Space Marines: They're becoming wimpier with each generation (Now with added ORK!)

[Alex_P]

They drop down from orbit in power armor. I'd call that "space marines". And, yes, I know they're referred to as infantry.

As I suspected, you're talking about the movie, which came quite a while after the book (which has little to do with shooting bugs en masse), and long after warhammer 40k.

Wha?

In Heinlein's Starship Troopers, IIRC, the "Mobile Infantry" wear "powered armor" and air-drop from space in individual capsules.

My recollection of Verhoeven's movie is that they actually just deployed from a transport or something. And they definitely didn't wear full-on power armor.

I'm confused by what you're talking about.

-- Alex

 

[preachersaul]

40K has a lot more badass things. Carnifexes...

What's a Carnifex? I'm thinking shitty deathcore band.[/quote]

http://tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:3Zr5XWls7hKiuM:http://oz.games-workshop.com/games/40k/tyranids/painting/carnifex_conversions/images/carnifex.jpg

This is a carnifex. About 15 feet of bio-engineered living tank.

 

[Normeo]

Yeah, killing Marines with las weapons is sweet but I know one thing that is better.
Conscript Platoon in CC with a Space Wolf Terminator Lord with lightning claws and only 1 wound left (Lord charged and ripped the platoon apart leaving a single conscript alive). The single WS2, S3 conscipt stabs the Wolf Lord in the fucking face and kills him.

You got to love the Guard...Apart from the one million models to buy and paint. Also a bit like the mobile infantry of the starship trooper films.

I counter your argument with this. Lone scout sergeant. Power sword. 2 squads and a command unit. yes my one sergeant took out an entire platoon of guard.

Nice. How about junior oficer (with bolter), 2 guards (one with flamer) take out 4 nobs and a war boss. Lucky or what.

 

[Specter_]

Space marines existed before Warhammer you know.... They came up with all this stuff about insanely awesome space marines, the originals from Starship troopers were pretty bad ass though. Warhammer wasn't the original so don't compare shit to it.

Actually, WH40k has been out since 1983, Starship Troopers came out in 1997... *ahem*

Guess again jackass, the book, which contains the original space marines which are far superior to those in the film, came out in 1967 I believe.

Please, describe the original 1967 Starship Troopers Space Marines then.

Please, go to a library, get the book and read it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSzEEs69MpE&feature=related

As in this? I... doubt it.

This. With the dreadnought jumping around, shooting tactical nukes at primary targets, lobbing grenades left and right every time they touch ground and being too fast to be hit.

Mobile Infantery =/= Dreadnoughts

?dit:

Just talked to a friend of mine who has a) played W40k and b) knows Starship Troopers and in his opinion one well-trained Mobile Infantryman can take out a Scout Titan.

 

[SquirrelPants]

The 40K Space Marine game is shaping up to suck, continuity-wise.
The gun doesn't shoot full-blown rockets, it shoots bullets, and it's supposed to focus on close combat, which space marines simply aren't built for.
But yes, 40K Space marines can be considered the epitome of manliness.(Assuming 'epitome' means what I think it does.)

What do you mean space marines aren't equipped for close quarters!? They are space marines! They have frickin priests with CHAINSAWS!

Not so much saying they aren't, it's just more seems like they should be shooting and trying not to die; my Necrons have fallen many a time to Space Marines in close quarters.

 

[Sir Ollie]

Black Templars FTW!

[http://s314.photobucket.com/albums/ll414/curlytightlips/?action=view&current=The_Black_Templar_by_kingmong.jpg]

 

[Kiutu]

It is really to emphesize your character being the above avergage guy who becomes the hero. "While others died, he lived on to save teh world" and such. Not that I dont appreciate competant allies. In such games (like the first Halo) we enjoy seeing them living, unless we are goofing off and sticking em with grenades.

 

[McClaud]

Genetically inbred soldiers, even from the start.

As we all know from Genetics, that the more inbred and more times you create a copy of the original Space Marine Progenitor, the weaker the Chapter gets.

So far, since nearly every bad-ass Space Marine from the fiction and the game gets killed before his genes are sampled, the Space Marine Chapters were bound to start getting weaker and weaker, losing their original abilities. Or at least that's how Games Workshop has described the changes in Space Marines over editions.

Or, as someone else already put it, the Space Marines didn't get wimpier - the Universe just kept getting more and more bad-ass in response until it out bad-assed the Space Marines. Even with their acid-spitting abilities, they aren't a match for a well-planned, overwhelming invasion of Tyranids or Eldar.

 

[noogai18]

The issue isn't with the Space Marines getting wimpier, it's all balance.

It wouldn't be much fun if 100-odd marines, a handful of tanks and a couple dreadnoughts could beat the snot out of 20000+ points of another army, would it?

If you want powerful marines, read the fluff. Still some powerful soldiers there.

No no no, not within the universe itself. I mean across multiple genres, I can understand balance, but not turning the word Space Marine into Guy Wearing Suit of Armor Who Has Apparently Come From Space And Has Regenerating Health

Well it all sort of makes sense if you think about it too much. So let's break the phrase down

Space- Well, duh. If they're going to be "Space Marines" they need to be in space or at least travel primarily in space, which most do.

Marine- Originally, marines were soldiers who fought onboard sailing ships and were there to board enemy ships and repel enemy boarders. Nowadays it just seems to mean "powerful military force with more guys than another elite forces", not necessarily ship borne infantry. They don't have any powered armor then or now, so they didn't/don't wear any. In the future, I guess that it's assumed that exoskeletal suits are the norm for combat troops, so they all have it. And they semi-nod to the origins of "marine" by making the armor very practical for boarding ships.

So that's what a "Space marine" is defined as. Sorry for boring anyone, but it needed to be clarified, I think.

 

[edinflames]

Ws-Bs-S-T-W-I-A-Ld-Sv
4--4--4-4-1-4-1-8--3+ = wuss

A guardsman has to face down the worst horrors in the universe with nothing but a flashlight, string vest and a butter knife.

Ws-Bs-S-T-W-I-A-Ld-Sv
3--3--3-3-1-3-1-7--5+ = man

Spot on. The guy in the 12ft mecha suit is not more 'manly' than the guy who fights naked.

 

[Eipok Kruden]

I don't know about you, but I think that the MJOLNIR Exoskeleton looks nicer than

I mean sure, the DoW Space Marine looks more badass, but it isn't exactly practical. The MJOLNIR Mark VI Exoskeleton, on the other hand, is much sleeker, more agile, and more efficient. So as far as practicality goes, I'll pick the MJOLNIR, but for looks alone, I'll pick:

 

[Kadamon]

I don't know about you, but I think that the MJOLNIR Exoskeleton looks nicer than

I mean sure, the DoW Space Marine looks more badass, but it isn't exactly practical. The MJOLNIR Mark VI Exoskeleton, on the other hand, is much sleeker, more agile, and more efficient. So as far as practicality goes, I'll pick the MJOLNIR, but for looks alone, I'll pick:

Dude, they wear big armor because they ARE big, about 12 feet tall and need a lot of armor to cover themselves. If you want sleek, stay AWAY from Space Marines, because staying alive is better than looking SEXY to the opposite RACE

http://mind-games.com/temp40/w4k.jpg

Does a shoulder plate really need to be THAT sophisticated?

 

[Kadamon]

Argh, another reply just got quote-killed

Need help in the coding...

 

[Eipok Kruden]

Dude, they wear big armor because they ARE big, about 12 feet tall and need a lot of armor to cover themselves. If you want sleek, stay AWAY from Space Marines, because staying alive is better than looking SEXY to the opposite RACE

http://mind-games.com/temp40/w4k.jpg

Does a shoulder plate really need to be THAT sophisticated?

Why are they 12 feet tall in the first place? How is that practical?

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Better meat shields, stronger bodies, more epicness.

 

[Datalord]

Maybe now we can drive space marines extinct and replace them with something more creative, like mechanized cooking untensils teaming up together to turn satan into the perfect steak

 

[implodingMan]

When I think of space marines I will think of the Colonial Marines from Aliens. Always have, always will.

And honestly the marines from Warhammer just look silly.

 

[Sewblon]

We should have abandoned space marines once someone made a game about a theoretical physicist killing aliens.