No Haters: If you love Halo so much tell me this. . .

[UBERfionn]

New standard? That parade of mediocrity?

Oh dear, oh dear.

Halo: combat evolved.
not halo 3.
Don't confuse the two.

You misunderstood me; the entire franchise is shallow.

And Modern warfare isn't?

At least Halo 1 was inventive.
It gave a lot to the modern FPS.

Wait, let me check...

Nope, nowhere did I say Modern Warfare wasn't.

I bet you've never really played halo.

play halo 3 online with friend's for lets say more then a half hour.
It's good fun. Most fun i've ever had with an online shooter is in halo.

You'd loose that bet; the Limited Edition box for Halo 3 is sitting next to me on the shelf as we type.

So i assume that you've played Halo CE.
How was that game shallow?

Indeed I have.

It doesn't get much more generic than Combat Evolved.

Go read The Very Pulse of the Machine and then you'll understand what innovation and creativity is.

Everyone copied Halo CE. Thats why it's generic now.
Also can't find a copy to read can you link me if you have a link?

Here's an idea: maybe the game just doesn't appeal to everyone the same as it does to you?

You like it. You find it deep. Super. I'm happy for you.

I don't. I don't like the games. I find them shallow. Good for me.

Well the story of Halo 2 and 3 was bad. No need to talk about that. but gameplay wise they all worked really well.
To each his own I guess.

I guess I just want more epic Sci-Fi games. all we have now are Mass Effect (Which is awesome) and halo.

 

[Wayneguard]

. So all I ask of you is to tell me what Halo possibly offers that we haven't already seen? I just want to enjoy the series again before I turn into a hater of a game I truly loved.

If novelty is your criterion for enjoying Halo, I think you're going to be disappointed. Halo's trademark attributes were all brand new back in 2000 or whenever it came out; but, the gaming market is saturated with those things today. Remember when you first crashed into the ring and emerged from the escape pod? Do you remember the sublime sense of awe that you felt gazing at the towering cliffs and the raging water? Today, we view that level as primitive and comparatively barren to modern level design; however, the aforementioned "sense of awe" was, and is, Halo's trademark. If you want new, you're going to be disappointed by Reach. If you want a refinement of what made the original Halo new and great, you might enjoy it.

 

[lukemdizzle]

Well the story of Halo 2 and 3 was bad. No need to talk about that. but gameplay wise they all worked really well.
To each his own I guess.

I guess I just want more epic Sci-Fi games. all we have now are Mass Effect (Which is awesome) and halo.

Im just going to have to step in and say that halo 2 had the best story in the series. but ya halo 3 was a disappointment on almost all levels

reach looks awesome though

 

[TheGreatKlaid]

It's a fine question actually. The better one nowadays, but you know LucasArts was doing great stuff ages ago. Look at The Dark Forces series or Outlaws. Something happened where LucasArts stopped being awesome and I'll figure it out one day, but I digress. FPS is a stale genre nowadays, probably thanks to Halo and CoD. You can't compete when everyone buys them. Think what was the last FPS you played that not everyone else has? Also someone let me know if they've ever played Outlaws I'm curious to know how obscure it really is.

 

[SpaceChick]

Halo takes more skill than any other shooter. I'm a cod4 man, but the balance in Halo allows a higher level of play. It's not simply see someone first and you kill them. There are no god weapons.

What the ....
You never heard of Counter-Strike, Quake?

 

[hyperdrachen]

Halo is just damn well made. So are other games. For me the number 1 appeal of halo vs other fine shooters is how seemless the vehicles are, particularly thier physics. In every other shooter I've played where you can switch between foot-soldier and vehicle on the fly, the vehicles feel completely phoned in, physics, and control wise. The guns are widely varied, maps have alot of interesting terrain, with nice elevation changes.

It's true the halo sandbox has changed very little since it's inception. But it's tightened up made some mistakes(felt like halo 2 had some really boring campaign levels), learned from those mistakes, and continue to polish it's facets to a mirror sheen. This is a AAA game, with the hard work of talented people pushing it. Reach is adding a bit more to play with in the form of the armor abilities, obviously not a halo original, but I played the beta and they're alot of fun to use and seem to slot into the halo experience well.

Halo(The games alone) doesn't do much in the way of exposition, though the second game did a great job of explaining the motivations behind the covenant, though through cutscenes mostly as opposed to my prefered "Half-life" method. From the games for the most part you do just catch fleeting glimpses of the underlying story, you could get more from expanded universe content, but that doesn't really reflect on the games themselves. So for that Halo gets bashed for mediocre story. But vague stories surrounding unclear events exposed through brief glimpses of cut scenes/text screens are total genius so long as they're indie games apparently... Braid.

That said if you have to be told, why to like halo, do you really need to bother? If you're not enjoying the game anymore stop playing. Lots of other great stuff out there. Just don't be such a vapid douche that "hating halo" becomes a stand in for a real personality.

Call me any name you like, I'm sure being a snob and hating on the game due to it's widely approachable and beloved design is alot of fun. The fact that the game does not emphasise your game element of choice doesn't make it mediocre, it's just not your cup of tea. It's alot of fine work, put into things you don't care about. Lets try and keep that distinction clear.

 

[lukemdizzle]

Halo was one of the first games to introduce people to that dancing ritual they do in FPS, basically you get shot and you can still turn around and have a little dance with your opponent and win the fight due to the huge health -snip-

I'm going to be careful not to get told off this time, and assume you meant to say "FPS games" and not just "games" there - because I'm fairly certain a Mammoth Tank in Command and Conquer doesn't die easily against a lone infantryman when he attacks it, even if the controlling player isn't looking.

Doom (again)
Doom 2 (again)
Almost everything else based on the Doom Engine (again)
Rise of the Triad
Duke Nukem 3D
Quake
Quake 2
Anything with "Unreal" in the title
Many, many mods for most of the above games.

I'm not even going to bother giving a list the size of the last one... But I could, easily.

Im going to agree with you there halo did not invent this system. hat I will say is that this system is very different in all the games listed and theres a lot of room for variation ( amount of health, weapon damage, and movement speed) within this way of handling multi player. that being said, Halo has my favorite multiplayer in any series but to each his own

 

[obliviondoll]

I know but comparing the likes of Gears of war and Mass effect to Halo seems a little unfair to halo. Compare it to other FPS games.

I didn't list any RPGs (except indirectly by referencing Hexen, and including Strife - it's a Doom Engine game)

And most conventions of first- and third-person games are similar enough that in context, the comparison is a fair one. There are heavily realism-focused games in both perspectives, and more heavily fun-focused games as well. I was pointing that out specifically in response to the person who basically claimed EVERY SINGLE OTHER SHOOTER GAME was focusing on realism.

Painfully untrue, that.

And as for forgetting TF2, no I didn't, I mentioned there were a LOT I hadn't listed. And TF2 is a remake of a mod anyway. Admittedly, that mod would have been a great standalone game in its own right (better than the X-Men Quake mod they actually turned into a game and made some money off of, anyway)

EDIT: noticed something I missed from a previous post in this thread... Someone claims Halo invented the modern console FPS control scheme. Goldeneye on N64 did that.

Halo ripped the control scheme, but had a controller it was better suited to, the N64 trigger was harder to get to, especially for small hands.

 

[nuba km]

a lot of shooters focus on realistic combat, Halo is still the one and only fun above realism shooter

there are better non-realistic fps games coming out(they look better from what I have scene) and one out know.
out know:
borderlands: which does non-realistic pure run and gun shooting a lot better has insane weapons over the top enemies and cool abilities.

coming out
bulletstorm (being made by the same people that made painkiller)
brink (as well as running and gunning you can free run and have tones of customization options)

 

[DigitalSushi]

Sure, ever play tribes 2 ? Every thing you said about halo had been done in tribes 2. You had shields and vast amount of health. This meant that it wasn't all about getting the jump on someone, you still had the opportunity to win the fight even if you were caught out. Therefore Halo is not original for doing this because it has been done before !

I've not played Tribes 2 sorry to say, although I did hear good things about it when I was younger, I'll admit I did mean "mainstream FPS" titles as opposed to those cult hit games, so yeah sorry about that my fault.

But my point still stands, Halo was the first true break out hit that had you doing the death dance with an opponent.

Halo was one of the first games to introduce people to that dancing ritual they do in FPS, basically you get shot and you can still turn around and have a little dance with your opponent and win the fight due to the huge health -snip-

I'm going to be careful not to get told off this time, and assume you meant to say "FPS games" and not just "games" there - because I'm fairly certain a Mammoth Tank in Command and Conquer doesn't die easily against a lone infantryman when he attacks it, even if the controlling player isn't looking.

Doom (again)
Doom 2 (again)
Almost everything else based on the Doom Engine (again)
Rise of the Triad
Duke Nukem 3D
Quake
Quake 2
Anything with "Unreal" in the title
Many, many mods for most of the above games.

I'm not even going to bother giving a list the size of the last one... But I could, easily.

Why did you get told off buddy?, and of course I meant FPS games, its a thread about FPS games... all your doing there is arguing a point about semantics.

Whats the list for?, if your trying to refute my death dance claim then I'll counter it by saying I played those at pro level and "shoot well they die", especially Unreal since all the guns had special tricks to them that made them more powerful.

 

[Dogstile]

Halo offers a fun game everybody has and nobody really takes seriously.

Why do you even care about other peoples opinions, either you like it or you don't.

Edit:

For anyone saying it wasn't original therefore it wasn't fun. Do me a favour, point out original games without "gimmicks" being the originality. These games also have to be fun and well made. This rules out you pointing out buggy games with original content, because what good is original content if its boring and doesn't work?

That's the reason halo is fun. It works well, has few bugs and it's rather fun to see people fall over trying to tell you that you're wrong for enjoying it. Halo is a never ending source of amusement for me.

 

[kebab4you]

When Halo came out it set a new standard for FPS, and almot every shooter has taken after it since./quote]
It did not, however it did start the whole "health bar? what´s that?! That´s just silly and unrealistic"

 

[imnot]

Because It does everything better than most other fps's and is fun!

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

No its originalitie isn't killing it, its because so many other games have copied it and expanded, Halo is now left behind not being able expand without them copying someone else.

Uh...

1974.

Halo was the first widely successful console multiplayer first person shooter game. Beyond those specific elements, I'd have to say it was one in a LONG, LONG line.

Even Space Marines versus an "Alien" menace had been done as far back as Wizard of Wor.

And there's a number of games today that don't use the Halo model purely because it's got boring.

 

[Baron von Awesome]

I have kind of a neutral opinion on the Halo franchise. Not a huge fan, but I don't hate it for what it is. I feel like so many people hate it because of the popularity it achieved and the people that played it. I remember when I was in college I was asked so many times. "Hey, bra', wanna play some Halo?" I knew so many frat boys who had an Xbox and Halo, but no other games. I think that kinda made people feel like Halo was a stupid frat boy game, and if you liked it that you might be a stupid frat boy. I feel like the first two didn't have terrible stories. I never really much liked the style, but they were relatively fun to play. I was bored to tears by ODST, and I never played the third one. But I think there are far worse and far more stupid games out there than the Halo ones. But I think closing the series with Reach is a pretty good idea. The latest games haven't been bad, time to give it a good send off, before it goes bad like Medal of Honor did, or like Call of Duty probably will.

But that doesn't mean that me and a couple of my friends won't get together get a couple of beers and system link ODST's Survival Mode and have a great time.

 

[FinalHeart95]

I find it fun. Isn't that the point anyway?

Even without innovation and the like, and I do personally believe the first game really helped to set the standard for console FPS games from that point on (hence not forgetting Goldeneye, and key word: HELPED), Halo is simple a FUN game series. I'll still play Halo 3 custom games with friends to this day. Is it my favorite game of all-time? Not even close. I still have fun playing it though.

 

[hudsonzero]

it a a colour pallet that's more than about 50 shades of brown

 

[TPiddy]

That said if you have to be told, why to like halo, do you really need to bother? If you're not enjoying the game anymore stop playing. Lots of other great stuff out there. Just don't be such a vapid douche that "hating halo" becomes a stand in for a real personality.

Call me any name you like, I'm sure being a snob and hating on the game due to it's widely approachable and beloved design is alot of fun. The fact that the game does not emphasise your game element of choice doesn't make it mediocre, it's just not your cup of tea. It's alot of fine work, put into things you don't care about. Lets try and keep that distinction clear.

Just thought I'd quote this since it was so well written. As much as the haters like to say otherwise, point out games that came before it.... face it... Halo caused a console FPS revolution that is still being felt today. Hell, no Halo = no XBox 360, period. You can't understate Halo's contribution to the console universe. Master Chief is Microsoft's answer to Mario.

 

[UBERfionn]

I know but comparing the likes of Gears of war and Mass effect to Halo seems a little unfair to halo. Compare it to other FPS games.

I didn't list any RPGs (except indirectly by referencing Hexen, and including Strife - it's a Doom Engine game)

And most conventions of first- and third-person games are similar enough that in context, the comparison is a fair one. There are heavily realism-focused games in both perspectives, and more heavily fun-focused games as well. I was pointing that out specifically in response to the person who basically claimed EVERY SINGLE OTHER SHOOTER GAME was focusing on realism.

Painfully untrue, that.

And as for forgetting TF2, no I didn't, I mentioned there were a LOT I hadn't listed. And TF2 is a remake of a mod anyway. Admittedly, that mod would have been a great standalone game in its own right (better than the X-Men Quake mod they actually turned into a game and made some money off of, anyway)

EDIT: noticed something I missed from a previous post in this thread... Someone claims Halo invented the modern console FPS control scheme. Goldeneye on N64 did that.

Halo ripped the control scheme, but had a controller it was better suited to, the N64 trigger was harder to get to, especially for small hands.

Mass effect is a third person shooter AND an RPG. it can be both.
But ya you're right about the halo not being the only non realistic game out there.

 

[AVATAR_RAGE]

Note that im not a hater on Halo. I actually love it! But heres my problem. When Halo came out it set a new standard for FPS, and almot every shooter has taken after it since. You could say its the core of all FPS since its release. But what does Halo possibly have that no other shooter has now? I know this is mostly from my opinion but creativity wise, there isn't much that has been added. Or at least not original to Halo. I just feel like when I play it, its beginning to turn into a blurry screen and all I see are the basics of all guns, armor, and vehicles in todays FPS. So all I ask of you is to tell me what Halo possibly offers that we haven't already seen? I just want to enjoy the series again before I turn into a hater of a game I truly loved.

Halo brings little new additions each game. Mainly for the multiplayer, it's easy to pick up and having a personalised in game avatar makes your character more recognisable when playing with friends. Bungi think of somthing new for each game, allowing it to feel fresh but familiar at the same time.

I have grown to dislike the Halo franchise, however if you gave me the choice between halo and cod, I would pick halo hands down.

(F.Y.I, I'm not a Halo fanboy, nor do I even own a 360)