bots are bad and get you into bad habits.

In League of Legends this maybe true, DotA bots are completely the opposite.

Dota bots.

- Roam to gank
- Call missing heroes.
- Do not have predictable points where they stand when in danger/low hp.
- Buy hero relevant items.
- Do Roshan (Baron)
- Call what they intend to do (pushing towers, raxes)
- Teleport back to defend
- Respond to pings on the map.
- They leave you a lane to start in, if you choose a different one an allied bot will leave to go to the other.

The Dota bots are actually good to learn against for beginners, Valve has been putting in a tonne of work into making them not retarded.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

The Dota bots are actually good to learn against for beginners, Valve has been putting in a tonne of work into making them not retarded.

At that rate, the only difference between PvAI and PvP is that there are only four people yelling at me for not knowing whether to get Black King Bar or Desolator, or the location of the secret shop, instead of nine. Actually, the other team wouldn't be yelling at me that much anyway - so there's basically no difference and therefore no point.

 

[Lyri]

At that rate, the only difference between PvAI and PvP is that there are only four people yelling at me for not knowing whether to get Black King Bar or Desolator, or the location of the secret shop, instead of nine. Actually, the other team wouldn't be yelling at me that much anyway - so there's basically no difference and therefore no point.

The bots don't tell what to do at all, I have no idea what you're trying to say here.
You can play in a match with 9 bots and learn at your own pace.

Please go look at the game before you start condemning it, you're coming off a tad ignorant.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

The bots don't tell what to do at all, I have no idea what you're trying to say here.
You can play in a match with 9 bots and learn at your own pace.

Please go look at the game before you start condemning it, you're coming off a tad ignorant.

What I'm saying is that if the game's general population is anything like you or Smash, which I get the feeling it is (I've met more of the game's population than just you) then I wouldn't be accepted there anyway.

Oh, and regarding guides: giving a guide to someone who isn't playing for money is like giving a calculus textbook to someone who doesn't know algebra.

Edit: Sorry, that was kind of a topic change. What I was saying is that why bother playing against bots if they're exactly like humans? The bots will roflstomp and I'll get demoralised just as much as if humans roflstomped. You're aware that in a game with nine skilled players, the team with the tenth will always lose?

 

[NerfedFalcon]

It seems to me you went into playing Dota 2 wanting to find things to hate about it. I mean, you felt like passing judgement on the game in it's entirety based on one bot match. That doesn't really seem fair or even logical.

It wasn't a bot match. It was PvP. You're putting words in my mouth that never came out of it. Please don't. It only makes me think less of you.

And no, I was not looking for things to hate about it. I wanted to like Dota 2, but it wouldn't let me.

 

[Kopikatsu]

If you're looking for an MOBA, why not look into Super Monday Night Combat? The player count is pretty low at the moment, but that's mostly because the devs have stopped advertising it or anything entirely until they finish porting the game over to a new version of the Unreal Engine and add more polish/improve new user experience (Getting it to a new version of UE should only be another week or so)

But still...TPS-based MOBA. What's not to like? Also, some of the guys on SMNC's dev team actually worked on Demigod.

I actually played a little bit of Super MNC after my first attempt at LoL didn't really work out. Uninstalled after I gave LoL another shot and found myself enjoying it a lot more (that was after playing Torchlight, BTW - and during Darius' first free week.) I actually won a couple of games using the Tank class, and enjoyed it quite a bit. Thanks for reminding me - I'm just reinstalling it now.

Who's on rotation, and who do you recommend to someone who doesn't really know what they're doing? (By the same token, who's the game's Ashe i.e. best one to buy first?)

Well, Megabeth is one of the best Pros in the game due to being the generalist. The difference is that while the majority of generalist-archetype characters are mediocre in most fields to balance them out, Megabeth is amazing in everything and weak in nothing.

As for the rotation...It's Assault, Cheston, Combat Girl, Veteran, and Wascot. I'd recommend trying out Veteran and Wascot, simply because of how fun the characters are. (Both skillset and personality-wise)

Edit: But like I said, playerbase is down 'cause they haven't updated in a while 'cause they're working on the new engine. Which should almost be done.

 

[corvanjer]

Wait what? You just stroll into a STRATEGY game, have no idea how to play, how to do anything but move and expect it to be fun?

Learning curve is steep? The only people who say that don't bother to scroll over items and skills and actually LEARN what they do, instead of expecting to just steamroll someone who is better at the game then you. ITT: Morons.

The only reason people say X is > Y is because they have no idea how to play the damned game. Spend a few hours LEARNING what to do...IT'S NOT FUCKING CALL OF DUTY!

 

[NerfedFalcon]

Wait what? You just stroll into a STRATEGY game, have no idea how to play, how to do anything but move and expect it to be fun?

Learning curve is steep? The only people who say that don't bother to scroll over items and skills and actually LEARN what they do, instead of expecting to just steamroll someone who is better at the game then you. ITT: Morons.

The only reason people say X is > Y is because they have no idea how to play the damned game. Spend a few hours LEARNING what to do...IT'S NOT FUCKING CALL OF DUTY!

And I thought that Smash Loves Titan Quest was bad at reading.

Edit: No, actually, he did bother reading my post. Not only did you not bother reading my post, you were also MORE condescending, somehow. And I thought Dota 2 repelled people who couldn't read.

 

[Lyri]

What I'm saying is that if the game's general population is anything like you or Smash, which I get the feeling it is (I've met more of the game's population than just you) then I wouldn't be accepted there anyway.

Oh, and regarding guides: giving a guide to someone who isn't playing for money is like giving a calculus textbook to someone who doesn't know algebra.

Edit: Sorry, that was kind of a topic change. What I was saying is that why bother playing against bots if they're almost exactly like humans?

I'm going to be honest, the reason why you're having such a hard time dealing with me or Smash is because you're responding negatively to any help given.

Case in point that remark about the guides, a good way to get into DotA is reading a guide. All I'm getting from you right now is "I want this game to let me in without the work", if that is your desire then continue to play League because DotA isn't for you at all.

I came from League and jumped into DotA when I got an invite with no experience in DotA: Allstars at all.
I've sunk thousand of hours into the game and I still have lots to learn but I enjoy it far more than League because I like the more involved complexity and nuances of the game.

I'm sorry you had one bad game and you find it fitting to completely trash it, but the faults you have with DotA are not a problem with the game itself and more of your attitude to adjust and learn something other than League of Legends.
Sorry.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

Case in point that remark about the guides, a good way to get into DotA is reading a guide. All I'm getting from you right now is "I want this game to let me in without the work", if that is your desire then continue to play League because DotA isn't for you at all.

Okay. Fine. What I meant was character guides - every single guide I've read on places like Mobafire or Solomid was for a specific character and assumed that you were at the level cap. In my experience, and now I'll admit it's limited, guides aren't written for noobs. What noobs get is a kiss on the lips and a boot in the ass out into the wild, and they have to either get lucky with their initial guesswork; have a friend help them out; or get destroyed, get demoralised and never touch the genre again.

Did you know that I actually gave up after my first LoL game as well? It was only after I found out an IRL friend of mine played the game that I started playing it again - difference being, he was nice about it, and actually did help me get to grips with the game. My 'friends' in real life who played Dota 2 weren't that nice about it, and all of them just assumed I'd know stuff like 'it's different enough from LoL that you probably should pick the 'beginner' level'.

I'm not saying I don't want to put in effort. What I'm saying is that even if I did, I still wouldn't get anywhere.