Poll: Gay Marriage

[Ninja_X]

It should be legal. A bunch of people cry "defense of marriage" but what 2 totaly differant people want to do doesnt affect me.

Exactly

I know right?

Exactly how does them getting married hurt anyone?

In the same way that a guy sitting on his couch smoking a join and eating up all his cheetos effects someone other than him.

it doesn't really

I'm sorry, but I have to point again to my earlier comments. I understand what you ware saying, but while two people can do whatever they want, the social acceptance of their actions has much larger and more severe consequences.

I'm curious as to what you are claiming. Do you believe that more people will be gay if it is accepted by society? Or is this going to lead to unwarranted extrapolation into issues that have nothing to do with the topic?

The latter is paying off at 2:1 odds.

He was saying that if the majority of society accepts gay marriage then people who are against it will be looked down on.

Which isn't true in my opinion.

If you say you don't like gay marriage because of your religion or something people have to respect that.

You are right: people should respect it. But take a look at our society (heck, the internet is a good place to start), and you will see that respect for others views (what is toted as "tolerance" in our society) is actually a rather rare thing. People think that anyone can believe anything, but ridicule those who think otherwise.

No, anyone can believe anything they want.

The only people who contradict that are people who think you should believe what they do.

That is what I see anyway.

Well I do believe that there is truth, which you seem to be denying. I do think that some things are true whether someone believes them or not. But I also think that people are free to believe anything they want, regardless of its truth. But see, to me, the belief that everyone can believe whatever they want is contradicted when people tell me to believe that.

I just said you could believe anything you want, doesn't make it true.

Let me explain, I grew up around allot of different people and religions. To me, someone who believes in god should get the same respect as someone who believes that elephants are pink and can fly.

You cannot prove that there is no god, per say. But you also cannot prove that there are no pink flying elephants.

So I respect every belief to a degree just don't force others to look at it your way.

But you are right society tends not to be as forgiving as me.

See, people like you are the ones that earn my respect despite my disagreeing with them. You have your beliefs, but you don't have anything against people for believing differently. Far too many people insult and persecute others simply because of differing beliefs, which, as a Christian, I have experienced far too often and far too severely. It's nice to see someone who can have a discussion without throwing insults and stereotypes.

Thank you

If I had my way, gay people could get married and Christians could still believe they are sinners. XD

As long as gay people respect that Christians are different and Christians can continue not likening them as long as both sides kept that belief from manifesting as violence or bigotry.

Because we are all different.

All just like that pink elephant guy, absolutely fucking crazy every last one of us.XD

Cause in our own way, no one is right.

 

[Thaius]

It should be legal. A bunch of people cry "defense of marriage" but what 2 totaly differant people want to do doesnt affect me.

Exactly

I know right?

Exactly how does them getting married hurt anyone?

In the same way that a guy sitting on his couch smoking a join and eating up all his cheetos effects someone other than him.

it doesn't really

I'm sorry, but I have to point again to my earlier comments. I understand what you ware saying, but while two people can do whatever they want, the social acceptance of their actions has much larger and more severe consequences.

I'm curious as to what you are claiming. Do you believe that more people will be gay if it is accepted by society? Or is this going to lead to unwarranted extrapolation into issues that have nothing to do with the topic?

The latter is paying off at 2:1 odds.

He was saying that if the majority of society accepts gay marriage then people who are against it will be looked down on.

Which isn't true in my opinion.

If you say you don't like gay marriage because of your religion or something people have to respect that.

You are right: people should respect it. But take a look at our society (heck, the internet is a good place to start), and you will see that respect for others views (what is toted as "tolerance" in our society) is actually a rather rare thing. People think that anyone can believe anything, but ridicule those who think otherwise.

No, anyone can believe anything they want.

The only people who contradict that are people who think you should believe what they do.

That is what I see anyway.

Well I do believe that there is truth, which you seem to be denying. I do think that some things are true whether someone believes them or not. But I also think that people are free to believe anything they want, regardless of its truth. But see, to me, the belief that everyone can believe whatever they want is contradicted when people tell me to believe that.

I just said you could believe anything you want, doesn't make it true.

Let me explain, I grew up around allot of different people and religions. To me, someone who believes in god should get the same respect as someone who believes that elephants are pink and can fly.

You cannot prove that there is no god, per say. But you also cannot prove that there are no pink flying elephants.

So I respect every belief to a degree just don't force others to look at it your way.

But you are right society tends not to be as forgiving as me.

See, people like you are the ones that earn my respect despite my disagreeing with them. You have your beliefs, but you don't have anything against people for believing differently. Far too many people insult and persecute others simply because of differing beliefs, which, as a Christian, I have experienced far too often and far too severely. It's nice to see someone who can have a discussion without throwing insults and stereotypes.

Thank you

If I had my way, gay people could get married and Christians could still believe they are sinners. XD

As long as gay people respect that Christians are different and Christians can continue not likening them as long as both sides kept that belief from manifesting as violence or bigotry.

Because we are all different. All just like that pink elephant guy, absolutely fucking crazy every last one of us.XD

Crazy? For sure: humanity is nuts.

 

[Ninja_X]

It should be legal. A bunch of people cry "defense of marriage" but what 2 totaly differant people want to do doesnt affect me.

Exactly

I know right?

Exactly how does them getting married hurt anyone?

In the same way that a guy sitting on his couch smoking a join and eating up all his cheetos effects someone other than him.

it doesn't really

I'm sorry, but I have to point again to my earlier comments. I understand what you ware saying, but while two people can do whatever they want, the social acceptance of their actions has much larger and more severe consequences.

I'm curious as to what you are claiming. Do you believe that more people will be gay if it is accepted by society? Or is this going to lead to unwarranted extrapolation into issues that have nothing to do with the topic?

The latter is paying off at 2:1 odds.

He was saying that if the majority of society accepts gay marriage then people who are against it will be looked down on.

Which isn't true in my opinion.

If you say you don't like gay marriage because of your religion or something people have to respect that.

You are right: people should respect it. But take a look at our society (heck, the internet is a good place to start), and you will see that respect for others views (what is toted as "tolerance" in our society) is actually a rather rare thing. People think that anyone can believe anything, but ridicule those who think otherwise.

No, anyone can believe anything they want.

The only people who contradict that are people who think you should believe what they do.

That is what I see anyway.

Well I do believe that there is truth, which you seem to be denying. I do think that some things are true whether someone believes them or not. But I also think that people are free to believe anything they want, regardless of its truth. But see, to me, the belief that everyone can believe whatever they want is contradicted when people tell me to believe that.

I just said you could believe anything you want, doesn't make it true.

Let me explain, I grew up around allot of different people and religions. To me, someone who believes in god should get the same respect as someone who believes that elephants are pink and can fly.

You cannot prove that there is no god, per say. But you also cannot prove that there are no pink flying elephants.

So I respect every belief to a degree just don't force others to look at it your way.

But you are right society tends not to be as forgiving as me.

See, people like you are the ones that earn my respect despite my disagreeing with them. You have your beliefs, but you don't have anything against people for believing differently. Far too many people insult and persecute others simply because of differing beliefs, which, as a Christian, I have experienced far too often and far too severely. It's nice to see someone who can have a discussion without throwing insults and stereotypes.

Thank you

If I had my way, gay people could get married and Christians could still believe they are sinners. XD

As long as gay people respect that Christians are different and Christians can continue not likening them as long as both sides kept that belief from manifesting as violence or bigotry.

Because we are all different. All just like that pink elephant guy, absolutely fucking crazy every last one of us.XD

Crazy? For sure: humanity is nuts.

Because humans are flawed tiny creatures who most likely have no idea about anything at all.

 

[MatumbeJack]

Only thing I feel like saying to be honest is "The Fall of Rome."

I'm tired of this, Rome didn't fall because of homosexuality. If anything Rome's fall actually had more to do with its adopting Christianity*. A pacifist religion is hardly the best choice for a militarist state... though today we seem to have worked through that by ignoring the pacifist part.

*According to The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon

Oh, you're tired of it? I'm sorry. I didn't realize. Did I credit it the entire Fall of Rome to gays? No. No, I did not. Besides, Christianity is hardly pacifist. Just because we focus on the whole Jesus part, doesn't mean there aren't chapters of war in our book.

Sum of its parts. Thats what lead to the downfall, being gay was one of them.

That was a pretty fantastic book.

Your implication that homosexuality influenced Rome's fall I interpreted to mean (along the lines of) 'general hedonism' and 'surrendering to excess.'

Now I'm not so sure... :/

But I will say that homosexual tendencies were present in Roman culture since its origins and founding, and that any assertions that Rome's collapse was due to homosexuality are ... Er. Wrong.

In addition, the New Testament espouses a good deal of pacifist doctrine and most contemporary incarnations of Christianity generally posit that 'love' has a fair bit to do with it.

 

[Ninja_X]

Only thing I feel like saying to be honest is "The Fall of Rome."

I'm tired of this, Rome didn't fall because of homosexuality. If anything Rome's fall actually had more to do with its adopting Christianity*. A pacifist religion is hardly the best choice for a militarist state... though today we seem to have worked through that by ignoring the pacifist part.

*According to The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon

Oh, you're tired of it? I'm sorry. I didn't realize. Did I credit it the entire Fall of Rome to gays? No. No, I did not. Besides, Christianity is hardly pacifist. Just because we focus on the whole Jesus part, doesn't mean there aren't chapters of war in our book.

Sum of its parts. Thats what lead to the downfall, being gay was one of them.

That was a pretty fantastic book.

You implication that homosexuality influenced Rome's fall I interpreted to mean (along the lines of) 'general hedonism' and 'surrendering to excess.'

Now I'm not so sure... :/

But I will say that homosexual tendencies were present in Roman culture since its origins and founding, and that any assertions that Rome's collapse was due to homosexuality are ... Er. Wrong.

In addition, the New Testament espouses a good deal of pacifist doctrine and most contemporary incarnations of Christianity generally posit that 'love' has a fair bit to do with it.

You know their name escapes me right now, but there was an army of homosexuals so powerful even Rome was afraid of them.

I'll go look that up.

 

[wordsmith]

Why is the church needed to validate a relationship? It has so little bearing on our lives in this age that you may as well get a guy serving at McDonalds to sign a napkin saying "you guys love each other, right"?

 

[The Noble Shade]

I believe that there should not be gay marriage. While I am one to say that it is not acceptable to sanction the law according to religion, I am also one to say that the integrity of things should be preserved. I have nothing against homosexuals, but marriage is a religious practice, and it should be between a man and a woman. If it were between a man and a man (or a woman and a woman) than it is not really marriage.
But homosexuals DO have a right to be together, and to raise families, and have all the rights and protections that a marriage brings, which is why I support civil union laws.

Allowing homosexuals equal opportunity in respect to marriage upsets its "integrity?"

Got my facts straight now: marriage is defined as a legal union between a man and a woman, so I guess the "civil union" thing is a little redundant. So I guess I support gay marriage AND civil unions, whichever is being debated in our legislature at the time. I'm guessing that the point of this issue for the law to decide if homosexuality is an acceptable lifestyle or not (something it should certainly NOT do).
Having spontaneously changed my mind on the issue, I think that this country needs to make up its mind on the issue. Why is it so hard for people to accept homosexuality as an acceptable alternative lifestyle.

 

[Finebrew]

Or how about this. Dont give any special benifits just for being married. Then two people will just be together because they want to be.

 

[Ninja_X]

Or how about this. Dont give any special benifits just for being married. Then two people will just be together because they want to be.

I kinda think all the red tape and legal stuff surrounding marriage is weird considering Its the union of two lovers.

 

[messy]

Well the argument against gay marriage is that that children need a masculine and feminine role model. However I have a lesbian aunt and she and her partner have adopted children and they seem to have some how designated one to take the stereotypical "male" role and one the female one. It's obvious not the same as if they way as if they were a heterosexual relationship but it seems to be working.

So I'm all for it and to quote Homer Simpson "If gay people want to be miserable like the rest of us why shouldn't they get married"

 

[MatumbeJack]

"You know their name escapes me right now, but there was an army of homosexuals so powerful even Rome was afraid of them."

That is metal as fuck.

 

[shadowstriker86]

I think it would cause a lot more problems than it would solve. Not that i'm against gay people being together, think of the legal crap, espicially with the way people are in the u.s., that would happen. 2 people living together, not even in a relationship or anything, would try to get marriage rights but would be denied then sue for discrimination, then a person could do the same with a computer, saying that its the persons life partner then on and on and on and on. But for the most part i really dont give a crap, and as Denis Leary said, "6 months after they start getting married, they'll be begging to get a divorce"

 

[Smudge91]

if two people love each other then why can't they marry void of the fact they are the same sex. If a gay couple decide to marry, its not going to cause hell to open up in fact it won't really do anything at all apart from people going "oh you're married".
The religious argument really doesn't stand up in my opinion as most of the religious texts were written a good ooo 1960 years ago give or take a day, so they're stance of gay rights is a bit out dated. Religion (especially chrisitanity and all of its brances) considered women to be evil yet they have equal rights now.
I like Britian we don't really mind, we have our civil partnerships and everyone is happy...well almost but i'll take the majority.

 

[The Maddest March Hare]

I think it's wrong that they even need to contemplate this. Of course it should be legal. Love is one thing that the law should have no control over.

 

[Ninja_X]

I think it's wrong that they even need to contemplate this. Of course it should be legal. Love is one thing that the law should have no control over.

Technically the law has very little control over marriage, I could go out and marry anyone I want at the right place.

 

[1souch]

Its should be legal.. it was made so over here (uk) a few years back (Civil partnership is the legal term) and guess what we havent sunken into the depths of hell. In fact my cousin is having a gay marrige in feb.... Bless her

 

[Semitendon]

I think that all current marriages should be reduced to civil unions. All the same tax benefits apply, then the church decides who get's married or not. I say this because marriage is largly a religious idea. As such, automatically throwing homosexuals into a religious idea is bound to stir up trouble since almost all religions have anti-homosexual doctrine somewhere in their belief system and texts.

I have one thing which I am confused about, How is someone "born" gay??

If memory serves there is no way this is at all possible. If you believe in evolution, then it is survival of the fittest. Any genetic gene inspiring homosexuality would be fazed out immediately, due to the fact that a creature which cannot reproduce is automatically resigned to extinction. And since evolution takes millions of years to accomplish, then it is logical to assume that there were cavemen and cavewomen with the gay gene. Since they relied mostly on instinct they would have followed on their sexual urges, and promptly caused their own extinction. Some would say " but Semi, we have proof that animals follow homosexual urges" I just don't see the connection there. My dog will hump anything, even a human leg, it's not so much a matter of reproduction as it is a matter of brain power. Humans can immediately identify another human they want to have sex with, animals seem to hump anything they can mount.

And if you go for the church view, God hasn't created any homosexuals.

Personally, I think homosexuality is a matter of environment rather than being "born that way" We know that certain people raised in a certain environment will be drawn to certain things. Often these people may not like what they are drawn to, and desire to change the patterns in their life, but it never seems to work. i.e. the woman continually attracted to abusive males. I think homosexuality is like that, not a conscious choice, and an all together natural urge feeling, but is not actually developed at birth.

 

[Thaius]

i think they should be allowed to "marry" because theres no reason not to, other than to appease the drooling, swastika-waving homophobes of today's society. say a man and a woman become romantically entangled, dont get married and the man dies in a tragic ski-lift accident; the woman may be left alone and in debt. Say they do get married; the woman may be able to financially support herself after. now change it into a gay relationship...see?

If youre against gay marriage because you think homosexual relationships are an affront to god, then you know where the door is. If you're against gay marriage because marriage "should be" assigned only to heterosexual relationships, then just call it something else! I agree that marriage should be consigned to religious circles but ONLY so that the religious types among us don't need to get their knickers in a twist. Southpark almost got there in their episode "Follow That Egg"; if they'd not have been aiming for laughs with the "butt-buddies" remark, then it's an alright idea. I think we can all agree (those of us that are left now that the festering boils of the human race, the *whatever*phobes, have now left through the door) that homo- and heterosexual relationships are equally as valid and loving. Gay relationships should be given a break. Shit, they deal with enough crap from the rest of the populus on a daily basis...

I think that this post is interesting in that it says to give gay relationships a break because they get a lot of crap, while simultaneously denying a break and giving crap to those who believe homosexuality is wrong (which, by the way, is not the same as hating or being afraid of homosexuals).

 

[Murlin]

Legal, just leave them be.