ME3: One hell of a retcon...

[veloper]

You know I was sitting here thinking about how nice it's going to be to finally romance Kaidain in ME3 (I like the men, and I wanted him to join my Hawke, and Elven Gray warden)....and it it struck me. How the hell is that going to go down exactly? While lesbianism is clearly on display in ME3 (for the enjoyment of all I take it) how ever homosexual men...as far as i can remember...are completely absent in any form.

So how in in the Maker are they going to pull this off?

Here's a question for you that you must answer first: how can Shepard be a guy in one game and a woman in the next?

And this one: how is it that Kaidan died in ME1, when he didn't die in ME1?

Bio are simply going to make the romanceable characters bi, because nothing related to any potential player choices in ME1 and ME2 has to be canonical.

 

[Woodsey]

It'll be interesting. They've lost their magic touch lately, so I'm not actually as confident as I would have been a year ago about whether they could integrate it tastefully.

Different writers for the different games.

OT: Its not like any character was specifically stated to be one or the other, I don't think it matters. And if you aren't going to roll a gay Shepard, it won't affect you anyway.

I would like to point out to you that Bioware themselves have stated that anyone rolling a gay Shepard in Mass Effect 3 would have a far superior experience than anyone trying to play a straight Shepard. Just sayin.

If that's a joke, its gone straight over my head.

 

[Savber]

People seem to have the misconception that people that come out of closet has to do it flamboyantly prior in announcing their sexual identity.

I think they're just gonna shove it in and ignore that little plot hole.

No offense, but while I adore Bioware games, character development is their weakest forte. Not once do I ever care about the actual characters. Unfortunately.

The heck? Bioware generally sucks at the overall story (with the exception of KOTOR)

Most of it just degenerates to 5 basic areas to gathering something or someone before engaging into an epic climax.

It's their characters and the interactions between them that made their games great.

 

[Gametek]

Who are you to say that they don't exist? Do you live in the world of Mass Effect? It's a made-up world, Bioware can do whatever the fuck they want with it. Any arguments against retconning are usually made by nerds that need to get a reality check (not directed at you per se). It's like all this shit around Tali. What does she look like? Would she be able to fuck humans? Who gives a flying fuck? It's a fucking made up world, and these characters don't exist. Enjoy the game, fuck the rest.

Also, although I said I couldn't care less about retconning, it does frustrate me somewhat when remakes or homages fuck with original material for the wrong reasons. But that doesn't apply here.

Some people care even for the story, you know. Not only the game play. I think it this what cause all the winning about CoD...

 

[Ian Caronia]

If people didn't want things shoe-horned in, people shouldn't of demanded they be shoe-horned in.

More evidence that Bioware simply cannot win in this scenario; groups of people will piss and moan no matter what course of action they take.

Except that they clearly said in that linked statement in the OP that they weren't going to shoe horn it in, and they explained why in regards to continuity and what they wanted the game to be.
Now? They want money so it's a harem game. Just because fans "demand" it that doesn't mean they need to compromise their principals (if they had any) and do it. It's ME3. The game is going to sell huge no matter what. This is clearly just them trying to reel in as much cash as they can before they have to stop making the latest blockbuster series.

People also wanted to romance Wrex, by the way, yet it seems Bioware has ignored their demands. Almost like Bioware's just doing this to get more money and... *GASP* Try and be edgy?
Marketing ploy. Gross marketing ploy.

Still, as I said, least gay gamers can have fun boning who they want now, which isn't said (by me, anyway)to imply gay gamers can't have fun playing straight characters. *shrug*
Let's just see if the writers manage to be as creatively bankrupt for the ending of the plot as they were for the overarching plot itself and finally rip off Revelation Space in full.

 

[IamGamer41]

As far as I remember none of those characters ever explicitly stated they were straight right? *shrug*

You can think of a million reasons why for example Kaiden never stated his apparent attraction to men and I'm sure BioWare will use one of those. It's not really that big of a deal, in my opinion.

They did.Kaiden turns you down if you try to sex him up in mass effect 1.Same with Jacob and Maranda if you try to sex talk them when your the opposite sex. So yeah they do state that they are not gay.

 

[Nimcha]

How they should've handled it: Make male homosexuality available or even existent from the start to not pigeon hold themselves

That doesn't make sense. It was never stated that male homosexuality doesn't exist in the galaxy.

 

[Ian Caronia]

You know I was sitting here thinking about how nice it's going to be to finally romance Kaidain in ME3 (I like the men, and I wanted him to join my Hawke, and Elven Gray warden)....and it it struck me. How the hell is that going to go down exactly? While lesbianism is clearly on display in ME3 (for the enjoyment of all I take it) how ever homosexual men...as far as i can remember...are completely absent in any form.

So how in in the Maker are they going to pull this off?

Here's a question for you that you must answer first: how can Shepard be a guy in one game and a woman in the next?

And this one: how is it that Kaidan died in ME1, when he didn't die in ME1?

Bio are simply going to make the romanceable characters bi, because nothing related to any potential player choices in ME1 and ME2 has to be canonical.

"How can Shepard be a guy in one game and a woman in the next?"
Answer: He can't. You make the character from the start and they stay that sex. If you don't bring over your save data and start fresh in ME2, you have to choose a sex prior to even the first cutscene, which in turn means that Shepard was a woman before ME2 (if you chose such form the menu in ME2).

It's a matter of choice before establishing the character. It's the genesis of the character. You're not changing the sex of the character after the character has already be established.

"How is it that Kaiden died in ME1, when he didn't die in ME1?"
Answer: Don't try and go all Schrodinger's Cat on this. It's a choice. You choose if he dies or doesn't. He isn't magically alive in the next game if you killed him (unlike the DA:O characters in Dragon Age 2, but that's for another time >_>).

"Bio are simply going to make the romanceable characters bi, because nothing related to any potential player choices in ME1 and ME2 has to be canonical."
Response: ...Are you joking? Because that sounded like a joke to me. If so, then I wholly agree with you on the fact that Bioware's writers seem to genuinely believe this for most accounts: "Story continuity? Character continuity? PFFF! We'll make them ALLL gay! Give us your money now, pl0x."

If you were being serious then...that's just silly.

 

[IamGamer41]

It'll be interesting. They've lost their magic touch lately, so I'm not actually as confident as I would have been a year ago about whether they could integrate it tastefully.

Different writers for the different games.

OT: Its not like any character was specifically stated to be one or the other, I don't think it matters. And if you aren't going to roll a gay Shepard, it won't affect you anyway.

I would like to point out to you that Bioware themselves have stated that anyone rolling a gay Shepard in Mass Effect 3 would have a far superior experience than anyone trying to play a straight Shepard. Just sayin.

Where did you read that? Post the link I want to read this myself.

If thats true then they are catering to a specific group of people.A minority I might add.Which is total bullshit.Ill not play a game where I'm told that the only way to get the best experience out of it is to play ass backwards from how I have played the other 2 games.They should just take all the romances out of their games if they can't keep the continuity of pre established characters.

 

[Ian Caronia]

How they should've handled it: Make male homosexuality available or even existent from the start to not pigeon hold themselves

That doesn't make sense. It was never stated that male homosexuality doesn't exist in the galaxy.

It's not just what's stated, it's what's shown. As is evident and repeated numerous times over, there were no male homosexuals or even homosexuals in general in ME up to ME3. None. That's two games worth of content. Hours of traveling from world to world, town to town, galaxy to galaxy.

The fact that there wasn't even one gay couple is evidence enough that homosexuality didn't exist in the galaxy of Mass Effect. It's like when the first Star Wars movie came out everyone was like, "...Wait, where's all the black people?"
"...Wait, where's all the gay people?"

 

[Alucard788]

Its not, its asinine to assert that just because it wasn't on display means that there's a whole galaxy in which gay doesn't exist. Its being hyper-sensitive.

Umm...no. I'm making a comment on the context of an excluded social aspect that will be included in the final installment of a game. Who's universe up to this point in time showed no signs, subtle or not, of this kind of lifestyle existing.

I am using...debating...and thinking about it. No I do not want something flamboyant or silly...no I do not want it 'in your face' during the entire plot line. No what I want is to ponder how the hell they are going to pull it off.

 

[Gametek]

Now? They want money so it's a harem game. Just because fans "demand" it that doesn't mean they need to compromise their principals (if they had any) and do it. It's ME3. The game is going to sell huge no matter what. This is clearly just them trying to reel in as much cash as they can before they have to stop making the latest blockbuster series.

Game are not like film. In the videogame industry, you have a different type of approach to the producer. If they make good game, you trust them, And go to the day one buy. If you are not so sure about it, you wait to see the review, to know if the game is worth your money. If they made bad game, they make bad game, and it's not probably that you will buy the game, even if it is a master piece.
I'm kind of tired of all the "they do what the fuck they want" talk. Please, I wish that at the end of the sentence someone ever attack an "until they make the game bad". It simply bug me.
To this point: you make yourself an harem? Good for you. You do it simply by hitting on the head your sex buddies? Bad.
I could go on to the infinite with it, but it is pointless: the thread is focused on the question on how the story about the romance will be played.
But from that to go to the usual protection of bioweare is simply bad. Who care what the blockbuster series do nowadays? This don't make it a good decision. The earth is flat no one?

 

[Nimcha]

How they should've handled it: Make male homosexuality available or even existent from the start to not pigeon hold themselves

That doesn't make sense. It was never stated that male homosexuality doesn't exist in the galaxy.

It's not just what's stated, it's what's shown. As is evident and repeated numerous times over, there were no male homosexuals or even homosexuals in general in ME up to ME3. None. That's two games worth of content. Hours of traveling from world to world, town to town, galaxy to galaxy.

The fact that there wasn't even one gay couple is evidence enough that homosexuality didn't exist in the galaxy of Mass Effect. It's like when the first Star Wars movie came out everyone was like, "...Wait, where's all the black people?"
"...Wait, where's all the gay people?"

Wow, ok. I'm not even going to bother pointing out how ridiculous this is.

We've never seen cats in the games, they don't exist in the ME galaxy then :O

 

[Ian Caronia]

Its not, its asinine to assert that just because it wasn't on display means that there's a whole galaxy in which gay doesn't exist. Its being hyper-sensitive.

Umm...no. I'm making a comment on the context of an excluded social aspect that will be included in the final installment of a game. Who's universe up to this point in time showed no signs, subtle or not, of this kind of lifestyle existing.

I am using...debating...and thinking about it. No I do not want something flamboyant or silly...no I do not want it 'in your face' during the entire plot line. No what I want is to ponder how the hell they are going to pull it off.

Well spoken. I never understood how both sides of the argument would turn to:
"Oh so you want gay people to be in your face about how gay they are?"

An explanation. That's all. Is it really that hard to understand that, whether you agree or disagree with the decision, both sides deserve an explanation?

 

[Timzilla]

Thier is no lesbianism in Mass Effect 1 or 2. The "120 pounds of blue alein" You speak of is not a female. Asari (The race in question) do not have sexes. They look and sound like what we would call female, but thier not. For there to be a Female, thier must also be a Male, and by that notion, there can not be lesbianism between a human female and an assari.

 

[GartarkMusik]

This again? Really?

Christ, people sure do start acting funny when sexuality enters the picture.

I know, right?

It's nice to see that someone else see that this kind of thing is pretty ridiculous.

 

[LiquidGrape]

Thier is no lesbianism in Mass Effect 1 or 2. The "120 pounds of blue alein" You speak of is not a female. Asari (The race in question) do not have sexes. They look and sound like what we would call female, but thier not. For there to be a Female, thier must also be a Male, and by that notion, there can not be lesbianism between a human female and an assari.

That's not really how things work.

Spoiler: As is demonstrated here.