did you consider that videogame programmers just may not be experts on romantic interaction in the irst place?
Lack of romance in games ignores the female audience
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Of course the developers are missing out on a huge chunk of the market. If anyone disagrees with that, I give you...Twilight.
I'll tell you what- girls like guns as much as guys.
The other day I was shopping for a Prohibition-themed party I was throwing at school. I wanted to get a couple movies (grand prizes people would win after racking up enough fake money from gambling, keeping to the "Prohibition Era" or "Classy" themes), but I was stuck between "Public Enemies", The Sean Connery James Bond Collection, and "Gone With the Wind". I wanted to have something guys would like, and another that girls would like. I happened to be shopping with two female friends of mine, and when I asked their opinions they said, "James Bond and Public Enemies." I then told them I wanted an alternative for chicks, and one of them said, "are you kidding? I'd MUCH rather see "Public Enemies" than "Gone With The Wind." That movie's badass!"
I think you do have a point about romance in games, however. Although I think the problem isn't lack of representation for the female demographic; I think the problem is that the ones that are and have been in games up until now have been mostly shit, and that's the fault of the developers and writers of the game.
The other day I was shopping for a Prohibition-themed party I was throwing at school. I wanted to get a couple movies (grand prizes people would win after racking up enough fake money from gambling, keeping to the "Prohibition Era" or "Classy" themes), but I was stuck between "Public Enemies", The Sean Connery James Bond Collection, and "Gone With the Wind". I wanted to have something guys would like, and another that girls would like. I happened to be shopping with two female friends of mine, and when I asked their opinions they said, "James Bond and Public Enemies." I then told them I wanted an alternative for chicks, and one of them said, "are you kidding? I'd MUCH rather see "Public Enemies" than "Gone With The Wind." That movie's badass!"
I think you do have a point about romance in games, however. Although I think the problem isn't lack of representation for the female demographic; I think the problem is that the ones that are and have been in games up until now have been mostly shit, and that's the fault of the developers and writers of the game.
Isabela in Dragon Age 2 is the single most well-written, multi-faceted and endearing romance I've ever encountered in a game.
Sheryl Chee is a genius, because the way she's written that character is nothing short but a monumental achievement in characterisation.
Sheryl Chee is a genius, because the way she's written that character is nothing short but a monumental achievement in characterisation.
True, but even a well scripted romance like in AC:B can be enough. You have enough control that you do things for the romance/lover, but when it comes to interaction it's all scripted. I think it is a good stepping stone. I don't much like the BioWare interactive romance, especially not in DA2.Bad Jim said:
But yes, definitely it's tough to make it interactive but I think that's something a lot of games are trying to do - maybe not romance, but to become highly interactive. We have the very basics of it down with the morality stuff, and I think it will get better over time. I wonder if the Wastelands of Fallout could be better if there was love interests (assuming it's done well).
The 2008 version of prince of persia might be the sort of thing you are looking for. A large part of the story is the growing relationship between the two main characters. It becomes a major plot point in the finale (though also a wallbanger, for some). I found it all fairly charming. It isn't a particularly grand game, but it is passable, and the romantic element is there.
Your girlfriend likes romance, and she's a girl... therefore all girls like romance? You need to rework your logic. I am a guy. I prefer RPGs over FPS. Therefore, all men prefer RPGs over FPS. I am a guy, and I am allergic to milk. Therefore, all men are allergic to milk. See how faulty this logic is?
I agree that many games are disregarding the female audience, but it is not because they don't have romance. That's like saying that all games are disregarding everyone who likes portal because not every single game has cake.
I agree that many games are disregarding the female audience, but it is not because they don't have romance. That's like saying that all games are disregarding everyone who likes portal because not every single game has cake.
As always: Only put in a plot like a romance if you can pull it off.
Personally, I work more in user's character RPGs to AVOID the romance.
I mean, Jesus. MORRIGAN YOU ARE LIKE A HIPPIE SPIDER FIVE-YEAR-OLD in your behavior. I do not want you having implied lesbian sex with my nerdy elf-mage.
Can we get, "The Escapist is not a Men's club" put in the forum guidelines?
Personally, I work more in user's character RPGs to AVOID the romance.
I mean, Jesus. MORRIGAN YOU ARE LIKE A HIPPIE SPIDER FIVE-YEAR-OLD in your behavior. I do not want you having implied lesbian sex with my nerdy elf-mage.
And clearly, all girls like Twilight. In fact, I'm sacrificing a kitten to New Moon right now, as all women must do.Panda Mania said:
Can we get, "The Escapist is not a Men's club" put in the forum guidelines?
No. Can't you people fucking read? Half of this thread is of people assuming the OP was making a generalisation about all women, simply because he found romance to be a poorly attached aspect of gaming, and that is detrimental to the enjoyment of those who like games with a good romance (like his girlfriend). He never said that all girls must have romance in games. He just pointed out that it is a large part of the market that is being unsubscribed to by devs.AnythingOutstanding said:
And he is right. Think about it: we have both action movies and romantic movies. Same with books. Same with plays. Same with practically every other medium other than games. AAA Games are almost invariably about killing something. Will we ever see one where the emphasis is on love?
I always appreciate people of higher intelligence who can understand the underlying message and not take something like a topic title at face value. Thanks for defending the post.maninahat said:
I tried, initially, to point out that I was in fact not generalizing and admitted in the OP that many girls like the same type of games as guys but... *shrug*
Try reading the OP before replying. The title is just an attention grabber. I clearly state that some girls like the same action games as guys, the entire point is that I know someone who is part of a group who are being completely ignored in the gaming community. All girls? No. But many. The success of romantic comedies and romance novels attests to the interest there is in that theme. I also said that I like romances in most of my favorite novels, so don't start going off on me about pidgeon holing guys as well.Mark Hardigan said:
Hooookay...Female Gamer Alert!
I'll say this now: While the title of this thread had me ready to jump down some throats in a rage. The OP is actually a bet less generalizing than I was expecting though, so I'm a bit...calmer now. Repeating what most people have said though: Not all girls require romance in their entertainment, whether it be video games, books, movies, what have you. On that note...not all guys treat romance like its a pile of yucky mush-gush, or a ticket to a sexy cut scene. There are actually men that appreciate a well-told romance. In fact, there's probably more out there that do than you think-but there's such a stigma right now about this kind of thing, that you'll rarely hear them admit it. Anyway, moving on...
He made one good point though, that got me thinking: Most of the games that I play offer little to no romance. I play a great deal of RPG's-turn based, and hack 'n slash-as well as some RTS games, and most lack even a tacked on romantic subplot.
This contrasts sharply with most of the fantasy/Sci-fi books I read, where the main character is almost always involved in a romance of some kind, not to mention all the side characters who have their OWN sub-plots. And no, they aren't romance novels.
Similarly, Nearly every movie I've seen has some element of romance in there. The rare exception is usually either because the main character is already married/has a girlfriend, so the most you get is some cute hello/goodbye kiss scene, or because the action in the movie is so insane there is literally no time for something like that.
Video games in general don't seem to feature much romance. Most that do are RPG's-and in the case of pick-the-girl (or rarely, pick-the-guy-or-multi-gender-option), its lauded as a special or unique feature. Actually, just having a love interest at ALL can allow a game to do this. "Featuring a deep romantic subplot!" Granted, games are usually more subtle than that...usually by having the female character in question featured prominently on the game box. "Look, there's a chick! There must be at least some sexual tension in this game!"
Why is this? I don't know, there could be a number of reasons. I read an article here on the escapist that pointed out that gamers don't tend to have high standards when it comes to the story in their games, and I think that's a large part of it. A good number of games out there hardly feature any story at all-they are just a series of gameplay mechanics and tutorials. Granted, those mechanics may be GOOD ones. And gamers don't often seem to ask for more. "Sure, its kind of an excuse plot-but who cares? The combat is great fun!"
Not that all games need to be philosophical journeys or deep character studies...but I think we can all agree that we've got enough plotless games on the market just now, thanks.
An attempt at a tl;dr: There's a surprising lack of romance-and story in general-in video games right now, especially compared to other modern media. And I'd say this is mostly a result of we, the consumers-after all, game developers make what sells. And guess whats selling?
I'll say this now: While the title of this thread had me ready to jump down some throats in a rage. The OP is actually a bet less generalizing than I was expecting though, so I'm a bit...calmer now. Repeating what most people have said though: Not all girls require romance in their entertainment, whether it be video games, books, movies, what have you. On that note...not all guys treat romance like its a pile of yucky mush-gush, or a ticket to a sexy cut scene. There are actually men that appreciate a well-told romance. In fact, there's probably more out there that do than you think-but there's such a stigma right now about this kind of thing, that you'll rarely hear them admit it. Anyway, moving on...
He made one good point though, that got me thinking: Most of the games that I play offer little to no romance. I play a great deal of RPG's-turn based, and hack 'n slash-as well as some RTS games, and most lack even a tacked on romantic subplot.
This contrasts sharply with most of the fantasy/Sci-fi books I read, where the main character is almost always involved in a romance of some kind, not to mention all the side characters who have their OWN sub-plots. And no, they aren't romance novels.
Similarly, Nearly every movie I've seen has some element of romance in there. The rare exception is usually either because the main character is already married/has a girlfriend, so the most you get is some cute hello/goodbye kiss scene, or because the action in the movie is so insane there is literally no time for something like that.
Video games in general don't seem to feature much romance. Most that do are RPG's-and in the case of pick-the-girl (or rarely, pick-the-guy-or-multi-gender-option), its lauded as a special or unique feature. Actually, just having a love interest at ALL can allow a game to do this. "Featuring a deep romantic subplot!" Granted, games are usually more subtle than that...usually by having the female character in question featured prominently on the game box. "Look, there's a chick! There must be at least some sexual tension in this game!"
Why is this? I don't know, there could be a number of reasons. I read an article here on the escapist that pointed out that gamers don't tend to have high standards when it comes to the story in their games, and I think that's a large part of it. A good number of games out there hardly feature any story at all-they are just a series of gameplay mechanics and tutorials. Granted, those mechanics may be GOOD ones. And gamers don't often seem to ask for more. "Sure, its kind of an excuse plot-but who cares? The combat is great fun!"
Not that all games need to be philosophical journeys or deep character studies...but I think we can all agree that we've got enough plotless games on the market just now, thanks.
An attempt at a tl;dr: There's a surprising lack of romance-and story in general-in video games right now, especially compared to other modern media. And I'd say this is mostly a result of we, the consumers-after all, game developers make what sells. And guess whats selling?
Which one?? If you mean the generalization that "all girls want romance" then that's you making the generalization. Let me quote myself:CarlMinez said:
"Please keep in mind I'm not saying girls can't like that, and I really wish my gf was one of those who can enjoy a game for the simple fun of exploration and blowing stuff up, but she's not like that. And I'm sure she's not alone, not by a long shot."
Hi, welcome to the Escapist forums!digitelanimefan said:
Sorry for getting you riled up with the title, but to be honest it was just bait to get more responses and views =P
Anyway, I appreciate your response. That's really the point of it all, games tend to have shitty plots anyway, and a shitty plot with a shitty forced romance is the worst of all.
I always appreciate games that really draw me in with the story and plot, but even of those, they hardly ever have romances - and even at that, without romances, I rarely feel any deep connection with other characters whatsoever.
And I'm perfectly willing to admit I like romances. I keep trying to get my gf to come see Arthur with me... and I thought No Strings Attached was really good... Hell, I liked The Notebook *hides from ridicule*
That said, I also really like a lot of games without romance. I just finished Metro 2033 last night, 2nd playthrough. Love the game. And I got the happy ending too! Yay!
