Poll: Unschooling: Parenting at it's worst

[Acalla]

When it comes to fun, I agree. But learning is different. If you don't learn, you become a burden to society. People like that should be put down.

False. By learning in excess you simply burden the child even more when it's obvious that by 5th grade the child has already decided what he or she wants to do in life giving their interest in a certain subject. For e.g. knowing biology won't help you become a lawyer.

3rd grade: I wanted to be a postman / police officer. I thought that I could deliver the mail and fight crime at the same time.

4th grade: I wanted to be a fire fighter.

5th grade: A doctor.

Junior High to High School: Electrical engineer, like my' pa.

2nd year of college, got into the meat and potatoes of EE and figure out I didn't like it at all. Remembered that programming class in HS that I took and how much I enjoyed it. Changed major to CS.

Still not convinced that 5th grade is the age to make life decisions. More focus on your given subject in HS would be helpful though. Maybe I would have figured out more about EE ahead of time. Not sure how you would implement this or pay for it.

Also not sure doing away with grades is the best thing to do. You get graded in life all the time at work. I see people now who cannot handle just doing their job. They want a gold star every time they do something they are SUPPOSE to do. Hey, I came to work on time all week, think the boss with notice. The boss shouldn't notice that you did your job correctly. Man, the boss is a jerk cause I let that presentation go out with a spelling error on it. Can you believe he got angry about that? YES. It's called proof reading.

Plus, just doing something you like, doesn't mean you are going to be good at it. It can help... but doing something you didn't think you would like, and then finding out you excel at it does, sometimes, make it a lot more fun.

 

[Acalla]

All "unschooling" is, when you get right down to it, is parents doing the job they are SUPPOSED to be doing anyway IN ADDITION to what the kid is supposed to get at school....

...Good luck holding their attention while you're called out for a parent conference with one of the community's rich people... because his kid got a C on that science test (because he was too busy being "center of attention" to actually PAY attention), and that's obviously YOUR fault.

Are you perhaps a teacher?

On behalf of my wife (HS English teacher), you tell it!

 

[Ham_authority95]

Of course it isn't 'parenting at its worse', nowhere close even, on a different map in fact. If that's what these people want to do, leave them to it. They're not hurting anyone, are they?

Yeah, education is important, but you shouldn't make a big deal out of the people who don't partake in it.

Unless they don't pay their taxes and public services, why waste your breath?

 

[SextusMaximus]

A flawed idea, with elements of lack of social situations, actual subjects and structured lessons. Saying "My child is learning by building lego" is just a clear form of laziness on the parents side.

 

[Pingieking]

It's good in concept, and may work well for some people. But in general, this is terrible. The idea behind it sounds very Utopian, and therefore it's very likely bad in practice.

The reason that there is a semi-standardized set of knowledge and skills that a person must have in order to graduate from high school is because those skills are necessary for a person to fully function in society. Unschooling opens up the possibility of having large sections of society being completely unfamiliar with concepts or skills that is fundamental to modern society. If we're in a dictatorship, then I've got no problem with that. However, something like this can cripple a democratic society. Also, I can't imagine something like this is good for a person's social skills. We've already got more than enough people who are socially inept/awkward, and this probably isn't helping.

EDIT: One more thing. These unschoolers are completely underrating or ignoring the effects of good teachers. Granted that good teachers are much rarer than we'd all like them to be, but taking even the opportunity of having a good teacher away is pretty terrible.

 

[Pingieking]

*snip*

Quoted. For. F*cking. Truth.
Not a professional teacher, but I have taught quite a bit in both classroom and tutoring situations (English, Chinese, high school math and physics). And you, good sir, can tell it like it is.

 

[Iron Mal]

The reason that there is a semi-standardized set of knowledge and skills that a person must have in order to graduate from high school is because those skills are necessary for a person to fully function in society. Unschooling opens up the possibility of having large sections of society being completely unfamiliar with concepts or skills that is fundamental to modern society.

This highlights another issue, if we allow kids to just study what they feel like studying then we will (more likely than not) end up with an entire generation of artists and footballers.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the arts (and sports have their place) but unless you force kids to do 'boring stuff' like science, maths and english then we would end up with few (or no) people in roles that are vital to society ("sorry, we don't have any doctors avalible, we don't get many people applying for it these days").

 

[Necromancer1991]

Look, the concept in my mind is sound, but the whole "No rules" stuff is just plain BS, rules are completely unavoidable unless you live under a rock in the middle of nowhere

 

[Lemon Of Life]

I think that the educational system could be improved, but this doesn't seem to be the way to go.

 

[kiwi_poo]

I think school is crap and I have hardly learned anything there. the main source of my wisdom is from my father, who actually went to see the world.
the school system is not working on my generation, so it must change.

Doesn't mean that you weren't taught anything, you say yourself that your father taught you, or whatever wisdon is here.

Back on track: For a parent not to attempt to give their children the skills they need to survive, is a damning failure on their part. Doesn't matter if you teach them yourself or are part of some sort of institution, you should make a concerted effort to make your child ready to be an adult.

he indirectly taught me those things, but i guess your probably right

 

[Dyp100]

I used to have a friend who was unschooled.

She was a religious nutjob and spent all her days just sitting around on the net.

She wasn't stupid or anything, but I can't befriend anyone who would impose laws upon people because of HER OWN personal belief.

 

[Strykz]

We live in a democracy, at least most of us here on these forums do. We get to vote on certain issues. Nothing terrifies me more than an ignorant population voting on issues they don't understand.

You honestly believe that people know what they're voting for in representation at the moment? lol.

 

[Hashime]

The reporter said "to opt out of bullying, competition..." This bugs me just as "unschooling" does. The world today is a competitive place, you cannot succeed without competing with someone else. Kids though it is not diserable must learn to deal with the bullies they will experience later in life. These kids are not going to be able to go to any post secondary institutions with their current education, and will be socially ostricised due to lack of exposure.

 

[TheSquirrelisKing]

snip

i understand your point of view like i hated doing textiles and art and i dont consider those to be useful to where i was taking my career which is hopefully a solicitor as i will be taking law for university but its the skills and general knowledge that other subjects can offer you change the way you look at things.

for example taking history could give you a much better outlook on issues since you will look to pick out details from within a report and form your own opinion rather then take the reporters point at face value and use that as your opinion and this could lead some very gullible people doing and saying some very stupid things that could ultimately endanger other people. however thats a worst case scenario.

there are other subjects which i think people could benefit if we paid more attention and focus on them like religious education and i mean not just learning about christianity but about all major world religions so we dont form our opinion about people around a few reports that are ultimately gonna be about terrorism or something to that degree. like if i didnt know any better from reports i have heard i could think that all catholic priests are pedophiles and all muslims are terrorists however i know better then that because of my rounded education giving me a much better idea abou the world.

so in other words although learning about a subject could although prove annoying and pointless in reality it could help you indirectly by giving cetain skills like being able to analyse arguments and pick out flaws and then form your own opinion about things around them

I'm not saying that these subjects are not interesting or important or useful, I'm just saying why does everyone think that the only way to get this information is in a school?

 

[hawkeye52]

if you look at all the subjects we are forced to do for example maths english science being the three cores that most english schools tell you that have to do you can break it down into three areas of thinking and being good at that given subject tells your future college or university how good you are at it.

english for example examines how well you can think critically about things and then apply it to written or spoken word. so if you are good at english then this could mean that they would be good in fields such as journalism where the main skill needed in journalism is to be able to think critically about events and transcribe you thoughts acurately onto paper so you can communicate accross what is happening effectively.

maths focuses on how well you can think logically and reason out things that may seem complex at first but when broken down seem fairly simple. really you cant go any further with this because logic is logic plain and simple and maths is a way to demonstrate how good you're logic is.

science like maths is mainly logic since all science is maths because biology comes down to chemistry in the end and chemistry comes down physics and all physics is maths. however science does also show how you can look at something and understand what happens and why in depth and be able to apply that knowledge to everything in the world.

so its understandable why you were forced to do these subjects all through your school life any additional subjects like history you should only be made to do until your final few years (14-16 years in the english system) where you get a choice of what subjects you want to do. for example i was of course made to do english, science, maths and ICT for reasons shown above and i shouldnt have to explain the importance of ICT in the modern world. i however CHOSE to do extended religious studies, history, geography and music out of the wide array of subjects that was available and now in college im doing law, computer science, modern history and psychology in one of the best colleges public 6th form colleges in england and will most likely go to a good university because of that.

and anyway since you are paying taxes to the government who ultimately decides where the money goes for example into education why the hell not take advantage of that offer and get profesionaly trained teachers to look after your childrens education then the parents who them themselves could be poorly educated and pass on horrific values to their children.

 

[Thaius]

If everyone was "unschooled" we'd lose any form of advanced science that involved anything more than a linear function.

My goodness I went to the website

But, what about math?

It's easy to see how children can learn many things without using traditional, formal methods of teaching, but many people see math as a huge stumbling block, mainly, because most of us have learned to hate math because of the way it was taught in school. There are a great many ways to encounter math in the real world. Geometry can be found in quilt making, algebra in painting a room. Shifting perspectives, from textbooks to the real world is sometimes difficult, but math that is actually used is math truly learned.

Where will the calculus come from! Nooo!

Nowhere, because calculus is useless in everyday life, and thus should not be required learning in the first place.

OT: Interesting idea. I support homeschooling fully, but this is... well it's not a bad idea, really, I just don't trust parents to do it right.

 

[Flames66]

No OP, you're not being narrow-minded.
Isn't their a law against not sending your child to school?

No there is not (at least not in the UK). The law states that children have to be educated. It is up to the parents how. I was taught at home by my Mum until year 9 after my primary school didn't pick up on my learning difficulties and I spent entire PE lessons trying to finish the writing from the lesson before. I am much better able to deal with my difficulties and be part of society entirely because I was taught at home.

School is not compulsory nor is it always the best option. It is just one of many ways to be educated.

 

[wolf thing]

lerning is only one part of school it is also a socail plase. it teaches kid to get along, meet freinds and teach them how to act with others. letting them leve school could socaily cripple them

 

[xxnightlawxx]

Uhm, interesting topic but there would have to some sort of limit to what you were "unschooled" with and what topics you studied and I have an option that is similar to this in my area its called a trade school or a Tech Center where you still take academics but study a trade at the same time and focus mainly on that trade while also learning all the useless shit.