Poll: Skyrim: The Armour complaint.

[Nomanslander]

I don't care about the changes, Skyrim will be my first Elder Scrolls game.

hmmm don't whether to slap you, or welcome you.

Well you can slap me, I've played the other ES games and I didn't like them at all, Skyrim might be the one to change things.

Oh, and I also liked Fallout 3 more the it's predecessors.

/flame shield on

 

[WorldFree55]

Again, if you want to continue to just look at the removal of trivial features and go on a nerdrage about it when the game is 4+ months away from coming out AND continue to not look at the improvements being made for the itself, go ahead. The game is still going to be amazing of itself whether it is described as an RPG or not. It's still going to get 10 out of 10 reviews, GOTY awards, hell probably game of the decade awards later on, and so on, and wrongfully so. While a real small minority that is going to fully go away eventually (thank the maker) will go back into playing the same old systemed rpgs that have aged horribly nowadays.

I fixed it for you. Deus Ex: HR will deserve GOTY as RPGs go, and Skyrim will get it instead.

It's just too bad that bar has been set so low these days that sub-par is what passes for excellent now.

I'm so confused i didn't know you had a time machine? 0_0

No, but I have played the leak. And it's an excellent game that doesn't compromise it's RPG roots to appease the shooter crowd.

Not to burst your bubble but the game is classified as an Action RPG, with lots of shooting, something that you hate a lot apparently. I know this because well...let's just say you can pretty much do almost anything in Pax East . The game is more of the lines of an metal gear solid+Mass Effect 2. Which of course is not a bad thing at all, that's a great thing. But YOU, going all out with the true RPG mode on, Deus Ex Human Revolution is a god awful example of that.

Try again.

 

[Ruiner87]

Now you're really grasping at straws. I never said I hated action in my RPGs, even though you've been trying to put those words in my mouth from reply one.

Number of augments in the preview build of Deus Ex: HR to choose from? Twenty-one, each with two to five sub-sections for customization. Number of skills in Skyrim to specialize in? Eighteen.

So when a shooter-RPG is beating out a "true" RPG-RPG in available character customization? The devs have probably gone wrong somewhere.

Try again.

To be fair, we actually don't know the depth of Skyrim's character customization. Each skill, of course, has certain perks that the player can specialize in, and this number of perks could very well be large enough to promote a wealth of character customization options. Also, I'd hardly classify Syrim (or any of the Elder Scrolls games) as "true" RPG's. They're Action RPG's. They have a heavy focus on combat, hell, the part of the game that isn't focused on exploration is pretty much all combat.

 

[WorldFree55]

Again, if you want to continue to just look at the removal of trivial features and go on a nerdrage about it when the game is 4+ months away from coming out AND continue to not look at the improvements being made for the itself, go ahead. The game is still going to be amazing of itself whether it is described as an RPG or not. It's still going to get 10 out of 10 reviews, GOTY awards, hell probably game of the decade awards later on, and so on, and wrongfully so. While a real small minority that is going to fully go away eventually (thank the maker) will go back into playing the same old systemed rpgs that have aged horribly nowadays.

I fixed it for you. Deus Ex: HR will deserve GOTY as RPGs go, and Skyrim will get it instead.

It's just too bad that bar has been set so low these days that sub-par is what passes for excellent now.

I'm so confused i didn't know you had a time machine? 0_0

No, but I have played the leak. And it's an excellent game that doesn't compromise it's RPG roots to appease the shooter crowd.

Not to burst your bubble but the game is classified as an Action RPG, with lots of shooting, something that you hate a lot apparently. I know this because well...let's just say you can pretty much do almost anything in Pax East . The game is more of the lines of an metal gear solid+Mass Effect 2. Which of course is not a bad thing at all, that's a great thing. But YOU, going all out with the true RPG mode on, Deus Ex Human Revolution is a god awful example of that.

Try again.

Now you're really grasping at straws. I never said I hated action in my RPGs, even though you've been trying to put those words in my mouth from reply one..

*your reply to another another poster for liking fallout 3* "Sounds like RPG just isn't your genre. Not true RPGs, anyway. Probably gotta mix a lot of shooter in with it."

Pretty safe to assume what you think is a real rpg and whats not based off your responses, I haven't put any words in your mouth (or posts in this case lol), that was all you.

As for your builds, again, we don't have too much knowledge of Skyrim at the moment even the builds, don't start making baseless assumptions now.

 

[ChupathingyX]

Snip

Hey it's me again...oh joy, eh?

Anyway, personally when it comes to RPGs I don't mind a lot of action, however, it should never be the main focus of an RPG and there should always be an alternate way of dealing with issues.

Things like speech and sneak need to be just as powerful as weapons and being able to talk out of things or use some form of intimidation or any kind of persuasion should always be an option for dealing with issues.

Oblivion did not have this...at all. Speechcraft was about as useful as a one-legged man in a butt kicking contest.

In Oblivion you could never really use any kind of speech skill or even speech in general to define your character or avoid sticky situations.

If Skyrim ends up following the same path then there will be problems.

 

[Ruiner87]

Now you're really grasping at straws. I never said I hated action in my RPGs, even though you've been trying to put those words in my mouth from reply one..

*your reply to another another poster for liking fallout 3* "Sounds like RPG just isn't your genre. Not true RPGs, anyway. Probably gotta mix a lot of shooter in with it."

Pretty safe to assume what you think is a real rpg and whats not based off your responses, I haven't put any words in your mouth (or posts in this case lol), that was all you.

Looks to me like you're failing to make the distinction between action and shooting. Shooting= Action, Action=! Shooting. Nevermind the fact that the amount of action in question determines a game's status as an Action RPG, true RPG etc.

 

[WorldFree55]

Snip

Hey it's me again...oh joy, eh?

Anyway, personally when it comes to RPGs I don't mind a lot of action, however, it should never be the main focus of an RPG and there should always be an alternate way of dealing with issues.

Things like speech and sneak need to be just as powerful as weapons and being able to talk out of things or use some form of intimidation or any kind of persuasion should always be an option for dealing with issues.

Oblivion did not have this...at all. Speechcraft was about as useful as a one-legged man in a butt kicking contest.

In Oblivion you could never really use any kind of speech skill or even speech in general to define your character or avoid sticky situations.

If Skyrim ends up following the same path then there will be problems.

Of course it's a joy! How's it hanging?

Your half right. You can't have too much action into an rpg, otherwise...its just not quite an rpg. However, not enough of it and the game can get really boring for a lot of people.

I agree 100% and that perhaps could be the case with Skyrim. Hell it was a case for me with New Vegas most of the time. But eventually, you will have too fight since this game has dragons, and these type of dragons are not something you can just sneak by XD.

Not so much no. Oblivion lacked speech checks but I think they fixed that with Fallout 3's speech system and I think they will probably be doing something similar with that as well.

Again, as far as speech issues is concerned with the past games like F: NV and Fallout 3, they will probably do a much better job in implanting speech craft. But also realize at the same time that Elder Scrolls (well this one in particular) usually have certain predicaments that can only be solved in fighting because of not only the setting, but the people in the series as well.

 

[brumley53]

It's not hugely annoying, but I would definitely prefer more rather then less customization and considering the cuirass and greaves are the two biggest parts of the armor they have changed a fair amount in terms of player aesthetics.

 

[WorldFree55]

Now you're really grasping at straws. I never said I hated action in my RPGs, even though you've been trying to put those words in my mouth from reply one..

*your reply to another another poster for liking fallout 3* "Sounds like RPG just isn't your genre. Not true RPGs, anyway. Probably gotta mix a lot of shooter in with it."

Pretty safe to assume what you think is a real rpg and whats not based off your responses, I haven't put any words in your mouth (or posts in this case lol), that was all you.

Looks to me like you're failing to make the distinction between action and shooting. Shooting= Action, Action=! Shooting. Nevermind the fact that the amount of action in question determines a game's status as an Action RPG, true RPG etc.

I kind of make fun of the notion of a true RPG because there is really no such thing since RPG in video games can come in many different forms and formulas.but as far as a difference with Skyrim or Deux Ex? Skyrim=Open World RPG. Deux Ex=Action RPG. Nethier side is bad or the best or a "true RPG" if such a thing even exists. Unless of course you want to include tabletop games but I'm just excluded those for the sake of discussion and staying on the main topic.

 

[ChupathingyX]

Of course it's a joy! How's it hanging?

Your half right. You can't have too much action into an rpg, otherwise...its just not quite an rpg. However, not enough of it and the game can get really boring for a lot of people.

I agree 100% and that perhaps could be the case with Skyrim. Hell it was a case for me with New Vegas most of the time. But eventually, you will have too fight since this game has dragons, and these type of dragons are not something you can just sneak by XD.

Not so much no. Oblivion lacked speech checks but I think they fixed that with Fallout 3's speech system and I think they will probably be doing something similar with that as well.

Again, as far as speech issues is concerned with the past games like F: NV and Fallout 3, they will probably do a much better job in implanting speech craft. But also realize at the same time that Elder Scrolls (well this one in particular) usually have certain predicaments that can only be solved in fighting because of not only the setting, but the people in the series as well.

Well yeah I agree, you just have to find the right balance between fighting and talking.

Well this game has Dragon shouts right? Screaming is a form of talking...kinda. But yeah when it comes to animals and mythological creatures then obviously you can't talk your way out of that (unless they're intelligent) but when it comes to humans (or other mythological humanoids) you should be given much more speech options.

Yes Fallout 3 fixed that issue and New Vegas improved on it and hopefully Skyrim will feature a speech system more akin to F3/NV, however, it could end up more like Oblivion...hopefully not.

Yeah I guess that's true, people in medeval fantasy settings are usually much more thick-headed than more modern day people.

 

[kinapuffar]

It's a non issue, just QQing.
Any leg armour that isn't the same as the chest armour will ALWAYS look like shit, better to just weld the CORRECT pieces together and call it a day.

 

[WorldFree55]

Of course it's a joy! How's it hanging?

Your half right. You can't have too much action into an rpg, otherwise...its just not quite an rpg. However, not enough of it and the game can get really boring for a lot of people.

I agree 100% and that perhaps could be the case with Skyrim. Hell it was a case for me with New Vegas most of the time. But eventually, you will have too fight since this game has dragons, and these type of dragons are not something you can just sneak by XD.

Not so much no. Oblivion lacked speech checks but I think they fixed that with Fallout 3's speech system and I think they will probably be doing something similar with that as well.

Again, as far as speech issues is concerned with the past games like F: NV and Fallout 3, they will probably do a much better job in implanting speech craft. But also realize at the same time that Elder Scrolls (well this one in particular) usually have certain predicaments that can only be solved in fighting because of not only the setting, but the people in the series as well.

Well yeah I agree, you just have to find the right balance between fighting and talking.

Well this game has Dragon shouts right? Screaming is a form of talking...kinda. But yeah when it comes to animals and mythological creatures then obviously you can't talk your way out of that (unless they're intelligent) but when it comes to humans (or other mythological humanoids) you should be given much more speech options.

Yes Fallout 3 fixed that issue and New Vegas improved on it and hopefully Skyrim will feature a speech system more akin to F3/NV, however, it could end up more like Oblivion...hopefully not.

Yeah I guess that's true, people in medeval fantasy settings are usually much more thick-headed than more modern day people.

Of course screaming is a form of talking. At least now it is, XD. If you need to pass that large gate in order to get inside the castle, you can now just shout your way in haha. But yeah I think we will see more speech encounters then before.

Hopefully not indeed.

Seriously in any dragon age game, for almost no reason or complete lack of regard to their life, enemies would rather try to kill you no matter how much you would rather have peace and try to talk things out.

 

[Byere]

So... Instead of having body armour and leg armour, you have just a set of armour you can use and it equips everything to your character.

So... it's like the Dark Brotherhood Leather from Oblivion (which was a one-piece, albeit that the hood was removable iirc).

Meh, Doesn't bother me then. Saves space in your inventory and thus decreasing weight... thus you can carry more. Fine by me. *is a pack-rat*

 

[Double A]

I know all the arguments, and they all boil down to choice (or bitching about change). I think it's annoying to get rid of greaves, as Enchant will be limited to about 4-6 things. It limits some strategies greatly, and I'm not even talking about 100% chameleon.

 

[darkonnis]

the trouble i have when they start cutting down on bits of armour is that i have 1 suit i can use from start to finish. For me, i like my storyline, but i also like the shiny loot which is only attainable through some mad quest. Giving me a choice of (5 items was it someone said earlier?) with nothing else to aspire to kills it.
Its nice sitting working out if that +10 damage on X attack will out weigh +30hp on another piece of armour.
Also, i see what they're trying to do by making it so people dont have to start over and over to get a good character first time around, but surely thats a tutorial problem and not an itemisation problem.
Better explanation, same expansive options = better game.
Same explanation, less options = Poor half hashed job like DA2

We moved away from the baldurs gate dark alliance genre for a reason, as a one off yes brilliant, but dont commit an entire franchise to it.

 

[Ragsnstitches]

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Snippity snip

Should locked treasure chests be open to players who didn't invest in lockpicking or alteration? (But for what it's worth, I agree with you. It's more a "levitation is an example of a fun way to explore the world" thing than a "make stuff only accessible via levitation plz" thing.)

That's exactly what I'm getting at. It would be fun to have, but it wouldn't have anything specifically designed around it, which makes it a lower priority for the developers hence getting scrapped.

Bethesda promised (by Bethesda I mean Todd) that they would make DLC more substantial for Skyrim making them "closer to expansions" then their current trend of DLC. If Demand is high enough, they might add such abilities or gimmicks to a new location (designed around the ability) once people have heavily explored their current world. This is just wishful thinking though.

Also, Lockpicking was insanely easy in Oblivion, I could pick very hard locks with novice skill level as a Mage or Warrior with no stealth majors. But maybe that's just me, I played the game so much I just developed a knack for it.

the trouble i have when they start cutting down on bits of armour is that i have 1 suit i can use from start to finish. For me, i like my storyline, but i also like the shiny loot which is only attainable through some mad quest. Giving me a choice of (5 items was it someone said earlier?) with nothing else to aspire to kills it.
Its nice sitting working out if that +10 damage on X attack will out weigh +30hp on another piece of armour.
Also, i see what they're trying to do by making it so people dont have to start over and over to get a good character first time around, but surely thats a tutorial problem and not an itemisation problem.
Better explanation, same expansive options = better game.
Same explanation, less options = Poor half hashed job like DA2

We moved away from the baldurs gate dark alliance genre for a reason, as a one off yes brilliant, but dont commit an entire franchise to it.

In regards to your armour concern, Todd Howard did say there are substantially more armour types and variations within the game then in previous Titles.

Also the loot issues is an odd thing. Even though you will technically be getting a smaller haul, it was said that the items you'll get are far more valuable to the player (and equally so to traders). In Oblivion and Morrowind, the loot drops in dungeons were hit and miss. Your raid/quest might yield a few rare minerals worth shag all, or you might get a rare enchanted pair of pants worth a bundle. You might get a Silver Warhammer (okay value, very heavy), or you might get an Ebony dagger (worth a ton more and is very light). The new approach to loot is to make exploring pay off more often.

I'm not sure how they work it in Skyrim, but if they stay True to TES games of yesteryear you will be able to loot corpses on top of looting valuable chests. But they will always be minor compared to the Loot you expect in the deepest areas of a dungeon.

 

[Ronan117]

I'm a stickler for having matching armour in my TES games, so this doesn't really bother me. As long as we have plenty of different types of armour to choose from for each class ill be happy.