To all the Europeans and Aussie's on this forum...

[ChromeAlchemist]

The difference between what I have and what you have is that what you have is generally legalised, and does nothing other than kill people.

Mine however, is not sharp, I never said it was. If I stab with it I am sure I could do some amount of damage, but I would have to put some effort in to kill, and if I wanted to kill I would go for a kitchen knife, which most certainly could kill.

BIN THAT KNIFE!
Turn in your knife before some one turns it on you!
You think a sword does more than just kill people? What do you think swords were made for? KILLING PEOPLE! Same thing, different implementation.
Didnt they illegalize weeaboo swords there?

My sword is practically ornamental, Like a gun that is decomissioned. Again you made some kind of assumption without asking any information. What swords were made for were to kill people, but my sword was made to look pretty on a stand somewhere.

There was some talk of it being banned, but as far as I know 'weeaboo' swords are legal in the UK provided they are blunt and kept in ones house.

And what the hell are you talking about at the start of your post?

Also a question I ask is what stops you from buying a high powered BB gun that can immobilise a human being, rather than kill them?

 

[mosinmatt]

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_vic-crime-total-victims Total Crime. Look whos at the top
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_percap-crime-rapes-per-capita rape. Look which countries are higher
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burglaries-per-capita break ins. Look who is at the top again!
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rob_percap-crime-robberies-per-capita robberies. Look at all those above the US. OH! including the UK!

Yeah I can do that too, watch.

Murders per Capita: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita] #24 United States, #43 Australia, #46 United Kingdom.

Assaults per Capita: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_ass_percap-crime-assaults-per-capita] #6 United States, #8 United Kingdom, #10 Australia.

Murders with a firearm: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-crime-murders-firearms-per-capita] #8 United States, #27 Australia, #32 United Kingdom.

And the big one:

Total Crimes: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri-crime-total-crimes]

#1 United States: 11,877,218
#2 United Kingdom: 6,523,706
Australia: Not even on the list.

There are MANY MANY MANY more people in the United States than in the UK. We may have more crime in numbers. But the Brits and Aussies have a higher overall crime RATE.
Yes America has higher murder, but all the other stats are LOWER.
I explain the reasoning for the higher murder rate earlier, with the prevalent gangster culture.

Also a question I ask is what stops you from buying a high powered BB gun that can immobilise a human being, rather than kill them?

A BB gun wont immobilise a human being. Do you know nothing of ballistics or the human body?
BIN THAT KNIFE! OBEY! SAFE UNDER THE WATCHFUL EYES

 

[ChromeAlchemist]

You see people? I told you the Gametrailers and /b/ crowd would bleed into here sometime, and now they have!

 

[JWAN]

nope. I hate the use of guns.

What if a criminal steals one and a cop needs to shoot him? I mean, you can ban guns but your never going to get RID of guns.

For the record, I collect antique guns, I hunt and I believe in self preservation (self protection) and I like studying history and its difficult to do that if you cant get up close and study historical pieces.

Also, I don't believe in registering your guns because 2 countries have already done that

1. Nazi Germany (made the takeover a lot easier and hence the extermination of millions of innocents) after registration they took them all and melted them down for military munitions.

2. Canada, they also included odd rules like you can only own 1-2 rifles and you have to keep your lock on and your safety on till RIGHT before you shoot, meaning you cant hunt because you end up fumbling with the lock's. This means that animal populations get out of control, diseases spread faster and if your family has had a history of hunting (like mine, over 150 years) you cant continue the tradition. (they ended up taking away the firearms after they were registered)

I also do repairs on M1 Garrands so veterans affairs groups can do military funerals. I have a couple 12 gauge shotguns that used to be apart of Wells Fargo wagon trains for protection (100% Oak stocks and pump, and the other one has Hickory parts, REALLY cool looking parts of history) I have an old muzzle loader that has a stock made out of an extinct tree, one of the only pieces of its kind and it was handed down from generation to generation.

Firearms have been in my family for literally hundreds of years, Im never going to give up that part of my history.

 

[Goatlemon]

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_vic-crime-total-victims Total Crime. Look whos at the top
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_percap-crime-rapes-per-capita rape. Look which countries are higher
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burglaries-per-capita break ins. Look who is at the top again!
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rob_percap-crime-robberies-per-capita robberies. Look at all those above the US. OH! including the UK!

Yeah I can do that too, watch.

Murders per Capita: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murders-per-capita] #24 United States, #43 Australia, #46 United Kingdom.

Assaults per Capita: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_ass_percap-crime-assaults-per-capita] #6 United States, #8 United Kingdom, #10 Australia.

Murders with a firearm: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-crime-murders-firearms-per-capita] #8 United States, #27 Australia, #32 United Kingdom.

And the big one:

Total Crimes: [http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri-crime-total-crimes]

#1 United States: 11,877,218
#2 United Kingdom: 6,523,706
Australia: Not even on the list.

There are MANY MANY MANY more people in the United States than in the UK. We may have more crime in numbers. But the Brits and Aussies have a higher overall crime RATE.
Yes America has higher murder, but all the other stats are LOWER.
I explain the reasoning for the higher murder rate earlier, with the prevalent gangster culture.

Also a question I ask is what stops you from buying a high powered BB gun that can immobilise a human being, rather than kill them?

A BB gun wont immobilise a human being. Do you know nothing of ballistics or the human body?
BIN THAT KNIFE! OBEY! SAFE UNDER THE WATCHFUL EYES

All except the total crimes are per one thousand people, so your "we have more people" defence is moot. Dare I say; void?

And you're still yet to show me any recent crimes in Australia or Europe that match the level of violence and horror as the numerous school shootings, mass murders and the sniper incident you've had in the United States.

And stop with the obey thing; you're not helping your cause by acting like a tool.

 

[mosinmatt]

Also a question I ask is what stops you from buying a high powered BB gun that can immobilise a human being, rather than kill them?

A BB gun wont immobilise a human being. Do you know nothing of ballistics or the human body?
BIN THAT KNIFE! OBEY! SAFE UNDER THE WATCHFUL EYES

All except the total crimes are per one thousand people, so population doesn't come into it as much as you think.

And you're still yet to show me any recent crimes in Australia or Europe that match the level of violence and horror as the numerous school shootings, mass murders and the sniper incident you've had in the United States.

And stop with the obey thing; you're not helping your cause by acting like a tool.[/quote]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woo_Bum-Kon NUMBER ONE!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erfurt_massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/02/international/americas/02mexico.html?_r=1&fta=y&oref=slogin

You also never mention that all the school shooters and major incidents were dont with Illegally obtained weapons. Criminals dont follow the law, so why make the laws?
BIN THAT KNIFE

 

[slackboy72]

As an Australian I can say that guns just aren't in our culture. That's why we all rushed and handed in our guns in 1997. It was free money for old guns that we'd inherited from an uncle or father who'd been a farmer or hunter or brought it home from national service, etc. We just didn't want or need them.

And I am thankful for that.

I live in a society where I don't have to think about my personal safety at night, at home or in a 'bad' part of town. I can only be thankful that we don't have idiots (like some of the gun-loving yahoos posting here) living in Australia. That is why our society is safe. Not because of our gun laws (which are still quite lax by international standards).

 

[mosinmatt]

As an Australian I can say that guns just aren't in our culture. That's why we all rushed and handed in our guns in 1997. It was free money for old guns that we'd inherited from an uncle or father who'd been a farmer or hunter or brought it home from national service, etc. We just didn't want or need them.

And I am thankful for that.

I live in a society where I don't have to think about my personal safety at night, at home or in a 'bad' part of town. I can only be thankful that we don't have idiots (like some of the gun-loving yahoos posting here) living in Australia. That is why our society is safe. Not because of our gun laws (which are still quite lax by international standards).

LoL
Please look at the crime stats. You are NUMBER ONE for break ins. "safe" my @$$. Skippy, get off your high horse

 

[JWAN]

the other thing you have to take into account is that the US became a country because of our personal firearms and weapons. Its ingrained in our country

 

[mosinmatt]

Education is the best prevention! We cant ban everything that looks scary.

This is probably the only thing I have seen you say so far strikes a valid point, people do need to be educated on the subject the problem is though no one will listen and as it has been pointed out earlier if it were implemented it would turn out like Sex Ed classes, families of people opposed to it would just have them taken out of the class, much like in Sex Ed classes, both classes need to have it so you can't be taken out of them. These are both important topics that shouldn't be skipped, both would affect your life. The opposition would say that its just trying to turn children into little Rambos and the supporters would just get belligerent, much like whats been going on here.

Just to let you know your attacks are what makes people not want to listen to your point of view, and the same goes everyone arguing against guns, telling people that they are wrong about it and leaving it at that or throwing bias facts in there face won't help either.

Yes, I do believe in the right to own and carry guns if you have the license required to carry a handgun. Yes I own a gun, the one I own is primarily for collecting though I do shoot it at times. I have had an accident with a gun, even with instruction accidents won't disappear, they will just be less frequent and less severe.

There will always be accidents with guns. They are a machine. We should ban laundry presses, and other heavy machinery using liberal logic.
One of the problems is that the parents dont teach their kid about their guns. It is the mystery object in the drawer.
I grew up, i had a bedroom in the basement, and outside my door was the gun cabinet. I have not had one accidental discharge in all my life.

 

[slackboy72]

And not even on the list for total crimes. With 1/15th of the population of the USA you'd think we could manage up at least 800,000. Poor going Australia.

 

[mosinmatt]

And not even on the list for total crimes. With 1/15th of the population of the USA you'd think we could manage up at least 800,000. Poor going Australia.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_percap-crime-total-crimes-per-capita
doesnt change the fact that the UK and other Euro nations far out rank the US.

 

[Goatlemon]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)

The Port Arthur massacre not only happened before guns were banned in Australia, it was the incident that caused guns to be banned. Fail.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woo_Bum-Kon NUMBER ONE!

South Korea is not in Australia or Europe. South Korea did not come into your assertion that Europe and Australia has more violent crime.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erfurt_massacre

Notice the part that says he had a licence for both guns that he used which is one of the reasons I support gun control; even people licensed to own them can use them for mass murder.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre

Like the Port Arthur Massacre this led to tighter restrictions on gun laws, specifically the Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988. So again this is before modern gun control laws in the United Kingdom.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/02/international/americas/02mexico.html?_r=1&fta=y&oref=slogin

Like South Korea, Mexico is not in Europe and it is not Australia, therefore it has nothing to do with your claims that Australia and Europe has worse crime than the USA, especially after gun control.

You also never mention that all the school shooters and major incidents were dont with Illegally obtained weapons. Criminals dont follow the law, so why make the laws?

Do you think the victims and the families of the victims care? Besides, the point about there being more of a chance for illegal weapons being obtained by criminals if there are more weapons in general has already been covered, and I'm not going over it again just for you.

Well, of all those I'll give you the Erfurt massacre, since Germany apparently has tight gun laws, although the fact it was done with legal weapons should give you something to think about.

The others all either didn't happen in Europe or Australia or they were before the sort of gun control we have today.

 

[JWAN]

I mean Australia was founded by a bunch of criminals exiled from GB, they never had to found thier country through a shooting war (they used firearms to stave off the Japanese, and they did a GREAT job at it, I am speaking with the highest since of respect, we made a damn good team with the Aussies)

Europe has always leaned away from firearms, but I gotta say its kinda spooky with the connections between registering your firearms, then the government coming around and taking them without your permission.

That's how the Nazis did it
that's how the Canadians did it (only without the nasty side effects)

I really don't trust that

 

[mosinmatt]

Do you think the victims and the families of the victims care? Besides, the point about there being more of a chance for illegal weapons being obtained by criminals if there are more weapons in general has already been covered, and I'm not going over it again just for you.

Well, of all those I'll give you the Erfurt massacre, since Germany apparently has tight gun laws, although the fact it was done with legal weapons should give you something to think about.

The others all either didn't happen in Europe or Australia or they were before the sort of gun control we have today.

You can't be living in paranoia. They have nearly all been done with illegal firearms. Even with stricter control, it still would of happened.
Face it. There are crazy people out there. Why should we restrict normal people for what crazy people do?
Stopping illegal guns will be nearly impossible in America. Liberals refuse to secure the border, so illegal weapons keep coming in.
It keeps coming back to ILLEGAL firearms.
Look at Chicago, All firearms are BANNED there. Yet they have the highest murder rate in the country! But that cant be....firearms are banned there. It should be the safest!

 

[aussiesniper]

Also a question I ask is what stops you from buying a high powered BB gun that can immobilise a human being, rather than kill them?

A BB gun wont immobilise a human being. Do you know nothing of ballistics or the human body?
BIN THAT KNIFE! OBEY! SAFE UNDER THE WATCHFUL EYES

All except the total crimes are per one thousand people, so population doesn't come into it as much as you think.

And you're still yet to show me any recent crimes in Australia or Europe that match the level of violence and horror as the numerous school shootings, mass murders and the sniper incident you've had in the United States.

And stop with the obey thing; you're not helping your cause by acting like a tool.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woo_Bum-Kon NUMBER ONE!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erfurt_massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/02/international/americas/02mexico.html?_r=1&fta=y&oref=slogin

You also never mention that all the school shooters and major incidents were dont with Illegally obtained weapons. Criminals dont follow the law, so why make the laws?
BIN THAT KNIFE

Woo Bum-kon shooting was korean, why are you brining that up in an argument about Australia and Europe?

The hungerford massacre is the reson that gun control was tightened in Britain!. The Port Arthur massacre is the reason why guns are controlled in Australia! Both of these events preceded gun-conrol laws and are the reasons why the laws were made in the first place.

The last link you gave linked to an article about Mexico. Why the hell are you talking about mexico? they have little gun control and massive criminal activity.

The school shootings of America are largely done with legally obtained weapons that the shooter has brought to school from home. I have never heard of schoolyard weapons smuggling, so would you kindly show me how a child gets an illegally obtained weapon?

EDIT: Ninja'd repeatedly.

 

[tthor]

Not really. Guns hold very little attraction here apart from as tools for those who need them, like farmers.

We find your obsession with them a little creepy, actually.

is this really how other countries view the USA? as "gun obsessed 'yanks'"?

 

[mosinmatt]

The school shootings of America are largely done with legally obtained weapons that the shooter has brought to school from home. I have never heard of schoolyard weapons smuggling, so would you kindly show me how a child gets an illegally obtained weapon?

EDIT: Ninja'd repeatedly.

no...just no. They are illegally obtained. Colubine, Vtech, etc etc. All done with ILLEGALLY OBTAINED firearms.
They were also in GUN FREE ZONES. But guess what? criminals dont follow the law, Skippy.
By Liberal logic, making it illegal to have a gun in a place automatically makes it safe from crazy people.