My Only Problem with Reach

[Naota_391]

I was super disappointed by Cat's death. It did seem pointless especially when compared to the other Spartans of Noble team who all managed to die while sacrificing themselves to deal some "massive blow" to the covenant.

Also, my thoughts exactly:

"*do do do do skipping along in the hallway* BLAT! *no shields?!?!*"

That's the reality of war. Not everyone goes out in a blaze of glory.

 

[Naota_391]

It's funny you mention Mass Effect as it blatantly stole Halos storyline/plot and turned it into a third person dating sim.

Or Star Wars or Star Trek or basically any other science fiction story ever made. I don't really know what people expect anymore. They are aware that when it boils down to it, there's really only a handful of stories that are ever told, right? It shouldn't be about the plot, it should be about how the plot is delivered.

 

[Naota_391]

While I felt that the characters of Noble Team could have been fleshed out a bit more, it didn't detract significantly from the story. In a way, it makes sense that you don't know much about the individual members of the squad you joined. Your character is the "FNG" after all, and the grizzled vets often don't warm to the rookie right away.

Spoiler

As a fan who read the novels, I found myself liking Jorge the most because he's one of Halsey's Spartan-IIs. I had read all about how his group was selected and trained (including the dangerous augmetic surgeries that left many dead or paralyzed), and the subsequent years of active service. He was an anchor of familiarity for me, which made his death all the more tragic.

My only major complaint with the game story-wise is how it directly contradicts the previously established canon regarding the battle of Reach.

Yeah I felt the same way. Having read the books, it was fun to see Jorge interacting with Halsey and being the sole Spartan II. And yes, Reach totally fucked upthe canon. I don't know why Bungie couldn't just make them all Spartan IIs. That would have been canon correct? Did the Master Chief fight on a Reach for a period too?

Master Chief did fight on Reach. He evacuated to the Pillar of Autumn just before it took off. Seeing that no other Spartan was present with him is what led him to believe he was the only Spartan left.

 

[Naota_391]

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

Wrong. :/

 

[Diver Down]

I agree. I mean, sure I got sad, but I could have been WAY more impacted by each character's actions if the game was a bit longer and you had more time to get to know the members of Noble Team. The closest they get to good development is Jorge, and they kill him off first! But you knew the most about him; there was some animosity between him and Emile and it shows you how much he cares for the Planet Reach. Just that fact alone ties him to the culture of the planet, and gives him some depth. Ironically, Kat, who you spend the most time with on missions, is not as developed as Jorge. All you really know about her is that she lost an arm doing something, she's close to Carter and she's the computer lady of the group.

so, in conclusion; I agree, but Jorge almost got there.

 

[darkgryffon]

dude they could make an rpg out of halo, i mean sure you would have to mix the halo style fps and the mass effect sort of story telling but im sure it could work, only issue is that companies would never take, its to big a risk -_- god damn companies not making good games because of the "risk"

 

[ShadowsofHope]

Spartan II's were started well before the covenant were discovered actually. They were first made to fight the insurrection(you hear about them in the beginning of the game). Then the Covenant came, they were re-assigned, and humanity needed more Spartans. Hence Spartan III's. Cheap, mass produced spartans. They were the ones in the Ghosts of Onyx novel.

Also note that the Spartan III's were designed to be more stealth/infiltration supersoldiers (semi-reflective camouflage armor, no less), while Spartan II's like the Master Chief were made to be front-lines taking the brunt of the attack supersoldiers.

@Whomever mentioned the helmets - Spartans are supposed to be seen as invincible protectors of Humanity by all others. If they consistently ran around with their helmets off, they'd simply be viewed as "normal" human beings in super-powered armor, which would defeat that purpose. Also, where do you think the HUD is displayed on?

@Whomever mentioned Cat's death - It was the massive EMP shockwave from the nearby plasma impact that disrupted and torn down the shield network power in the armor for a time. She got shot just moments after running from the explosion with the others. There was no time to try to fix her shields, allow them time to regenerate, etc. A single needle from a needle gun in the books is enough to stab through metal thinner than general vehicle armor and human flesh at the same time with little effort. If it had been the original needler gun, and not the rifle version, her head would have just.. exploded instead.

 

[Awexsome]

JO

I agree. I mean, sure I got sad, but I could have been WAY more impacted by each character's actions if the game was a bit longer and you had more time to get to know the members of Noble Team. The closest they get to good development is Jorge, and they kill him off first! But you knew the most about him; there was some animosity between him and Emile and it shows you how much he cares for the Planet Reach. Just that fact alone ties him to the culture of the planet, and gives him some depth. Ironically, Kat, who you spend the most time with on missions, is not as developed as Jorge. All you really know about her is that she lost an arm doing something, she's close to Carter and she's the computer lady of the group.

so, in conclusion; I agree, but Jorge almost got there.

Yeah I'm right about where you are, but honestly I think Jorge just barely did get there.

Maybe not if I had read the books and knew who Halsey was so was all happy when Jorge called her "mum".

But like your post said he did get the most development. On top of that he was usually the most useful actually in battle compared to everyone else for me.

 

[jaketheripper]

my problem is that there are only 1850 players online right now,wtf??????

 

[Kermi]

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

You apparently gave up on forming your own opinions after 2nd grade.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

....was that none of the characters were developed.

True, I was sad when Kat and the others died, but I couldn't really connect to the characters because the single player was short, and they weren't even around all that often.

I find this to be a problem with FPS, and shooters in general. Often these characters don't say much that isn't a taunt or something to advance the plot, and as a result you find it hard to sympathize with them.

Most other game series don;t have this problem, as you are often given points in the story to interact and just TALK with these characters.

Look at Mass Effect 2, we all love it (just a figure of speech folks), and 90% of the game is dialogue. Granted, its Bioware, but still, it would be nice to have some down time and be given some time to explore these other characters.

Exceptions to this case are people who appear throughout sequels and are given more chances to shine. Cortana, Soap, Wesker, all examples of characters who have developed somewhat over their game series. But this is because they live throughout. The whole of Noble team dies (well mostly) and none of them appear in any of the books, shorts, or comics, and they never will. I rally wanted to see Jorge interact with that Hungarian scientist more, I wanted to know more about Emile's history, but now I never will.

What are your thoughts on these topics?

EDIT:
This was not only a problem with Reach, just FPSs in general.
No, I miss Jorge too.
No, I was not expecting some deep characters, I'm just sad that they couldn't have been more developed.
How in anyway was Kat's death stupid? A sniper took her out from a place impossible to predict.
There were some other Spartans besides Master Chief who survived Reach, so it's too bad that none of the team besides Jun make it.
Kinda want a non-cannon Halo RPG like Mass Effect 2 where you assemble a team to destroy some grave Covenant threat.
Also want to know what happens to all these random A.I. like Dot, Serina, and the Superintendent.

the reason why everyone doesn't like kat's death, was it was completely random and had no purpose, just about everyone's death had some purpose or wasn't random, and it actually built up to the moment kat was just "*do do do do skipping along in the hallway* BLAT! *no shields?!?!*"

@ the no shields bit, see my above posts.

k saw it, and while i do realize that and can agree to the EMP bit, they could have portrayed it better with showing the shields getting wrecked, or they could've had her die a bit differently, i mean she died in a snap when everyone else went out the spartan way like a beast, but she just gets shot in the head and is done like that. and it was random too like we were saying before so its more of a "wow wtf that was dumb" rather than "damn that was crazy!!"

 

[No_Remainders]

You cared about kats death?

It was pathetic.

Spoiler

I mean, where the fuck were her shields?

She had only just put her helmet back on, so her shields wouldn't have been up yet.

Anyway, I liked the way the death was done.

Spoiler

It was so blunt, and it made me just go "Holy shit... Kat's dead... Balls."

 

[No_Remainders]

And yes, Reach totally fucked upthe canon.

When it comes to the Halo universe, the games are canon, not the books.

 

[Virus49]

Personally I love reach. The story was engaging and immersive and I genuinely cared about some of the characters.

Others not so much.. but isnt it like that for everybody in real life too? Some people you like and some you don't.

Jorge of course is the most likable character for me, so when the slipspace thing happened I was saddened! But I think it tied together reach > halo 1 quite nicely.
Ill have to get a copy of the mentioned fall of reach updated book...

 

[ZippyDSMlee]

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

Wrong. :/

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

You apparently gave up on forming your own opinions after 2nd grade.

Oh really? Halo ep 3 has less single player content than 2,OSDT about the same Reach about the same.

MP content tends to be about the same it was improved on in 2+ but I do not play MP much if at all.

All in all Halo has gotten worse single player content wise, Halo 1 really was the plateau of the series.

 

[ShakesZX]

....was that none of the characters were developed.

Welcome to the modern world of FPSs. Unfortunately, story and character progression seems to have fallen by the wayside when it comes to larger recent titles, not just Reach.

 

[Dogstile]

You cared about kats death?

It was pathetic.

Spoiler

I mean, where the fuck were her shields?

Headshot?

Usually when one is sniped in Halo, shields are about as useful as a Scorpion without it's cannon. (Anyone else have this happen to them in matchmaking?)

Spoiler

Yeah, if you're sniped with a sniper rifle, not a needle rifle. The needle rifle doesn't kill in one shot unless there are no shields. It was slightly WTF because we never saw her shields go down in that sequence.

 

[imnot]

You cared about kats death?

It was pathetic.

Spoiler

I mean, where the fuck were her shields?

Spoiler

I believe the explosions and collapsing building they were trying to get out of disabled all their shields. It isn't explicitly said.

Spoiler

in which case, i'll just laugh about the fact that she had /just/ put on her helmet when that happened. Those things never do work do they? XD

i think the main point is to display loss and humanity

anyways..

Spartans never die, they're just missing in action.
(love that phrase)

I prefer
forklifts never die, they're just missing in action.
Also I liked Jorge and Kat the best.
Carter not so much.

 

[Kermi]

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

Wrong. :/

Halo gave up on story after the 2nd one...gave up on gameplay/level layouts after the first....

You apparently gave up on forming your own opinions after 2nd grade.

Oh really? Halo ep 3 has less single player content than 2,OSDT about the same Reach about the same.

MP content tends to be about the same it was improved on in 2+ but I do not play MP much if at all.

All in all Halo has gotten worse single player content wise, Halo 1 really was the plateau of the series.

In what way? Halo was was new and exciting but suffered from bland and repetitive (or simply rambling) level design in a few places. Great to play, but Halo 2 had far more variety (especially switching over to the Arbiter midway through - a huge and fantastic surprise in terms of storytelling). Halo 3 had some excellent vehicle sections but once again a couple of the levels rambled a bit - Tsavo Highway in particular. Cortana is also almost universally hated but that's probably because the level consists purely of Flood.
ODST was pseudo-sandbox but the contrast between moving around New Mombasa at night and the action sequences from earlier in the day was done quite well. This is the game where the actual story felt the most like an afterthought, but ODST was about a new experience, there was no real intention for it to stand as contribution to the trilogy.
Reach did an excellent job as a prequel. Anyone who feels it did not contribute well to the story and offer a worthwhile campaign experience at the same time probably rushed through it on normal difficulty (if at all) and jumped straight into the multiplayer.
Frankly, I don't think you've played a Halo game since CE and are basing your opinions of whatever tripe you've read on the internet.