Infinity Ward Responds to Modern Warfare 2 Controversy

[SovietSecrets]

Well I suppose if its to somehow help those who can't browse servers and get in a game, then fine by me. Either way ill enjoy the game even if it will be a form of matchmaking.

 

[Dudeakoff]

-Faster: Push a button. Wait couple seconds to a minute or two. Done.

Click 'join server' wait a second or two. Done.

-Easier: No setting up filters, pings, or anything like that. MM does it all automatically, using general settings like desired gametype. No need to know how to manage servers either - P2P is user-friendly.

Filters are usually easy to understand, the meaning of ping can be found with a Google search and I can find the exact game I want to play. I don't understand what you mean by managing servers.

-More reliable: Since your playing doesn't rely on the whims of a server host, or if someone feels like being a dick, you get a more reliable online experience than servers, which are hit and miss.

Servers allow you to check whether the server you're about to connect to will cause you to lag or not. With MM, I tend to find that it can be a bit hit and miss with lag, regardless of the promises devs make, and one person is going to have an advantage due to hosting the game

-Self-regulating: While servers depend on individual rules and enforcement, MM is based on 1 rules set, and is universally enforced by one or more official enities. Get banned on a server? Find another server. Get banned in MM? Find another game, 'cause you're done punk.

Most servers allow you to instantly get rid of someone, either via vote or moderator presence. In MM you have to stop playing, file a report, and have to deal with the person for the rest of the game whilst also knowing that the report you just filed is most likely going to be ignored.

-Fair: MM gives everyone an equal chance to get something they like. It promotes variety, while servers stagnate and strangle it. It doesn't please everyone, but cuts no one out. It breaks the back of team-stackers, gives everyone an equal chance of getting a griefer, and generally keeps all the positives and negatives in a nice equillbrium.

When playing MM games, I find that I'm always playing the same map because of some vote system where everyone votes for the same map all the time. It's a very rare occasion when you play certain maps. With servers, I tend to find at least 5 servers running any of the official maps. and why deal with griefers when you can just join a server you know has good people on it?

-Player Control: MM offers basically the same flexibilty as servers, without the work. MM systems offer many stock filter options, such as Deathmatch, Objective, Big Teams, etc. usually with a little something for everyone. Further almost all MMs offer Private Matches and Party Lobbies where friends can get togther before looking for a game, or to join their own custom game wth any number of tweakable options, for everything from screwing around to serious competition.

I'd have to disagree that MM offers the same flexibility, for example, I can't choose the game type, map and number of players where as with servers I can.

 

[samsonguy920]

Btw, is it just me or every game published by Activision must have one or more controversies attached to it?

Starcraft II: Lack of LAN support.
Diablo III: Supposedly colourful, WoW-influenced art design.

Blizzard works entirely autonomously from Activision. Also, Diablo 3 needs more goddamn rainbows.

They need them for the demon carebears that will be featured...
I am completely at a loss why people still keep pointing their finger at Activision for issues with Blizzard? People, it is VIVENDI that owns Blizzard now, not Activision. If anything Activision is Blizzard's little greedy evil whiny cheatin stepbrother.
As for this case here, speaking from a bystander, I find IW's argument to be invalid. Yes, Modern Warfare 2 is looking quite awesome, and could excel beyond MW1. Except in multiplayer which looks like they just shot the kneecaps out of. Yes, there are players who still have difficulty in setting up servers, and maybe they can use a hand. Cool, let's give them a hand. But let's don't slam the door in the faces of those who can set up a server in 5 seconds or less for the ease of matchups between friends. Taking the lazyass approach, punishing loyal longtime gamers, is not good business, and does not present a feature rich game. May as well put EA's DRM on that as well, only cut down the reinstalls to just one. And sell the game on brittle discs, that once touched, shatter, sending fiberglass splinters into the gamer's hands.
[small]I dunno, was that last over the top?[/small]

 

[nYuknYuknYuk]

WHY.... NOT... OFFER.... BOTH?!?!!

The only reason I like PC multiplayer better is because you can have dedicated servers. That and match lists. And now we have to have forced matchmaking? Do you realize it would be great as an option, but..... dude... I hope at least they have some sort of preferences thing where you could select which things mattered to you most(connection, number of people, etc)and then it would matchmake based on those preferences.

 

[The Bandit]

i've been playing fps games since the days of quake AND i could figure out their server browsers

I fail to see how this statement helps the rest of your argument in anyway at all. You understand it because you've been doing it for a long time. That's how shit works, dude.

Can I access a dedicated server? Sure. Is it easier than hitting a single button and finding a game? No. Not in any way. I understand the argument for dedicated servers, but the fact is, matchmaking is easier to use. And you can say "blahblah if you can't access a server" all you want, but a lot of people can't. Not because they're idiots, or they need to go back to school, or whatever pseudo-witty remark you come up with next. Simply because they're not used to doing so. If PC gaming is dying out like every little douche bag is crying about, then it's stuff like this that will keep it alive by welcoming newer players. And if this new method IS superior, you'll never know, because you'll be crying everytime someone tries to mix up the formula.

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the only real reason to use a PC version is mods, which are absent from this game. Still. I respect their other decisions.

 

[NitrousOxid3]

Yes, it works better the way its been done on PC for years, and most PC gamers have by now encountered the match making system and don't like it or want it - if they want to make the best experience for us, why not listen to us?

Exactly. Ubisoft had proclaimed the same wishful thinking with Rainbow Six Vegas 2.... It's horrible. This doesn't "fix" anything that was a problem with CoD4, the Dedicated Servers there was fine.

i've been playing fps games since the days of quake AND i could figure out their server browsers

I fail to see how this statement helps the rest of your argument in anyway at all. You understand it because you've been doing it for a long time. That's how shit works, dude.

Can I access a dedicated server? Sure. Is it easier than hitting a single button and finding a game? No. Not in any way. I understand the argument for dedicated servers, but the fact is, matchmaking is easier to use. And you can say "blahblah if you can't access a server" all you want, but a lot of people can't. Not because they're idiots, or they need to go back to school, or whatever pseudo-witty remark you come up with next. Simply because they're not used to doing so. If PC gaming is dying out like every little douche bag is crying about, then it's stuff like this that will keep it alive by welcoming newer players. And if this new method IS superior, you'll never know, because you'll be crying everytime someone tries to mix up the formula.

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the only real reason to use a PC version is mods, which are absent from this game. Still. I respect their other decisions.

Have you played Team Fortress 2 or FEAR2? TF2 represents Dedicated Servers and FEAR2 represents the Matchmaking service. I'm sorry, I fail to see how the match making was any easier. In TF2 I get a giant window that pops down upon clicking "Find Servers" at the menu. This giant window tells me all I need to know. FEAR2 has me fill out a flippin' biography just to get to the server select screen. Multiple clicks.

It's not easier. Rainbow Six Vega 1 and 2 is another prime example. Ubisoft in fact proclaimed the same ideas IW has... and they failed the PC community. It amazes me how IW didn't look around and thoroughly think this through. I suppose I would respect their decisions, even if I disagreed, if they didn't mock the very community that made CoD4 so popular for the PC community. That's exactly what Bowling did, in his statements he laughs and says they wanted players to have fun here.... Some people find competitive gameplay fun and others enjoy the shit out of developing mods; Valve worships these people and dedicate maps to the community favorites by releasing those maps officially.

And that's not even getting into the technical difficulties of player to player hosting on the PC. It works for consoles but sure as hell doesn't give quality to PC players.

 

[Turtleboy1017]

snip

snip

Anectdotal evidence is not an acceptable defense anywhere, for anything. If you're going to try, at least try it the right way.

1: Favorites lists are an issue of personal prefence and opinion, and as such are not the point or a desired feature when trying to design something that is fair and balanced. In addition, your favorites list exists as yuor friends list and preferred gametype in MM systems.

2: Pure anectodotal evidence, and as such, has no relevance. In addition, it is faulty in its assumpitions that this will happen frequently, or enough to actual cause an issue in MM, whereas in servers it is a very real and common issue.

3: It mainly affects your connection, and even so, it is a personal issue, not a public one. Should everyone be forced to have to deal with the issues surrounding servers because you won't tell your roommate to not use bandwith hoggers while you play games?

4: Servers still require more player regulation and imput, and server systems are far more vulnerable to different kinds of hacking issues than MM systems are.

5: Again, aneticdotal evidence. Millions of people everyday go through it with little to no issues, and you've assumed first it is an issue with the system, rather than something with you or your setup.

6: Private matches have the same level of control as their server counterparts, since player control relies on the game itself, not the room method. And mods are not a card you want to play in the defense of the server system or PCs, because they are a paper thin, easily surmounted arguement, based on math alone.

You are simply assuming that PC gamers are complaining too much about something you think isn't really a big deal.

The biggest argument I can give you right now is to go and try these dedicated servers for yourself. I have played the 360. I have been a hardcore gamer. I have argued long and hard with other PC users before I became one myself.

TRY IT. Don't tell me you have and you think MM is better. All your arguments against mine state mine are "anecdotal". They affect many, MANY disgruntled console gamers.

I will say this short and simple. Dedicated servers offer a MUCH larger room for customization. Dedicated servers do NOT promote piracy. Dedicated servers are almost always more equipped to handle large games with many people, as well as giving better ping to almost everyone on that server. Dedicated servers have the same software that MM has to ban players. Finally, dedicated servers are simply that. Dedicated servers. PC gamers have been with them for over 10 years now. We don't want them to be taken away. Some recent games have tried it. F.E.A.R 2, Operation Flashpoint 2, and guess what? Their multiplayer is a ghost town.

F.E.A.R 1, and Operation Flashpoint 1 utilized dedicated servers and guess what? Their multiplayer fanbase may not be the biggest around, but they are a good 50 thousand strong each.

 

[Warrior Irme]

Seriously folks calm down. So a game company makes the decision to host matchmaking servers to make it easier for players to get into the game quickly. You really need to cry because some players will now have a better game experience that messes with a small section of the community? Yes, some of you think that those hosting dedicated servers are in the majority, but they are not. Most of the PC gamers playing games such as MW2 will see the difference and shrug. Just because the hardcore are the more vocal doesn't mean they are the majority. I would love for there to be dedicated servers, but with a game that will hopefully be as good if not better than MW1 I am willing to do without.

 

[kibayasu]

Obviously this will turn out better because the PC multiplayer of CoD4 was an absolute and utter failure... right?

 

[Dudeakoff]

Can I access a dedicated server? Sure. Is it easier than hitting a single button and finding a game? No. Not in any way. I understand the argument for dedicated servers, but the fact is, matchmaking is easier to use. And you can say "blahblah if you can't access a server" all you want, but a lot of people can't. Not because they're idiots, or they need to go back to school, or whatever pseudo-witty remark you come up with next. Simply because they're not used to doing so. If PC gaming is dying out like every little douche bag is crying about, then it's stuff like this that will keep it alive by welcoming newer players. And if this new method IS superior, you'll never know, because you'll be crying everytime someone tries to mix up the formula.

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the only real reason to use a PC version is mods, which are absent from this game. Still. I respect their other decisions.

1) My 10 year old brother managed to work out how to navigate a server menu with me just pointing out "that's the map, that's the number of players, try to only go on games that have that number under 100."
2) PC games have had matachmaking systems before, we know they don't work.
3) Nobody is offering anything new here, some people don't like it because they want MW2 on PC and they know MM just doesn't compare to servers, others don't like it as they see it as a growing trend of publishers trying to control it's customers at the expense of features, they see it as Activision setting an example for others which does not benefit customers.

 

[Treblaine]

snip

I don't want to be labeled a dick, but do you have ANY idea how IGNORANT this is???

Reasearch the stuff you post before you post it!!

More reliable? Fair? Let me tell you something. I own an xbox 360. I had an xbox before that. I was a hardcore gamer on it for 4 long years. I waited at midnight events for Halo 3, CoD 4, and more. Then I decided to invest in a good PC rig, and now my Xbox is collecting dust.

Let me correct you on some of your points your obviously ignorant on.

Servers a glorious thing. Once you have one in your favorites list, double click it, wait a second or two and you're in. Also it never goes down. Also people you like and know will always be on it, so you don't have to worry about getting them down on your friends list the second you think their alright.

Second, it is NOT fair. I can't tell you how many times I have ran into former 4-star generals in Halo 3 who were boosting their buddies, and simply kicked the shit out of us in gametypes like Team Slayer and Team Snipers.

Third, it is NOT more reliable. If the host's roommate decides to start watching a youtube video while he hosts a game, EVERYONE'S ping will suffer. Dedicated servers don't have this shit.

Self-regulating is beyond retarded. PC DOES HAVE THAT. VAC can BAN you from the game. YOU CAN'T PLAY IT AGAIN. Admins can IP ban you, now you're someone else s problem. You keep hacking, every server from here to Tijuana has banned you, you got no reason to play now.

Easier... don't make me laugh. I can't tell you how many times I've played CoD 4 with my buddies and had MAJOR issues with a party system... "Hey Jose you in yet?" "Yeah... but where are you?" "I'm right here man, you're not in?" "God damn this is so aggravating.

Player control: Yeah they give you that basic ability to control... but it is MINUSCULE compared to what you can do on the PC. You want knives only? Bingo. You want AIRSTRIKES ONLY?? BINGO. With the console it's basically spawn time, and round limit. How fun.

So before you go on mouthing off on PC gamers about why we are complaining, LOOK INTO IT. All you do in your post is make yourself look like a presumptions idiot who doesn't know why we are so angry over this.

Anectdotal evidence is not an acceptable defense anywhere, for anything. If you're going to try, at least try it the right way.

1: Favorites lists are an issue of personal prefence and opinion, and as such are not the point or a desired feature when trying to design something that is fair and balanced. In addition, your favorites list exists as yuor friends list and preferred gametype in MM systems.

2: Pure anectodotal evidence, and as such, has no relevance. In addition, it is faulty in its assumpitions that this will happen frequently, or enough to actual cause an issue in MM, whereas in servers it is a very real and common issue.

3: It mainly affects your connection, and even so, it is a personal issue, not a public one. Should everyone be forced to have to deal with the issues surrounding servers because you won't tell your roommate to not use bandwith hoggers while you play games?

4: Servers still require more player regulation and imput, and server systems are far more vulnerable to different kinds of hacking issues than MM systems are.

5: Again, aneticdotal evidence. Millions of people everyday go through it with little to no issues, and you've assumed first it is an issue with the system, rather than something with you or your setup.

6: Private matches have the same level of control as their server counterparts, since player control relies on the game itself, not the room method. And mods are not a card you want to play in the defense of the server system or PCs, because they are a paper thin, easily surmounted arguement, based on math alone.

You won't accept anecdotal evidence?

What the Fu-

Do you think there is a textbook on this somewhere?!?!??? What the hell else is there other than personal experience which is exactly what this is.

I vouch that every single thing turtleboy said is true and almost every point of your post was utter BS, and this is coming from my first hand experience with PC server gaming. Dudeakoff has also called out your BS, how's that for anecdotal evidence?

Seriously, what the HELL is your experience with PC gaming on dedicated servers?

I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about in terms of PC Server gaming.

 

[MR T3D]

^you're damn right
And you know what? if the game has private, dedi servers, then it can be played many years after the developer/publisher have 'forgotten' about it.
Case in point:
CoD1, UO, and their mods.
made in, like, 2001, and they ARE STILL WELL PLAYED
SAME WITH BF1942
without dedicated servers, the developer-NAZIS can easily shut it down come sequel time.
and MM does have the odd perk, but DEDICATED SERVERS ARE HOW ONLY SHOULD BE PLAYED.
Seriously, PC games online has been free forever, and this system is a first step at removing FREEDOM for the sake of simplicity.
you know what's also simple? the gov't telling you exactly what to do at all times. Do you like that? wait? no? then STFU about this not being bad.
seriously, this is the angriest i can be on the internet about a game. nothing but replacing CoD with BF could make me angrier.
Seriously, I'm pretty chill, most of the time, BUT THIS IS MOTHER-FUCKING BULLSHIT AND I WILL UNLEASH THE FURY OF CAPS LOCK

 

[DTWolfwood]

Why dont they just tell us the truth, and that porting the 360 version over to the PC was quicker, cheaper, and will increase their profit margins. Then doing this would actually make sense. I'd really would like to hear their details on how peer-to-peer matching will offer consistent latency on platforms with varied performances and varied connection speeds. IW must have discovered some magical new way to use Bandwidth that doesnt require giant server farms... 9_9

 

[NitrousOxid3]

Seriously folks calm down. So a game company makes the decision to host matchmaking servers to make it easier for players to get into the game quickly. You really need to cry because some players will now have a better game experience that messes with a small section of the community? Yes, some of you think that those hosting dedicated servers are in the majority, but they are not. Most of the PC gamers playing games such as MW2 will see the difference and shrug. Just because the hardcore are the more vocal doesn't mean they are the majority. I would love for there to be dedicated servers, but with a game that will hopefully be as good if not better than MW1 I am willing to do without.

It's easy to wave something off if you don't understand nor care for it. At which point I ask why are you here in the first place if it doesn't interest you. Seconded, which I bolded.... Need I say more?

You're willing to do without... when Dedicated Servers was one of CoD4's highlights and far, far, from being one of it's issues.


Go play FEAR2 and tell me how the MP turns out there. There's a reason why it's empty and it's primarily because of poor management of server hosting. No Dedicated Servers increases the chance of high latency which is not an environment that competitive gamers in the PC community favor. FEAR was a renown competitive MP game... FEAR2 is completely empty because it lacked support that would improve longevity. IW is doing the same thing Ubisoft did to Rainbow Six Vegas; while they "think" they're making something easy, they're not. And I'm sick of compromising, I much rather deal with noobs joining in TF2 and having to explain how the find server search works. No big deal to me.

 

[DTWolfwood]

speaking of Blizzard, last time i check the stock ticker its known as Activision-Blizzard now <.<

 

[hobo_welf]

i've been playing fps games since the days of quake AND i could figure out their server browsers

I fail to see how this statement helps the rest of your argument in anyway at all. You understand it because you've been doing it for a long time. That's how shit works, dude.

Can I access a dedicated server? Sure. Is it easier than hitting a single button and finding a game? No. Not in any way. I understand the argument for dedicated servers, but the fact is, matchmaking is easier to use. And you can say "blahblah if you can't access a server" all you want, but a lot of people can't. Not because they're idiots, or they need to go back to school, or whatever pseudo-witty remark you come up with next. Simply because they're not used to doing so. If PC gaming is dying out like every little douche bag is crying about, then it's stuff like this that will keep it alive by welcoming newer players. And if this new method IS superior, you'll never know, because you'll be crying everytime someone tries to mix up the formula.

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the only real reason to use a PC version is mods, which are absent from this game. Still. I respect their other decisions.

Who said PC gaming was dieing out?

 

[4RT1LL3RY]

Seriously folks calm down. So a game company makes the decision to host matchmaking servers to make it easier for players to get into the game quickly. You really need to cry because some players will now have a better game experience that messes with a small section of the community? Yes, some of you think that those hosting dedicated servers are in the majority, but they are not. Most of the PC gamers playing games such as MW2 will see the difference and shrug. Just because the hardcore are the more vocal doesn't mean they are the majority. I would love for there to be dedicated servers, but with a game that will hopefully be as good if not better than MW1 I am willing to do without.

1. Only matchmaking servers, not even allowing dedicated servers
2. The hardcore are the people that will still be playing the game years after it was released, and it is communities that keep a game going, not a system that lets you start playing sooner. Valve now gives you an option to go through the server browser with pictures that sort everything. it takes a hell of alot longer to actually get to a server, I prefer the stock view. I am fine with them adding to the front end of the game, but leave the back end alone.

 

[hobo_welf]

I would like to point out that after watching Bobby Kotick for the last few months I can safely say that he is probably the ultra troll to end all trolls. Seriously, have you seen that picture mr Funk keeps putting up? That grin is the grin of an uber troll. That backround almost looks like fire! He could be satan for all I know!

My point is let's not blame the guys at I-Dub for this one because it is my sincere belief that this came down straight from the top. Or straight from the bottom if my theory about Mr.Kotick is correct.

Regardless, I'm in the group of "Fuck off I hate you Activision you're trying to make me buy MW3 when it comes out by shutting down MW2 rage rage rage etc".

IN ANY CASE; I really want to sit down and have a beer with Kotick. I want to see what makes him... tick.

 

[DTWolfwood]

really hope to see the PC market drop underneath their feet. Only way to prove a point now.

 

[The Bandit]

i've been playing fps games since the days of quake AND i could figure out their server browsers

I fail to see how this statement helps the rest of your argument in anyway at all. You understand it because you've been doing it for a long time. That's how shit works, dude.

Can I access a dedicated server? Sure. Is it easier than hitting a single button and finding a game? No. Not in any way. I understand the argument for dedicated servers, but the fact is, matchmaking is easier to use. And you can say "blahblah if you can't access a server" all you want, but a lot of people can't. Not because they're idiots, or they need to go back to school, or whatever pseudo-witty remark you come up with next. Simply because they're not used to doing so. If PC gaming is dying out like every little douche bag is crying about, then it's stuff like this that will keep it alive by welcoming newer players. And if this new method IS superior, you'll never know, because you'll be crying everytime someone tries to mix up the formula.

Of course, that doesn't change the fact that the only real reason to use a PC version is mods, which are absent from this game. Still. I respect their other decisions.

Who said PC gaming was dieing out?

Try googleing it. Seriously. Go.