Halo 3 is only the begining!!!

[Sardaukar]

A few points.

First, why is Halo: CE considered a crispier, more delicious digital sandwich than it's transfat-loaded descendant? It's because the PC version has a Custom Edition, and that Custom Edition has a map known in our choice mortal tongue as "Yoyorast Island". This is the sole true reason for the superiority of the original Halo, all other reasons are mere propaganda; lies spread by opponents to keep the uninformed secure in their controvertible arguments and untouched by the golden glory and resolution of the Island.

Secondly, First Person Shooters are far from being "the bottom end of the sophistication barrel". Bad games are the bottom end of the sophistication barrel. I'm assuming adventure games and role-playing games are at the top of this abstract barrel of yours, and I've experienced more than enough exercises in sucktastic game design in each genre to say that claiming to be such a title does not create a minimum flooring upon which your judged quality can rest. Simply, games that suck, suck, and games that exhilarate the senses and blow the mind, do not suck. Giving a game predetermined minimum and maximum value based on it's genre is almost as pretentious as my wordiness.

My third point was, after consideration, flawed and deleted.

 

[Knight Templar]

Halo 3 was quite a dissapointment, in terms of gameplay, nothing was really improved upon and several things were messed up. Graphics looked lovely, but nothing really to match the impact of Halo: CE.

Except Halo 3 had better level design.

Whoever designed the Library deserves to die.

what about geting lost is 343 and still geting out?

 

[Knight Templar]

this thread should be about bungie not halo

 

[tiredinnuendo]

I think the more accurate analogy would be to the independent coffee shop, and the 'bland and stripped down version' of the independent coffee shop, Starbucks, with Starbucks=Halo

Although the criticism "Steal popular things from other games, simplify them to the point that anyone can pick it up and go, and make it pretty" could apply to something like say, what the Ramones did with Brian Wilson's music if we change 'pretty' to 'loud'. Personally I think that's the best analogy for what Halo is, but, whatever.

As it turns out, Starbucks is *good* for independent coffee houses: http://www.slate.com/id/2180301/pagenum/all/

I may have missed some subtle point here, but it seems like all you did here was make different analogies that would culminate in you getting to post a completely unrelated link that only proves, or rather states, that living *next* to Starbucks is good.

Nowadays, they crush you by building one down the street and around the corner.

I'm sorry if my original analogy stuck in your craw, but I don't see it refuted, and as a result all this isn't really needed.

I think a similar situation applies to shooters--now that Halo has effectively clamped down on the 'middle of the road' when it comes to all those features, *other* companies won't focus on making FPSes that attempt to be all things to all people. Instead we'll get FPSes that try and be unique in some way, that go for the niches instead of slogging it out over some golden middle demographic.

I mean, do you really think we'd have all the MMOs we do now if it *wasn't* for WoW? And further, that even a greater percentage of them would be in fantasy settings?

Finally, I find it hard to swallow all this 'oh noes, the haloz are everywhare like the fl00d' when a game like Call of Duty 4 only sold 1.1 million less copies, and actually ousted Halo 3 from the Xbox Live rankings. Or when The Orange Box beats out Halo on Amazon: http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=7639&Itemid=2

The facts...just don't support the arguments of people with the doomsday attitude. I think it's a simple as that.

I think we'd be having an MMO boom even if we didn't have WoW, although I liked the point that I think you were making about having more of them crop up in non-fantasy settings. I think that's what you were trying to say.

Maybe I'm elitist and simply don't want to acknowledge that a game as bland as Halo would outsell things that put a unique spin on things, because then I'd have to accept that the bulk of the people I share the label of "gamer" with prefer monotony. It's certainly in the cards. I also admit that it makes the back of my teeth itch when people talk about Halo's great story, when frankly the narrative was completely straightforward and the story itself was essentially empty. And driving a warthog through 'splosions while epic music plays in two different endings doesn't mean that the story is good.

Bottom of the line though, you're right, there will still be original games with interesting and unique gimmicks all their own that come out and make me smile. Anything I said to the contrary was hyperbole which was intended to make a point and may have stretched a bit too far. However, with Halo now over, there will also be a rush to make the next Halo, and man do I look forward to that shit parade.

- J

 

[Saskwach]

And once again the He-Man Halo-Haytaz Club chimes in with their annoying yipping.

Anybody bleating about how poor, unappreciated Gordon Freeman is being horribly overshadowed by the big, mean old Master Chief can please stop. Immediately. HL2 is a good game, and as a result its sales can not by any extreme stretch of the imagination be considered woeful. (No one at Valve looks to be starving anytime soon, in any case. And yes, that is a cheap shot. Sorry if you feel that's unfair; in my defense I've just watched half-an-hour's worth of Zero Punctuation episodes.) If Half-Life 2 doesn't dominate its chosen platform as much as Halo does the Xboxen, perhaps that's because there's just a few more FPS titles for Microsoft PCs than there are for Microsoft consoles and you may take whatever pride you wish from the idea that Half-Life 2 is prominent and award-festooned despite the extra competition.

I'd also like to point out that the depth-of-story in both games is perilously similar, differing largely in that one has a vaguely-developed one-sided romantic arc in progress while the other has a vaguely-developed huge backstory instead. Otherwise they're both about a mute (or nearly-mute) guy in hyper-technoarmour with a remarkable talent for killing things going around killing things in order to save Earth. If I swing my cudgels for one instead of the other, it's because I like the backstory stuff more than the romantic arc stuff.

As to those complaining that Halo 3 wasn't as ground-breaking as Halo CE, my only answer can be, "Duh, really?" Until someone invents the Re-Virginising Ray (and, let's face it, the game industry's target market scarcely seems to need such an implement) you can't replicate newness in a series without *changing* the series. For everyone whinging now about how Halo 3 isn't "new" enough, there's at least one whinging right now that too much is different from the earlier titles. (I know this far better than you can possibly imagine.) Had there been any really ground-breaking changes, the neophiles would still be miffed at the console parvenue while the fans would be absolutely apoplectic.

Besides, even here in these rarified halls of cogitation the concept of "innovation" is some sort of vaguely-held ideal that's more fannish bullet-point than well-considered wish; for proof, note that the vast majority of those answering the Blizzard poll in the forums here are absolutely gagging for some form of retread or other and can't be bothered to click the "New IP" button even though they don't have to expend one drop of skull-sweat imagining what said "new IP" would be. Just like "Psychonauts", you say you want innovation but can't be bothered to actually go get it. (I'll skip the pen trick here; already done.) So what's the bloody point?

So, fine, you don't like the game. Big whoop; you're entitled to your opinion, good for you. Why you feel the need to declare this distaste loudly upon the least mention of said game, however, is not only pathelogical to the point that it may be included in the DSM-V prototype specifications but also chafes me like my cheap briefs.

I once again apologise for the peevishness, but after four years of the same old compost wafting about the Intertubes it's vent this in a forum post or go find a clock tower.

-- Steve

I hope I don't scare you when I ask if I can have your babies. There really isn't a point you've made I don't support. You made a bit of a strawman but other than that, awesome.
I gave up on "supporting innovation" when I realised just how hard it is to be really truly innovative. Even new ideas can usually be pinned as adaptaions of old ones. Look at movies and books. There are seven basic stories I'm told. Any changes to this mold are just different for the sake of it or slight modifications or tweaks of the little stuff that doesn't affect structure.
Besides, innovation =/= fun. If I had to choose between buying an innovative game and buying one I enjoyed it wouldn't be a contest. Of course it's nice if the game is both but the cake is a lie so I can neither have it nor eat it.
PS: Yes I realise I just referenced an innovative AND fun game. Sue me.

 

[chenry]

I have a feeling Bungie's gonna come out with a new and better game trilogy thats 10 times as good as Halo!

If you think you found something related to Bungie and its new video games, please coment.

Bungie already released a trilogy of games 10 times better than Halo, and it was called Marathon. Learn you some history, lad.

Thread subject was kind of lulzy too. The Third game is the beginning?

 

[Exposed Lie]

if bungie continue with the way they were heading with the halo 3 series their next trilogy will accumulatively take 2 and a half hours to complete!

and their next title "Halo Wars" being X-Box 360 exclusive

im a console gamer (as my laptop cant really handle games as its shit) even I think this is a stupid idea. i would rather eat my own eye balls then play an RTS on a console!

*thinks back to the fun days of playing RTS's on a PC* ahhh

 

[Captain Planet]

The funny thing is that if Halo CE had been released on the PC like it was supposed to be, a year before the XBOX was released, there would be no Halo fanboys, because compared to the PC's shooters, Halo CE was shit. Complete and utter crap. A nice attempt but the dump I took this morning had more art direction. So without being completely consolized, and therefore dumbed down, Halo would never have succeeded the way it has. Hell, without the Halo series keeping the XBOX alive, there might not even be XBOX Live, or a 360. Now that's a riot.

 

[qbert4ever]

The funny thing is that if Halo CE had been released on the PC like it was supposed to be, a year before the XBOX was released, there would be no Halo fanboys, because compared to the PC's shooters, Halo CE was shit. Complete and utter crap. A nice attempt but the dump I took this morning had more art direction. So without being completely consolized, and therefore dumbed down, Halo would never have succeeded the way it has. Hell, without the Halo series keeping the XBOX alive, there might not even be XBOX Live, or a 360. Now that's a riot.

Ah, the age old argument. Forgive me for being a lowly console gamer, but what are these so called "Awsome PC Shooters" that everybody seems to be talking about? I would truly love to get a list of games that put halo to shame that does not rhyme with "Calf-Mife"

 

[Sardaukar]

These are just some of the ones that come to mind; by no means a conclusive list.
Battlefield (pick your era)
Unreal Tournament 2004
Crysis
S.T.A.L.K.E.R.
System Shock 2
Battlezone
Enemy Territory
SWAT 4
No One Lives Forever
Alien versus Predator (2)
And while not exactly FPS's, they arguably still fit the bill with the way handle their respective genre's combat: Mechwarrior (#) and Independence War 2.
And, Half Life aside, it's innumerable mods.

 

[tiredinnuendo]

I don't feel like quoting, but well said on the whole, Cheeze.

I'll say that the bit about Die Hard having a "great" story could use some help. That's like saying Crackdown has a great story (I loved Crackdown, by the way). It doesn't. But blowing stuff up is fun.

Here's the spectrum, good goes from left to right:

The Godfather-------Citizen Kane-------Dead Poets-------Forest Gump--------Die Hard-------Resident Evil the movie

People will say that this list is subjective. Certainly what order you place these movies in terms of how much you like them is subjective, but which is the better written story is something I believe can be analyzed. Die Hard was a blast and no mistake, but it wasn't good writing. It was fun and pretended to be nothing more than that.

As to Halo, we shall agree to disagree and see what the next five years of shooters brings us. Hopefully I'll be eating my words and when the time comes I'll do so with pleasure. Seeing the negative tends to make for a happier individual. Either I get something I love or I get the satisfaction of knowing I was right.

- J

 

[EzraPound]

Halo sucks. I'm sorry.