Plot holes in "Avatar"

[Rigs83]

Plot holes?
One for me is the fact that a human betrayed his fellow human to help aliens.
I personally don't understand why he would do it.

Because he liked the Na'vi more than the humans. Doesn't get more simple than that

He's a traitor in my opinion.

A traitor from a bad cause does not make a bad person.

Like the Nazis' who tried to assassinate Hitler. Those guys were cool only because everyone else was so bad in comparison.

 

[Xanadu84]

#2 They showed Norm leave the pod with a gun and mask, then wander off into the jungle. It was probably so when the mech crushed his pod we knew he was no longer in it.

Now a question of my own that's not quite a plot hole either. Why do the mech things need knives?

Because the forest is filled with stealthy predators that hunt by ambush. If you're jumped from behind, and a thing is trying to claw its way through your suit, a gun is not as useful as a blade. A blade can also cut things in the way, and is a extremely inexpensive thing to include (Piece of sharp metal is a pretty minot addition when your makeing a robot). Case in point: The bad guy managed to kill that creature whatshername was riding with the knife, and he probably would not have managed that if he just had his gun.

 

[funguy2121]

So I went to the theater yesterday and saw Avatar in 3d. It was pretty good. Today, I was reflecting on the movie a little when I realized there was something odd. I shall recount the scenes in which this plot hole occurs.

WARNING, SPOILERS

Hole #1 (my friend actually pointed this one out): In the beginning scene where Jake first takes control of the avatar, he comes across numerous other avatars (the ones playing basketball, numerous others you see scattered about). These ones are never seen in the movie again. Who's avatars are they and what purpose do they serve?

Hole #2: During the final battle, we see that the avatar of Norm (the other scientist guy) is killed. Norm emerges from his pod, perfectly fine but visibly shaken. Later, once the main bad guy dies, Jake's real body ends up on the ground outside his pod, struggling for air. Na'vi princess lady comes in and everythings fine.

END SPOILERS

#1: Ok, so it's not really a plot hole, but it's still interesting to point out. There seems to be no purpose for them to be there.

#2: So, where did Norm go? Did he just wander off into the jungle? Surely he would have gone to help his friend Jake, who was struggling for breath on the floor of the mobile outpost. We see him again later at the end, but where did he go?

Did anyone else catch these? Or am I just wrong and missed something that would explain this?

#1 Movies 101: When using a smaller story as a lens through which to view a larger one (so it's more personal), it's commonplace and perfectly acceptable to only show brief scenes of the other goings on in the larger story to simply convey that they are there. Jake is obviously not the only avatar being used at not the only unobtainiom site ruled by not the only Na'vi; also, it appeared to be a training site for getting humans used to controlling their avatars on Pandora.

#2 I don't really remember what happened to Norm after his avatar bit it, but I believe he took to the fight in human form after.

 

[Booze Zombie]

I also have no idea what you mean by "no reason for being the way he is". Do you mean why he's in a wheelchair? Or why he turns against the greedy, aggressive, authoritarian humans in favour of the harmonious, romantic, wonderful Na'Vi and a super strong super fast body that he could only dream of as a human?

ANTAGONIST, as in "the villain", not the PROTAGNONIST, which is "the hero".

 

[Lucane]

Hole #1 (my friend actually pointed this one out): In the beginning scene where Jake first takes control of the avatar, he comes across numerous other avatars (the ones playing basketball, numerous others you see scattered about). These ones are never seen in the movie again. Who's avatars are they and what purpose do they serve?

Hole #2: During the final battle, we see that the avatar of Norm (the other scientist guy) is killed. Norm emerges from his pod, perfectly fine but visibly shaken. Later, once the main bad guy dies, Jake's real body ends up on the ground outside his pod, struggling for air. Na'vi princess lady comes in and everythings fine.

1) That's not a hole at all. They just didn't show up again because they were elsewhere, doing other things. Every character we see doesn't have to be a part of the story the entire way through.

2) I don't understand the hole here. You may be confused. The atmosphere of Pandora is toxic to humans. They need gas masks to breathe. When Norm emerged, the mobile research pod was sealed and filled with Earth-like atmosphere, so he was okay. During the final battle with the walker, however, the Captain broke into the pod and the Pandoran atmosphere began leaking in, making Jake asphyxiate.

What I don't understand is the whole deal with the big flying things. Supposedly, you "connect for life" with a certain one, but halfway through Jake ditches his for the big orange one.

Other way around the Banshees only bond with one person, people can get more than one however.

 

[tk1989]

Hole #1 (my friend actually pointed this one out): In the beginning scene where Jake first takes control of the avatar, he comes across numerous other avatars (the ones playing basketball, numerous others you see scattered about). These ones are never seen in the movie again. Who's avatars are they and what purpose do they serve?

Hole #2: During the final battle, we see that the avatar of Norm (the other scientist guy) is killed. Norm emerges from his pod, perfectly fine but visibly shaken. Later, once the main bad guy dies, Jake's real body ends up on the ground outside his pod, struggling for air. Na'vi princess lady comes in and everythings fine.

Neither of these are holes, you just werent very perceptive.

No. 1: He comes across other avatars, and you dont see them again because they go off and do their own research etc in other areas of the planet im guessing. However, i am pretty sure you see them again; in the last scene i am pretty sure i saw some avatars with human clothing on (you know, when the rest of the humans are being led onto the ship heading back to earth). This leads me to believe that some of these people stayed behind much like the main character did, trying to coexist in some way in avatar form (please correct me if i am wrong and am totally talking bullshit, but i am pretty sure i saw some avatars in human clothing).

No. 2: When Norm emerges the lab is intact and hasnt been breached by the outside worlds deadly gasses. However, in Jakes fight with the colonel the lab gets breached as the Colonel tries to kill jake whilst he is in the machine. This allows the gasses to escape into the lab and that is why he struggles to breathe.

I am sure someone probably already answered these plot hole questions, but i hope this helped in some way.

 

[deltasniper1640]

So I went to the theater yesterday and saw Avatar in 3d. It was pretty good. Today, I was reflecting on the movie a little when I realized there was something odd. I shall recount the scenes in which this plot hole occurs.

WARNING, SPOILERS

Hole #1 (my friend actually pointed this one out): In the beginning scene where Jake first takes control of the avatar, he comes across numerous other avatars (the ones playing basketball, numerous others you see scattered about). These ones are never seen in the movie again. Who's avatars are they and what purpose do they serve?

Hole #2: During the final battle, we see that the avatar of Norm (the other scientist guy) is killed. Norm emerges from his pod, perfectly fine but visibly shaken. Later, once the main bad guy dies, Jake's real body ends up on the ground outside his pod, struggling for air. Na'vi princess lady comes in and everythings fine.

END SPOILERS

#1: Ok, so it's not really a plot hole, but it's still interesting to point out. There seems to be no purpose for them to be there.

#2: So, where did Norm go? Did he just wander off into the jungle? Surely he would have gone to help his friend Jake, who was struggling for breath on the floor of the mobile outpost. We see him again later at the end, but where did he go?

Did anyone else catch these? Or am I just wrong and missed something that would explain this?

For Hole #1, there were more then just the 2 scientist and jake in the Avatar project. The program had been going on for a while.

Hole #2, Norms avatar died but its not the matrix, if his avatar dies then the driver is ok, but if the driver dies so does the avatar. When norms avatar died norm gets out of the chamber clinching his heart, so it still hurts. But when jake breathed in the air from the planet that is poisonous to humans (the glass broke in the room that he was in) he woke up making his avatar "fell asleep"

 

[funguy2121]

(1)What about the fact that the main antagonist has no real reason for being the way he is or that this story is (2)Dances With Wolves, with (3)plot holes, white guilt and even seemingly, (4)anti-human sentiment.

(1)Perhaps you can explain this to the people of AIG, Enron, Halliburton, Wal-mart and Blackwater. They don't even need the people they kill/ruin/fuck over to be aliens.

(2)Actually, I believe it's meant to be Pocahontas. Have you seen Star Wars? It was a collage of centuries-old mythology (Biblical imagery, Greco-Roman mythology, Beowulf) and pop-culture archetypes (serials and sci-fi; the scrolling story intro came from Flash Gordon).

(3)Please Es-splain.

(4)Can people just not take it when the bad guys aren't the aliens and the humans aren't all saints? Weren't more than half of the main empathetic characters human?

 

[Danny Ocean]

What I don't understand is the whole deal with the big flying things. Supposedly, you "connect for life" with a certain one, but halfway through Jake ditches his for the big orange one.

The one he connected with first is still unable to connect with someone else.

I don't think they were after resources that they needed and had run out of, they were after a certain resource that sold for alot. Basically, they were trying make money not survive.

That's bullshit. Why would there be such a high demand for this resource if it wasn't necessary?

It's a room-temperature super-conductor. Used to maintain and build the globe-spanning super-monorails back on earth, among other things that superconductors are useful for. It's super conductive nature is also why it hovers. Which in turn explains the floating mountains.

Hole #1 (my friend actually pointed this one out): In the beginning scene where Jake first takes control of the avatar, he comes across numerous other avatars (the ones playing basketball, numerous others you see scattered about). These ones are never seen in the movie again. Who's avatars are they and what purpose do they serve?

There are many other tribes that need connecting to, there are schools that need running, and samples that need collecting. They are off doing other stuff.

#2: So, where did Norm go? Did he just wander off into the jungle? Surely he would have gone to help his friend Jake, who was struggling for breath on the floor of the mobile outpost. We see him again later at the end, but where did he go?

He was killed quite a while before Jake was. He grabbed a gun and a mask and ran off to help fight where his avatar had fallen.

What about the fact that the main antagonist has no real reason for being the way he is

The military commander spent several years in a traumatic warzone before going to Pandora. I'm pretty sure he gives a speech on it to the protagonist.

 

[Tdc2182]

For a person who has seen the movie 5 times now (yes I know excessive) I can point out the possible reasons.

.

5 times? Jeez, I had to see it twice cuz I had no other choice.

 

[Motti]

Do people lose billions of dollars worth of future tech when fighting over drugs? I don't think so. The value of the unobtanium would have to somehow outweigh all the money they spent trying to get it. And the only way something could be that valuable was if it was neccesary for human survival/expansion.

Exactly what I was thinking during the movie. For all we know, unobtainium could be incredibly useful for medicine, or it could be a fossil fuel that's 100% efficient (by comparison, I think coal is something like 30). If it was just a pretty rock then I doubt it would sell for as much as it does in the movie.

 

[Danny Ocean]

MY problem with the movie was what happens to the avatars when they're uninhabited? They would need to be alive to continue breathing and such without a consciousness in them, but in order to keep the heart beating and such there would have to be brainwaves which means that it would have to be alive and have some form of consciousness, and if not, then it would stop breathing and essentially be dead and start to rot. So since there must be life in it, then you're essentially either sharing, mind-controlling, or elbowing out another consciousness. It's complicated but makes sense if you think about it.

There are different levels of conciousness.

They pass out when a human is not controlling them. The human controlling them is ejected if they pass out. This suggests to me that the avatars still posses subconscious functions, but humans take over the concious ones.

 

[Canid117]

What about the fact that the main antagonist has no real reason for being the way he is or that this story is Dances With Wolves, with plot holes, white guilt and even seemingly, anti-human sentiment.

Okay, none of those are plot holes. And you can't use "it has plot holes" as one of your plot holes.
I also have no idea what you mean by "no reason for being the way he is". Do you mean why he's in a wheelchair? Or why he turns against the greedy, aggressive, authoritarian humans in favour of the harmonious, romantic, wonderful Na'Vi and a super strong super fast body that he could only dream of as a human?

And, more importantly: Have you seen Dances with Wolves? Because I'd not even heard of it until all the "Dances with Smurfs" bullshit, and now it's suddenly become extremely prevalent. Have I somehow completely missed a phenomonally well known classic or is everyone just jumping on the bandwagon?

Antagonist means the bad guy. In this case Colonel Quarditch or however you spell his name. Jake Sully was the protagonist. And for the second "plot hole" she came in and put his mask on which allowed him to breathe though how he managed to turn the mask on after he had lost consciousness is a puzzle I have yet to solve. If you notice in the movie the princess puts on the mask after he has lost consciousness and nothing happens for a few seconds. Then he comes back to life and turns the mask on and starts to breathe again.That is a plot hole that continues to vex me. And was any one else annoyed by the main characters accent leaking through during the movie? Couldn't he have done a little more accent training or better yet just let it out and change the story so he was a royal marine instead of a US marine? If James Cameron thinks the American film demographic can relate to giant blue kitty people then why not foreigners?

 

[Booze Zombie]

The military commander spent several years in a traumatic warzone before going to Pandora. I'm pretty sure he gives a speech on it to the protagonist.

You mean where he states that they're having a "war on terror" even though "the navi" have done nothing to them yet?

That seems like a plot hole to me.

Though, I actually meant the "pure evil" corporate guy, I do believe he was playing golf whilst people were dying.
Seriously, all he needed was a waxed mustache.

 

[Danny Ocean]

The military commander spent several years in a traumatic warzone before going to Pandora. I'm pretty sure he gives a speech on it to the protagonist.

You mean where he states that they're having a "war on terror" even though "the navi" have done nothing to them yet?

Heh. I don't know which part you mean, but that's just an easy excuse. He's trying to win Jake over.

Honestly, I'm sure I remember him lecturing someone in the film about his time before he was on Pandora, and it explains why he's such a dick.

Though, I actually meant the "pure evil" corporate guy, I do believe he was playing golf whilst people were dying.
Seriously, all he needed was a waxed mustache.

Well hey, there are plenty of people like that around now. Doesn't even need to be aliens for them to sink a hole in one whilst thousands die.

But then there must be life and a consciousness inside them. It's like if you shoved your mind into the mind of a person in a vegetative state. You're fucking with someone else

It's more like... uh..

Okay, say the avatar is a plane. When it passes out, that's autopilot. It can't do much but keep the thing alive.
When a human connects to one, that's like the pilot walking in, sitting down, and switching to manual. The autopilot machine is still there, it's just overriden by manual controls.

As there was no pilot in there before, he's not taking over anything. As soon as he leaves, the autopilot is switched back on.

 

[Canid117]

The military commander spent several years in a traumatic warzone before going to Pandora. I'm pretty sure he gives a speech on it to the protagonist.

You mean where he states that they're having a "war on terror" even though "the navi" have done nothing to them yet?

That seems like a plot hole to me.

Though, I actually meant the "pure evil" corporate guy, I do believe he was playing golf whilst people were dying.
Seriously, all he needed was a waxed mustache.

There are videos of Enron execs laughing their asses off while they create artificial blackouts and charge unimaginable prices for power from their out of state plants to Californian customers. People in corporate America can be soulless dicks.


(I hate the word "corporate" which is the second most annoying hippy buzzword after "military industrial complex")

 

[TotallyFake]

What about the fact that the main antagonist has no real reason for being the way he is or that this story is Dances With Wolves, with plot holes, white guilt and even seemingly, anti-human sentiment.

Okay, none of those are plot holes. And you can't use "it has plot holes" as one of your plot holes.
I also have no idea what you mean by "no reason for being the way he is". Do you mean why he's in a wheelchair? Or why he turns against the greedy, aggressive, authoritarian humans in favour of the harmonious, romantic, wonderful Na'Vi and a super strong super fast body that he could only dream of as a human?

And, more importantly: Have you seen Dances with Wolves? Because I'd not even heard of it until all the "Dances with Smurfs" bullshit, and now it's suddenly become extremely prevalent. Have I somehow completely missed a phenomonally well known classic or is everyone just jumping on the bandwagon?

Antagonist means the bad guy. In this case Colonel Quarditch or however you spell his name. Jake Sully was the protagonist. And for the second "plot hole" she came in and put his mask on which allowed him to breathe though how he managed to turn the mask on after he had lost consciousness is a puzzle I have yet to solve. If you notice in the movie the princess puts on the mask after he has lost consciousness and nothing happens for a few seconds. Then he comes back to life and turns the mask on and starts to breathe again.That is a plot hole that continues to vex me. And was any one else annoyed by the main characters accent leaking through during the movie? Couldn't he have done a little more accent training or better yet just let it out and change the story so he was a royal marine instead of a US marine? If James Cameron thinks the American film demographic can relate to giant blue kitty people then why not foreigners?

Sorry, misread my pro- and an-.
As to the mask thing, that's kinda nitpicky. It's an emergency oxygen mask on a planet which will knock you out in 20 seconds, is it that hard to believe it turns on automatically when you pull it out? And then he tweaks it and it kinda sucks onto his head to fit properly.

It did kinda annoy me how one-sided Humans-Are-Bastards it was. It would've been nice if they could've found peace rather than being kicked out, especially as the film ALMOST tries to draw parallels. They beat us up in the air, we kick their asses on the ground. Both cultures have some form of brain transfer, ours is mechanical, there's is biological. Even our planes look vaguely hexapod (two rotors on each side, 2 small at the back with legs underneath). Both armies plug in to heavy machines, we have mechs, they have the horses. Heck, the Soul Tree is essentially the internet.

As it is, it's just a damn fine action film. But it could've been more.

 

[Icecoldcynic]

From reading a lot of responses in this thread, I can only come to the conclusion that some people go to see movies, but don't actually comprehend half the things that happen. Am I the only one who pays attention to every line of dialogue?