Sympathy for the Devil

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imperialreign

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Have you ever had a game antagonist that you ended up feeling sympathetic towards? Maybe for some reason you could relate to the antagonist's history, or you could understand their point of view? If so, who was it and why? Did it affect your enjoyment of the game in any way?

For me, this popped up after replaying the FEAR series, and spending a little more time to grasp the background - instead of just breezing through it like I did years ago. Learning the background of the series, I ended up feeling sympathetic towards Alma . . . that's simply an effed up history no matter how you look at it; to not have a childhood, be treated like a lab rat, placed into a medical coma at the age of 8, artificially inseminated to gestate "super commanders" twice before the age of 16, then being killed off . . . yeah, I can see where there'd be some animosity and resentment going on . . . that sympathy kinda screwed with my approach to the rest of the game's story - I couldn't help but think that other main characters that were killed off were simply getting what they deserved.
 

imperialreign

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Pararaptor said:
I never had Alma down as an antagonist. That was much more Fettel to me.
Alma at the end was no different to a rabid dog.
That dog is still a good dog.

I get this alllllll the time in films, too. Most notably, Patrick Bateman.
IDK - I took it as the character who literally kicked everything off, the one who insitgated Fettel's actions . .. but at the same time I can see how it could go both ways.
 

Veldel

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The Boss, Big Boss, Liquid They all where tragic and I honestly felt sad when it forced you to end The Boss's life she was a great char
 

Rhaff

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Lucien from Fable 2, i mean he was just doing it to get his family back, can't really blame him for his motives, however his means were kinda dickish.
 

Jambolaty

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Please allow me to introduce myself, I'm a man of wealth and taste....

Any ways on topic, Logan from fable 3, I thought he was doing the right thing all along, even if it was a bit silly not to tell everyone they're going to be killed by a giant Muk if they don't raise enough money.
 

vxicepickxv

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Not as much in games, but there are a couple of movies where the antagonist might not actually be in the wrong.

In the Wizard of Oz, think about the wicked witch of the west. What did she really want? All she wanted was her sister's shoes. Shoes that were by the right of any civilized nation hers, upon the death of her sister.

How about in Ferris Bueller's day off? The Dean of Students wanted to prove that one of his students was a truant, and skipping, instead of being sick. He was doing his job that the taxpayers were paying him to do? Why is he the bad guy?
 

Rhaff

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vxicepickxv said:
Not as much in games, but there are a couple of movies where the antagonist might not actually be in the wrong.

In the Wizard of Oz, think about the wicked witch of the west. What did she really want? All she wanted was her sister's shoes. Shoes that were by the right of any civilized nation hers, upon the death of her sister.

How about in Ferris Bueller's day off? The Dean of Students wanted to prove that one of his students was a truant, and skipping, instead of being sick. He was doing his job that the taxpayers were paying him to do? Why is he the bad guy?
Ah a fellow cracked reader i see.
 
Apr 28, 2008
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Teyrn Loghain from Dragon Age Origins.

Long have I hated that asshole. Then while on the internet someone blew my mind about his character and I now see him as one of the greatest hero's ever. Yes, hero. More of a hero then you were.

Bioware makes teh good gaemz. It's hard to dispute that. And in 2009, they released one of their finest games ever: Dragon Age: Origins.

A throwback to old school RPG's, Dragon Age: Origins was a massive treat to a large part of the role-play gamer demographic. Yet even though people praised it, they all failed to notice something through their first playthrough of the game. Something that some people are still oblivious to.

BIOWARE MADE YOU LOOK LIKE A FOOL!

They turned you into a narrow-minded goodie two-shoes that, in reality, would have spelled out the doom of the world. But Bioware were cruel and let you live oblivious to the fact that you were a dumbass that can't save a country for shit.

How did they do this, you ask? It's simple!

Meet the true hero of Ferelden:



Here is the man that liberated Ferelden from an oppressing nation that had occupied the country for 100 years. Here is the man that saved his homeland from a monarch that cared more about glory then what is best for everyone. Here is the man that had a purpose behind everything that he did, a man that only cared for the safety of his kinsmen.

And you totally killed him.

Don't deny it. You did. You killed him so Alistair wouldn't leave your team. You killed him because he was, from your naive and unfocused perspective, a meanie head.

But he never was.

You hate him because he killed your noble family? Sacrifices for the greater good. They, like you, would be too narrow-minded to see the bigger picture and would oppose him. Having Howe murder the shit out of them would get rid of opposition and strengthen the support from one of your allies.

You hate him because he enslaved elves? That's true, it's a dickish thing to do. He should have ignored them and let them live in poverty and subject them to prejudice. Why give them the chance to at least live someplace decent when he could just have them live in the incredibly shitty place they're currently residing in? It's not like they are regularly harassed by rapist nobl-Oh wait. So yeah, you saved them so they can continue living in poverty and saved them just in time so they could be murdered relentlessly by the Darkspawn. Way to go, hero.

You hate him because he killed Duncan? Let me ask you something. How well do you know Duncan? Did you, at any point, find that he has a personality? Did you ever stop to consider that he is incredibly bland and boring, and that he only cares about ending the blight and doesn't let anything else enter his mind? Ever realized that he's narrow-minded? Or that he looks kinda Hindu?

You hate him because he abandoned the army at Ostagar and made you look like a villain? Here's a little information: Even if Loghain would have stayed and helped, there was a very, very big chance that they would still lose. More people would've died, and it would be impossible to stop the Darkspawn from destroying Ferelden.

And as for you Wardens, what the crap was he supposed to do? He needed someone to put the blame on, and you were only two people. TWO PEOPLE. That's a pretty measly sacrifice for the safety of the nation.

You hate him because he nearly doomed the country by trying to kill the Grey Wardens, who are the only people physically able to kill the Archdemon? You know who you should hate for that? THE ENTIRE FUCKING GREY WARDEN ORGANIZATION! They were the ones who kept this entire ordeal secret, even for the fucking King. Loghain didn't know that a Grey Warden was needed to kill an Archdemon, because he was never told how it worked. He was told that they were needed to kill it for some vague, unspecific reason, but would you seriously, unconditionally believe that? I know I wouldn't, cause it would be fucking stupid.

And so to anyone who killed Loghain thinking he deserved it: YOU ARE WRONG! He is, in fact, much more of a hero than you. He didn't have no fucking Deus Ex Machina treaties that you had. He had to build an army from scratch. He couldn't save the country without making sacrifice, like you somehow were able to do thanks to the power of love. All this time Loghain has been the real hero, while the main character has been living a cliche lie. A lie that makes Dragon Age even more fucking brilliant than it already is, because several times over that lie makes you do decisions that bites you in the ass.

(Though it's a shame that Bioware are often too retarded to think more than 5 minutes ahead of the story, otherwise you wouldn't be able to simply reload a slightly older save to fix something you eventually found out to be a bad choice. LEARN FROM THE WITCHER, BIOWARE!)

So yeah. Thats why I feel sorry for Loghain.

Also Saren. He was just trying to do what he thought was best, which was "save some people rather then having everyone everywhere die", then had his views warped by Sovereign, eventually becoming indoctrinated without realizing it. Eventually he kills himself because he knows what he has become, and that he can never go back.
 

King Crab

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I feel sympathy sometimes, not nessecarily for the big bad, but for the faceless minions, the working grunts and armies of nothings that I eviserate on the end of a sword or gun or some such. sometimes when playing Rome TW and fighting against rebels or some hastily thrown together army of peasants and light infantry my heart goes out to them. I can't help but feel that they were drawn into this conflict against their will, that they've left they're families and lives behind only to die in a distant field so I can expand my empire by one town.

I sort of feel the same in Monster Hunter, Not when killing big bosses, or even the velociprey, but when I kill the creatures whose first and only response is to leg it. I mean, sometimes it is the only way to get some red meat, but it still feels too much like an abattior, just wacking them on the head with a big hammer then carving them up.

the first time I really remember feeling like this was when I used the tactic of raiding parties to disrupt the farms and gathering in AoE2. having fully trained knights run down peasants then escape before retrebution could be metted out was a good tactic but left me feeling kinda like . . . did they deserve it? I mean, they just happened to be a different colour. What else could I have done? I mean, I could have sent a priest, I could have converted them, but killing was simpler, more efficient.

oh, and btw - sympathy for the devil is an awesome song.
 

CheesusCrust

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Sep 24, 2009
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Coming to mind recently: Stross from Dead Space 2.
He wasn't completely an antagonist but his actions do become that of one when he loses it to his dementia. He thought that if he stabbed Ellie and Issac in the eye they would be able to see his hallucinations and he could convice himself he wasn't crazy.
So just a poor guy who lost it to dementia, doesn't sincerely want to hurt anybody; however
Issac wrestles a screwdriver from him, leaving him unarmed and not a great threat. Issac's next move is to stick the damn thing through the side of his head.
I thought this was a little extreme and felt sympathy for the guy.
 

MrAkuma201

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Virgil DMC3 All he wanted was power whats so bad about that?

I want more power in life don't you?
 

Ralen-Sharr

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Morrowind.... Dagoth Ur.
He was trying to crush those that betrayed himself and your own previous incarnation.
He had gone mad over time, but he had the right idea. After he died, I finished what he started and killed the traitorous bastards.
 

Denizen

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Jan 29, 2010
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This thread needs more Sympathy for the Devil...
OT:
If you follow the hidden logic in half-life in-depth, you realize that Nihilanth (the giant psychic fetus at the end of part 1) was actually protecting Xen from the incoming combine. Of course this didn't become apparent until part 2 where you realize that you killed the leader of inter-dimensional refugees who just happened to think Earth was a fall-back point when your team made a portal....
It is hard to feel sorry for a giant psychic fetus but that realization makes you think twice about that epic boss at the end.

 

John the Gamer

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I feel a bit of sympathy for the "real" devil. God makes you do everything he says and then locks you in his castle for all of eternity to make you do all the chores for him and his son (he's evil because he can). The devil gets stuck with you if you don't do what god says, and is forced to punish you for it (by god). He just acts evil because he has too. That's just me talking anyways. But then again, the whole religion was invented by medieval folks who couldn't tell a cloud from heaven. (religion= mortal fear countered by fancy stories to make people feel at ease)
 

Pandaman1911

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I've never felt sympathy for the antagonist, really, simply because many, if not all games, portray them as being evil simply for evil's sake, with not a shred of decency or relatablity in them. They're not doing it for a reason, they're just being evil because they can, and it's weak, and I dislike it.