Major paradox

[megalomania]

Chaos theory determains that nothing is ever certain. It alwayes applies, to all things, no matter what. There will be no 100%s, and there will be no 0%s. It is a law that cannot be avoided, one that governs all things from beginning to end.
Wait a moment here...
Does that mean that CHAOS is actually the only CERTAIN, ORDERLY thing there is in the cosmos?

Freaky, in my opinion.

What do you think?

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet, too lazy to read the whole thread.

Chaos Theory states that a dynamic system is sensitive to the initial conditions and will change exponentially over time relative to these initial conditions. You are mistaking 'chaos' with 'uncertainty'. For example chaos theory can actually reveal Fractal patterns if the initial conditions are correct, and chaotic patterns can be pretty accurately described mathematically (in some instances!). Uncertainty states that you cannot know both the position and momentum of a particle accurately (or {delta}k{delta}p <= h/2pi I think!) by extension this applies to many things, I'm just stating the original form of it.

EDIT: seems people have covered these points already, feel free to ignore me!

 

[megalomania]

Chaos theory determains that nothing is ever certain. It alwayes applies, to all things, no matter what. There will be no 100%s, and there will be no 0%s.

Again, that's the uncertainty principle, not chaos theory. And it only applies to quantum mechanics, and it can all be safely disregarded in classical theory, which is the theory regarding the phenomena we encounter on a daily basis. The uncertainty principles applies only to things the size (or close to that) of an atom.

Going back to your earlier thread which included classical phenomena not require a Q.M explanation (too lazy to go find post!) I seem to remember my flat mate (4th Year Physics Student) saying something about Ohm's law having a Q.M description, I was like but Ohm's law is V=IR and he was like yeah I thought so too until this module. Apparently when you start working with tiny devices (down to 100/10s of nanometers) the Q.M description is necessary because of wave-function overlaps start to limit the current and other things of that nature which I don't really understand fully. Just thought you might be interested in that!

 

[megalomania]

*SNIP*

ohhhh don't tempt me!, make that list or i'll throw a box at you, that may or may not contain a dead cat.

edit: as an aside, i'm not certain whether it will hit you.

and a broken or not broken vial of poison

 

[mrpenguinismyhomeboy]

SNIP

SNIP

Going back to your earlier thread which included classical phenomena not require a Q.M explanation (too lazy to go find post!) I seem to remember my flat mate (4th Year Physics Student) saying something about Ohm's law having a Q.M description, I was like but Ohm's law is V=IR and he was like yeah I thought so too until this module. Apparently when you start working with tiny devices (down to 100/10s of nanometers) the Q.M description is necessary because of wave-function overlaps start to limit the current and other things of that nature which I don't really understand fully. Just thought you might be interested in that!

That's pretty cool actually. Now that I think about it, that actually makes sense, because classical phenomena (like Ohm's Law) occur on the quantum scale in a device that small. Why didn't I think of that? See if you can send me some links on that from your friend or something that would be great.

ohhhh don't tempt me!, make that list or i'll throw a box at you, that may or may not contain a dead cat.

edit: as an aside, i'm not certain whether it will hit you.

Lol.

 

[mrpenguinismyhomeboy]

Right.....did you also know the word theory is a body of principles governing the study of an art or discipline?? Maybe I should have said Chaos Hypothesis instead.

If you were referring to a part of Chaos theory that hasn't been completely proven, then yes, hypothesis would have been the right word, but Chaos is still a valid phenomena, and has been proven to exist.

 

[thedailylunatic]

Well, I'd argue that chaos theory automatically assumes that it is the only 100% factor. If it didn't, that would just be silly. So technically, there is no paradox. And just because something is certain doesn't mean it is orderly. Certainty of chaos may sound like a paradox, but I dunno, I don't feel it.

Yeah, what he/she said.

 

[j0z]

I never thought about it like that, but you seem to be right! So chaos theory itself is a paradox, because it says that there is no absolutes, it is all chaos, so chaos is absolute...
Amazing, also, I think you have to much time on your hands if you came up with that yourself

 

[CuddlyCombine]

Amazing, also, I think you have to much time on your hands if you came up with that yourself

Why is it that this always crops up? Thinking about complex topics does not mean having too much time on one's hands. Playing games and shopping at trendy stores means having too much time on one's hands. What is time? Do we even exist? Oh, wait, posing existential questions means I must have nothing else to do, because who'd want to think about stuff like that?

Oh, and like I said, you're generally safe to assume that a theory excludes itself in it's thesis. If chaos theory says there are no absolutes, it is not counting itself. Otherwise that would be a really, really stupid paradox.

Yeah, what he/she said.

He. Not that this really matters, but just in case you were itching to know.

 

[3rd rung]

Chaos theory determains that nothing is ever certain. It alwayes applies, to all things, no matter what. There will be no 100%s, and there will be no 0%s. It is a law that cannot be avoided, one that governs all things from beginning to end.
Wait a moment here...
Does that mean that CHAOS is actually the only CERTAIN, ORDERLY thing there is in the cosmos?

Freaky, in my opinion.

What do you think?

Yea the idea of complete choas is in fact order