Poll: Dungeons and Dragons 4th EDon'tion

[obex]

I don't mind either however i do own allot of the books for 3.5 which makes me look more favourably on it as i have invested allot of money for the books and i don't want to do the same thing with 4th ED

 

[CakeDragon]

I play 4th with some friends. I like it, but then when I played some 1st I realised that was much, much better. I guess 4th is just war gaming on paper, and your (level 1 demi-god... they may as well be) character is waaaay more confusing. But then again, I do like both. I think it just depends on how detailed you want a game to be. And of course, an experienced DM makes things much more exciting.

 

[Amnestic]

Better than wasting months of your life and hundreds of dollars on WoW before realizing it's bad and you're addicted.

Grow a backbone. If you're not enjoying your time on WoW, then stop.

I did. Do you really think a current player would shame glorious Blizzard like that?

You've obviously never browsed the official WoW forums.

Oh the whining...

 

[lostclause]

snip for length

I'll look into tracking a few of these down (my group seems to be getting a bit bored of 3.5). Hopefully they'll have made it to the colonies and thanks for your recommendations.

Sweet holy beejesus I love the internet. Ars Magica is free to a good home WTF ?

http://e23.sjgames.com/item.html?id=AG0204

Back in my day we paid £15-20 a pop you damn freeloaders

That's the way our generation does it Thanks for the link, that site looks good.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Yeah, was always more fun if they killed themselves . You put enough ideas & clues in there you can get em to eat a shotgun barrel under the assumption theyll save the rest of the group . Note :- Uncontrolled giggling ruins the characters self sacrifice somewhat

Any GM who kills players in CoC or Paranoia isn't playing it right.

If they beg you for death and then the other players kill them, THEN you're doing it right.

And I actually liked Cyborg Commandoes, so much I actually got the novels. If you play it far more Day Of The Triffids/War of the Worlds, then you can get some extremely good action.

Gygax does love to bounce those funny dice though. FUDGE [http://www.fudgerpg.com/] it and it works well though.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

You might want to check out the old TSR Top Secret and Agent 13 novels as well, they're quite good.

The WoD are hit and miss, but the Mage one is wonderful.

But RIFTS....eugh. When you have a game built for min/maxxers, (Like TMNT : Level 1 Weasel with +18 to hit on a d20) then you sort of think "Why do I need a ruleset other than Toon?"

 

[JesterRaiin]

KULT anyone ? )

 

[ace_of_something]

I've been playing Pen and Paper games for about 17 years now. I remember when they made 'advanced' D&D it was ruined forever.
When they made 3rd edition it was ruined forever.
3.5 also ruined the game forever.
and now with the advent of 4th edition the game has been ruined forever.

In every addition they try to simplify the rules a little more. I also noticed magic becomes more common place with each addition. (Remember when a +1 sword was a big deal?)

The only reason people make the WoW anology is because WotC added titles to the different 'combat roles' defender, striker, leader, controller. Which D&D HAS HAD ALL ALONG. Can remember anyone remeber saying "Who is going to be the healer?" or "Who is going to be the Warrior?"

I think its cool. I just see it as a different game. If you want roleplaying play Mage.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

KULT anyone ? )

KULT is the game that Call of Cthulu players say "That's just too nihlistic."

A 2 point flaw in that game is something like "Your Mother was torn apart by demons as you watched and then joined in."

 

[eg05170]

4ed.... can we really call it D&D?... D&D has always, compaired to many other P&P systems, been a little combat heavy, but with 4ed they just took all, and i mean ALL, the roleplay out and replaced it with game rules that are so easy that they border on beeing easier than most family oriented board games in existence... It really just makes me plain mad that a game that was always meant as a roleplaying game has now been boiled down to something that looks, and feels, like a cross between Frag and magic the gathering... to take an example of just how much the game has been defiled lets take a look at the monster manual... in 3.5 the monster manual had lots of background info on each monster described in the book... all that went away to make room for MORE versions of the same monster in 4ed... you practically cant even customize them...

in other words i don't hate 4ed... i despise it...

 

[Altorin]

I'll play 4.0 if there's no 3.5 going, but I won't enjoy it anywhere near as much.
I just find giving everyone powers has the wrong feel to it. The difference between the magic (of spells), the training (of feats) and the lifestyle (of class features) was an important part of the character's feel to me, and 4.0 has just killed that of completely.
I'm not too fond of the way 4.0 monsters are done either. I don't like how each critter is designed as an essentailly separate set of stats with just a keyword in common with their fellows rather than creating a character of the appropriate monster race (the "those goblins have class levels" reaction is often fun).
The changes in the way cross-classing works and the way classes have been shoe-horned into specific roles means that coming up with a character concept that I alctually want to play is a lot harder than it was for 3.5, particularly as the lack of skill points means I can't put a few ranks in something that's in-character but not much use in the average skill challenge.
Part of my dislike is the fairly petty fact that none of my old house rules that I've built my most successful games around work in 4.0.

To those who say 3.5 was broken, I say that no rpg is 100% broken unless the DM is letting it be broken.

thank you, that is the first anti-4.0 post that I can agree with.

I'm sorry, I can't agree with people spouting nerd rage with absolutely NOTHING backing it up. But you lay out your argument, support it with information from the game.

I don't necessarily agree with what you're saying, but I respect you for sharing a meaningful and level-headed point of view.

I haven't had any trouble coming up with interesting characters.. Especially with the introduction of Character Background bonuses in the PHB2 and the Forgotten Realms campaign book. But even before that, making an interesting character has very little to do with the rules, and all to do with your imagination.

I started making a Dragonborn Warlock, and decided I wanted to take the Fey Pact.. I made him an old Codger who fell into the Feywild as a hatchling, Jumanji style, and came out with an absolute detest for Hubris. He found the cult of the Raven Queen, and identified with them, becoming a crossclassed cleric of the Raven Queen.

Another character that was made for my game was a dwarf fighter who had mild Narcolepsy. The idea was that he would fight valiantly to get his reward - a good night's sleep. He was constantly haunted by nightmares of his destroyed village, so he would wear himself out in order to sleep. He was played very sleepily, and even had his own special nightcap - Goat's Milk curdled in Strong Ale (Just like Mom used to make, lol). Another interesting character.

Third character made for my game was a Tiefling Warlock who collected skulls of all shapes and varieties, so that in her hold, she could house many many many pet spiders.. each one having a size appropriate skull to live in. Her favorite pet was a large tarantula that lived inside a goblin skull that she kept at her side. It served as her familiar.

You may scoff at these characters, but I thought each one of them was very well built and interesting characters, and none of them felt shoehorned into a role they didn't want, and they had no problem using skills and feats and powers to play up the interesting aspects of their character.

 

[Pumpkin_Eater]

You've obviously never browsed the official WoW forums.

Oh the whining...

Not for a year or so. I'll just take your word on that.

 

[Amnestic]

You've obviously never browsed the official WoW forums.

Oh the whining...

Not for a year or so. I'll just take your word on that.

It makes even my experienced, troll resistant brain start to melt after a while.

And yet I got banned for calling them an idiot! Preposterous!

 

[MasterSqueak]

Love the bias-filled poll options.

I'm just going to go see how the 4th Edition campaign I'm part of is going.

 

[Foolishman1776]

Fourth Edition fixed a lot of balance issues, at the cost of being D&D for Idiots. It's fun to play, but character development is a bit shallow, and the way the system is built makes immersion practically impossible. The characters and classes are very bland. All in all it's a functional, if somewhat dull system.

 

[JesterRaiin]

KULT anyone ? )

KULT is the game that Call of Cthulu players say "That's just too nihlistic."
A 2 point flaw in that game is something like "Your Mother was torn apart by demons as you watched and then joined in."

Naaaaaaaaaaaaah. Superstitions.

 

[NoSlottedToaster]

I quite like 4th Edition - 3.5 was completely broken (apparently) and I prefer to spend hours killing things and having fun than spending hours just talking and not having fun.

my point, all the talking is what made it role playing and all the killing is what makes it a WoW on paper, granted a good game should have equal amounts of each

I don't know what game you were playing all this time but 3.5 DID NOT make any special clemencies towards Roleplaying. In fact "Roleplaying" support is something DnD has been failing at since it's inception.

A game with good "roleplaying" support is one that can translate Back Story, Character Motivation and Character Personality into Rewarding Gameplay. The game I've seen that does this best is Spirit of The Century from Evil Hat productions which uses the FATE engine for it's gameplay, a large portion of which involves invoking various aspects of your character personality/back story in order to aid you in completing your adventure and this is primarily a system devoted to fast and furious Pulp Action with very little regard for any sort of number crunching.

The "talk" that a lot of people like about 3.5 usually isn't any sort of roleplaying, it revolves around Magic Item Usage and Strategy, talking more about the upcoming battle than actually engaging in it.

At least this is my opinion regarding 3.5.

ok if you look in the optional rules in the DMG you will notice there is a whole section on ad-hoc experience for solving problems, puzzles, and riddles, as well as playing in character and following your alignment. As for backgrounds and motivations, this is covered in the PHBII
where a whole chapter on backgrounds and ect. add more depth to the pcs as well as give them bonuses for choosing to use such bonuses.

 

[Inarticulate_Underachiever]

I've only played 4th edition but I'm enjoying it very much.