Student Suspended for wearing a dress.

[infohippie]

Of course, I'm outraged on his behalf, just like most people here, but I particularly liked this:

""I was pretty," said Saurs."

That's just adorable.

 

[Saelune]

To conform is to make the same. Sexism then is an enemy of conformity, thus the school is against conforming.

I don't disagree with many of your other posts, but this is grade A rhetoric tripe. Going with your logic conformists would want everyone to devolve into the stage before the big bang, clearly conformists want you to conform to previous, somewhat anachronistic societal standards, and therefore enforced gender roles.

Hey, if Conservatives can do this, why cant I? (Weird math that is, such as gay marriage = people will want to marry dogs, plants next)
I wont say it was my best argument, but that guy is clearly biased in ignorance based on his other posts, so why bother with just legit logic?

 

[funguy2121]

To conform is to make the same. Sexism then is an enemy of conformity, thus the school is against conforming.

Gender roles =/= sexism. Blokes shouldn't wear dresses.

Actually gender roles are the highest form of sexism.

Misogyny? Come on. I personally don't have any misgivings with gender roles at all, until they become compulsory. Unfortunately, that's very very often. Kill your own damned spiders!

Not mysogyny. I find nowadays gender roles hurt men more than women. Its weirder for men to wear skirts than women to wear pants, which 50 or so years ago would be crossdressing.

They don't really help any. Damned shame most of us are scared shitless of feminists.

 

[Pimppeter2]

He only wore the pants to be a troll.

If he was actually gender-queer or a cross dresser, I think it would have been different

I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores.

Wait what? It was a bet his mother made to make him see how difficult heels are to wear. There was no initial moral crusading.

That's what I'm saying.

I don't like the way they're turning it into one now.

Why? The school is wrong, and should be called out on it. Why force some future crossdressing student to deal with it later when these people can deal with it now and make it easier for any future students who it applies to.

But they didn't

You can't assume it would be the same situation. You can't say the school wouldn't have reacted differently. This was just a kid dicking around in a dress to get attention. He wasn't actually genderqueer, or anything.

You can't blame someone for an injustice they haven't committed before they actually do it. Its not right. The school solved the issue with the kid, they lowered his suspension. Both mom and kid agreed that they're fine with it now, just disappointed.

Now they're just dragging it into the media to be more like the attention whores they are. They're not moral crusaders, and should stop acting like they're standing up for people who are actually facing gender issues.

So what if it was for attention? If he wore a piece of male clothing for attention (that was not vular or something) would he have been suspended? The school was sexist. What about all the women wearing dresses for attention? Im sure there are plenty. Are they being treated equal to him?

Your not getting the fucking point

"I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores."

Honestly, fucking read what you quote. Its ridiculous.

I didn't say he did anything wrong, or that the school did right in punishing him. I said I just wish he didn't play the role of moral crusader. Its fucking petty.

Now, read before you respond. For fucksake.

Might want to watch the swearing. I am not arguing if they are or are not being attention whores. Im arguing that its fine if it means stopping something bad.

Its okay, we're not in a goddamn daycare. I can use big boy words. I'm not swearing at you.

That's fine and all. But I am not arguing that. And you quoted me. I don't disagree with you. I just said I don't like their attitude.

 

[GamerPhate]

Ah, the US. Land of the free indeed. This is fucking disgraceful that people still exclude other people simply for doing something different. And just to put this on a flat line for the school, you think that it being a dare from someone else it would have been all fine, considering he wasn't doing it to simply wear feminine clothing.

Ugh, I hate this world at the moment.

Edit: And just because of the nine years of being on the net, I finally got first post!

Well.. he KIND of was.. he wore makeup and a hat, even though hats are against EVERY schools dress code I have ever seen. The makeup is a bit of a grey area, but I recall during Halloween, me and a co-drum line member decided to use that spray can stuff that makes your hair colored. I cant remember if i picked red or green, but we each picked one of those colors, and in all my classes I got smirks by the teachers, but only in band class did the teacher literally throw us out of class for the hour. It was TEMPORARY hair spray that was colored, and yet somehow we were kicked out of class for the day, even on Halloween. We weren't wearing anything else "offensive" that day. Although, the same instructor had kicked a guy out of band entirely for shaving HALF his head. It was like the right side of his head had hair, and the left side was just totally shaved. And this was back in the 90's before "emo-esque" hair was "in style". Realy quick, this is just an opinion, but OMG, emo hair looks like it NEEDS to be cut, but they intentionally make it grow that way! And I had long hair back then, so that is saying something, but this was the "alternative" days when looking like a stoner was cool. Back then it would have been considered "gothic" maybe? But he was a good wind player, so it was a bit of a loss for the band in our up comming competitions. However, you know how it goes, people judge people by their appearance instead of their personailty, and therefore it was considered an "okay" move by the school.

 

[Saelune]

To conform is to make the same. Sexism then is an enemy of conformity, thus the school is against conforming.

Gender roles =/= sexism. Blokes shouldn't wear dresses.

Actually gender roles are the highest form of sexism.

Misogyny? Come on. I personally don't have any misgivings with gender roles at all, until they become compulsory. Unfortunately, that's very very often. Kill your own damned spiders!

Not mysogyny. I find nowadays gender roles hurt men more than women. Its weirder for men to wear skirts than women to wear pants, which 50 or so years ago would be crossdressing.

They don't really help any. Damned shame most of us are scared shitless of feminists.

Im not quite sure exactly your view on this. Im getting mixed messeges.

 

[Saelune]

He only wore the pants to be a troll.

If he was actually gender-queer or a cross dresser, I think it would have been different

I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores.

Wait what? It was a bet his mother made to make him see how difficult heels are to wear. There was no initial moral crusading.

That's what I'm saying.

I don't like the way they're turning it into one now.

Why? The school is wrong, and should be called out on it. Why force some future crossdressing student to deal with it later when these people can deal with it now and make it easier for any future students who it applies to.

But they didn't

You can't assume it would be the same situation. You can't say the school wouldn't have reacted differently. This was just a kid dicking around in a dress to get attention. He wasn't actually genderqueer, or anything.

You can't blame someone for an injustice they haven't committed before they actually do it. Its not right. The school solved the issue with the kid, they lowered his suspension. Both mom and kid agreed that they're fine with it now, just disappointed.

Now they're just dragging it into the media to be more like the attention whores they are. They're not moral crusaders, and should stop acting like they're standing up for people who are actually facing gender issues.

So what if it was for attention? If he wore a piece of male clothing for attention (that was not vular or something) would he have been suspended? The school was sexist. What about all the women wearing dresses for attention? Im sure there are plenty. Are they being treated equal to him?

Your not getting the fucking point

"I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores."

Honestly, fucking read what you quote. Its ridiculous.

I didn't say he did anything wrong, or that the school did right in punishing him. I said I just wish he didn't play the role of moral crusader. Its fucking petty.

Now, read before you respond. For fucksake.

Might want to watch the swearing. I am not arguing if they are or are not being attention whores. Im arguing that its fine if it means stopping something bad.

Its okay, we're not in a goddamn daycare. I can use big boy words. I'm not swearing at you.

That's fine and all. But I am not arguing that. And you quoted me. I don't disagree with you. I just said I don't like their attitude.

Its not that you sweared, but how, or rather, how much. Kinda gives off super raving mad. (To be fair though, sometimes I just want to curse out people here...)

 

[funguy2121]

OP, it's MSN, so it should be taken with a grain of salt without a second source. It sounds like the kid's been pushing boundaries at the school for a while; he was tempting them to do this. It doesn't make it any more right for them to do so, but I fail to see how dressing in drag to come to school is really so important. Perhaps that's myopic of me, but I doubt you'd see Eddie Izard in stilettos and blush waiting in line at the bank.

http://www.seattlepi.com/local/article/Boy-wears-dress-to-school-gets-suspended-1429489.php

So that's now four sources. These shouldn't be boundaries in the first place, except I guess the hat thing.

"If anything, it makes me want to be more out there and more spontaneous and crazy," Saurs told KING 5.

The kid was looking for attention, and he got it. He was looking to stir up trouble. I could care less if I see a guy walking down the street in a dress and I don't care if they allow it at school, but he's gotten into trouble for violating the dress code, he appeared in drag and was punished (it was reduced to 3 days' suspension) and then said that this makes him want to be more subversive. I'm guessing even if Moms hadn't complained about her feet hurting he still would have worn the dress to school.

 

[Charli]

Pft getting mad at a dress. Silly schools.

Next time go in naked, really screw with em.

 

[Titan Buttons]

Unless there is a school uniform in place a student has a right to wear what ever they want, as long as it's not offencive to anyone. Which a dress can't be since girls wear them all the time

 

[Saelune]

The biggest difference between men and women are the genitals. Now. What about a penis makes wrapping a cloth garment around them wrong due to lack of a bottom piece?

"The biggest difference", well that's meaningless, because yes, it is physically, and we both know that that's the most important thing when we're discussion behaviour and society right? I mean, it's not like men and women behave differently, right?

Right?

And social rules. Gender rooooles. This isn't an ethics discussion, there's not some universal right and wrong or a factsheet to look up. But I have a question for you.

In Australian Aboriginal and Pacific Islander culture, you know who normally administers the discipline (and it's some pretty harsh discipline, let me tell you)? The older females. Interesting, but true. So would you really go up to them and tell them how sexist and disgusting their culture was because there's a gender role in it?

It would be sexist if males are barred from it, yes. Its not wrong for a person to fall into their gender roles. But neither is it wrong for a person to fall into the other gender's gender roles. A man can be big, small, tough, weak, sensitive, rude, clean, dirty, e.t.c.
So can women.

 

[Pimppeter2]

He only wore the pants to be a troll.

If he was actually gender-queer or a cross dresser, I think it would have been different

I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores.

Wait what? It was a bet his mother made to make him see how difficult heels are to wear. There was no initial moral crusading.

That's what I'm saying.

I don't like the way they're turning it into one now.

Why? The school is wrong, and should be called out on it. Why force some future crossdressing student to deal with it later when these people can deal with it now and make it easier for any future students who it applies to.

But they didn't

You can't assume it would be the same situation. You can't say the school wouldn't have reacted differently. This was just a kid dicking around in a dress to get attention. He wasn't actually genderqueer, or anything.

You can't blame someone for an injustice they haven't committed before they actually do it. Its not right. The school solved the issue with the kid, they lowered his suspension. Both mom and kid agreed that they're fine with it now, just disappointed.

Now they're just dragging it into the media to be more like the attention whores they are. They're not moral crusaders, and should stop acting like they're standing up for people who are actually facing gender issues.

So what if it was for attention? If he wore a piece of male clothing for attention (that was not vular or something) would he have been suspended? The school was sexist. What about all the women wearing dresses for attention? Im sure there are plenty. Are they being treated equal to him?

Your not getting the fucking point

"I'm not agreeing with the school, but I'm not buying his and his mom's bullshit about it being a moral crusade. Fucking attention whores."

Honestly, fucking read what you quote. Its ridiculous.

I didn't say he did anything wrong, or that the school did right in punishing him. I said I just wish he didn't play the role of moral crusader. Its fucking petty.

Now, read before you respond. For fucksake.

Might want to watch the swearing. I am not arguing if they are or are not being attention whores. Im arguing that its fine if it means stopping something bad.

Its okay, we're not in a goddamn daycare. I can use big boy words. I'm not swearing at you.

That's fine and all. But I am not arguing that. And you quoted me. I don't disagree with you. I just said I don't like their attitude.

Its not that you sweared, but how, or rather, how much. Kinda gives off super raving mad. (To be fair though, sometimes I just want to curse out people here...)

Its okay, we're all over 12 here. I'm sure we can handle a little swearing without giggling or running to tell mom what new words we learned on the internet.

Hell, half of the site probably also has a porn tab open simultaneously. I'm sure they'll be fine.

 

[Saelune]

Hey, if Conservatives can do this, why cant I? (Weird math that is, such as gay marriage = people will want to marry dogs, plants next)
I wont say it was my best argument, but that guy is clearly biased in ignorance based on his other posts, so why bother with just legit logic?

Hahaha aww, how cute, insulting me to other people, and admitting no "legit" logic to your arguments, well done.

Also if you're wondering? Normally if an opponant in a discussion uses ridiculous fallacies, you continue using good arguments instead of stooping down to thier level. But hey, you'll learn one day, right?

This is just to tell you Im done with you as I can no longer look past your obvious trolling.

 

[Dags90]

The kid was looking for attention, and he got it. He was looking to stir up trouble. I could care less if I see a guy walking down the street in a dress and I don't care if they allow it at school, but he's gotten into trouble for violating the dress code, he appeared in drag and was punished (it was reduced to 3 days' suspension) and then said that this makes him want to be more subversive. I'm guessing even if Moms hadn't complained about her feet hurting he still would have worn the dress to school.

As it says in the original article, there's nothing in the student handbook about dresses not being in the dress code for boys. That's one of the worst parts about this story. The message the school is effectively sending to the students is "written rules don't matter because we can arbitrarily make new ones mid-game".

They're being that kid on the playground.

 

[Saelune]

Hell, half of the site probably also has a porn tab open simultaneously. I'm sure they'll be fine.

GET OUT OF MY COMPUTER

It would be sexist if males are barred from it, yes. Its not wrong for a person to fall into their gender roles. But neither is it wrong for a person to fall into the other gender's gender roles. A man can be big, small, tough, weak, sensitive, rude, clean, dirty, e.t.c.
So can women.

Pretty sure you said 10 minutes ago that gender roles were the most sexist thing ever. Care to clarify your view?

Despite my last post....I will, just for this.
The problem with gender roles is that the world enforces them and makes them strict cages. Its one thing if most men like sports and being tough. Its another if society says all men have to like sports and have to be tough.