Vegetarianism

[Rolling Thunder]

You eat fish. Ergo, you are not a vegeterian. Quad Error Demonstrandum.

You just don't eat other types of meat. Eating fish precludes vegeterianism.

Isn't it "Quod Erat Demonstrandum"?

Damn you sir. Now I have to look through every last one of Oscar Wilde's works until I find this quote.

It's a Latin phrase meaning 'the things which was to be demonstrated being proven' roughly--Wilde may have been punning on it by changing 'quod' to 'quad'.

I'd disagree with it anyway, because hypocrisy only says bad things about you - not the argument. For fans of Latin, Ad Hominem Tu Quoque.

Hypocrisy is the foundation of all successful civilisations, and is an essential element for a society to function in a correct manner. Much like discrimination and bloodshed, if used in excess, it becomes unpalateable, but without society would become unworkable anarchy.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

In the words of other people I hate, "A life is a life."

But it's really besides the point isn't it? Just because other bad things happen, it doesn't make it any less wrong.

I just said I didn't agree with it. I just said I'm not going to stop eating meat because of it. Or.. you know, do anything about it as a matter of fact. Maybe the chickens could start a union.

Chickens don't have political power or deep pockets like the farming industry. Or, you know, the ability to speak.

I don't really get why you're trying to justify your inaction to me. I don't want to push you to do anything, but I'll respond readily to any arguments you make that I disagree with. Respectfully, of course.

 

[Cuniculus]

Make people aware that, like the article said: "Eating is both a political and an economic act, and the filmmakers are making a strong moral argument: What we choose to eat has vast, global impact, from the state of our health to the way that undocumented workers are exploited."

If you're okay with the impact, then you're okay with the impact--that's an issue of morality. If you choose to fight for workers' rights rather than eat less beef or corn or whatever, that's an issue of politics. However, to deny the impact is to deny the facts of reality: if an argument is based off of assumptions about food productions that are not true, well, then whatever your personal opinions, it's not a good argument.

Now we're getting into exploitation of workers? Sheesh. I'm terrible for eating meat.

Or just another member of society apparently.

Obviously personal opinions about food preparation are really not the actual point here now? Even if I did have personal opinions, as you and Mr. Ego have informed me, THIS is how things actually are. So if I'm not assuming, I just don't care, what does that mean?

 

[Cuniculus]

In the words of other people I hate, "A life is a life."

But it's really besides the point isn't it? Just because other bad things happen, it doesn't make it any less wrong.

I just said I didn't agree with it. I just said I'm not going to stop eating meat because of it. Or.. you know, do anything about it as a matter of fact. Maybe the chickens could start a union.

Chickens don't have political power or deep pockets like the farming industry. Or, you know, the ability to speak.

I don't really get why you're trying to justify your inaction to me. I don't want to push you to do anything, but I'll respond readily to any arguments you make that I disagree with. Respectfully, of course.

Of course.

In all reality, I've been told these things and more over and over again by my vegetarian girlfriend. Might be why I'm a bit argumentative. You're right though, you're mainly presenting facts, I'm mainly being a dick. Sorry.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

Hypocrisy is the foundation of all successful civilisations, and is an essential element for a society to function in a correct manner. Much like discrimination and bloodshed, if used in excess, it becomes unpalateable, but without society would become unworkable anarchy.

Uh, okay?

I was more referring to the fact that if someone acts in contrary to what they're proposing, that hypocrisy doesn't neccesarially make their claim invalid.

This fallacy is committed when it is concluded that a person's claim is false because 1) it is inconsistent with something else a person has said or 2) what a person says is inconsistent with her actions. This type of "argument" has the following form:

Person A makes claim X.
Person B asserts that A's actions or past claims are inconsistent with the truth of claim X.
Therefore X is false

http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ad-hominem-tu-quoque.html

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

Of course.

In all reality, I've been told these things and more over and over again by my vegetarian girlfriend. Might be why I'm a bit argumentative. You're right though, you're mainly presenting facts, I'm mainly being a dick. Sorry.

Don't sweat it man. I'm an avid reader of Maddox myself. I used to be much more of a dick to my vegetarian friends. My vegetarian friends who had deep seated issues about eating animals.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

*Snip*

I took "demonstrate by doing" to mean demonstrate an ideal, not a claim made about yourself. I get what you're saying. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

 

[Cuniculus]

Of course.

In all reality, I've been told these things and more over and over again by my vegetarian girlfriend. Might be why I'm a bit argumentative. You're right though, you're mainly presenting facts, I'm mainly being a dick. Sorry.

Don't sweat it man. I'm an avid reader of Maddox myself. I used to be much more of a dick to my vegetarian friends. My vegetarian friends who had deep seated issues about eating animals.

I won't say all, but most of them have a high and mighty attitude, which just pisses me off. "Look at me! I'm so much better than you because I defy nature!"

Whatever, I'm done now. Nice talking to you.

 

[Quantana]

you know i understand my sister is a vegetarian, i cant do it. i like meat to much. but keep it going its a good thing your doing.

 

[Abedeus]

If humans were to eat only vegetables, I think our ancestors would just stay in one place and grow crops instead of moving around and hunting for animals. I mean, an animal might attack, hurt you! Most of the plants people grow for harvest can't hurt you, unless you shove them up your nose.

Humans are omnivores! You can't make a lion eat only grass and vegetables or turn a cow into a blood-thirsty monster. Just like animals' bodies need what they need, we need both vegetables and meat.

Also, last time I've checked - fish meat is still meat. Just because you say you are a grass-eater, doesn't make you one.

 

[Chartic]

Wow I go away for like a couple of hours to get a new phone and suddenly this shoots to 4 pages. There are some good responses and thanks for some of the advice guys.

 

[Dr.Sean]

Vegetarianism is a cancer unto the world as demonstrated by Onision. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zvoe_uqRJo&feature=channel_page] He fucking compares meat-eating to the holocaust and slavery. He fucking compares eating chickens and cows to eating our cats and dogs. We all want him in a sanitarium.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

If humans were to eat only vegetables, I think our ancestors would just stay in one place and grow crops instead of moving around and hunting for animals. I mean, an animal might attack, hurt you! Most of the plants people grow for harvest can't hurt you, unless you shove them up your nose.

Humans are omnivores! You can't make a lion eat only grass and vegetables or turn a cow into a blood-thirsty monster. Just like animals' bodies need what they need, we need both vegetables and meat.

Yeah, but we don't need to eat meat. We can get along just fine with vegetables and beans. Indian food is mostly vegetarian, it's primarily the West that's bought into the heavy meat meals. The problems come in when people assume they can just live off of salad. Lettuce doesn't have much in the way of protean, or anything besides water, but broccoli and beans do.

We're not lions - we can live without eating meat. Making appeals to our ancestors is pointless, because they did all kinds of crap that we wouldn't tolerate in our society. We can make choices. We have options. We can think for ourselves.

It doesn't matter, for the sake of our morality, what our ancestors did. We're here now. We're not going to go backwards if we eat plants instead of meat. That's ridiculous.

 

[Evertw]

Seriously, the excuses i have heard from my vegetarian relatives when it comes to eating fish and the excuse is:they don't have legs so their not animals.

It's all on the cuteness scale: Pig=don't eat.
Scaly thing=eat.

 

[Abedeus]

If humans were to eat only vegetables, I think our ancestors would just stay in one place and grow crops instead of moving around and hunting for animals. I mean, an animal might attack, hurt you! Most of the plants people grow for harvest can't hurt you, unless you shove them up your nose.

Humans are omnivores! You can't make a lion eat only grass and vegetables or turn a cow into a blood-thirsty monster. Just like animals' bodies need what they need, we need both vegetables and meat.

Yeah, but we don't need to eat meat. We can get along just fine with vegetables and beans. Indian food is mostly vegetarian, it's primarily the West that's bought into the heavy meat meals. The problems come in when people assume they can just live off of salad. Lettuce doesn't have much in the way of protean, or anything besides water, but broccoli and beans do.

We're not lions - we can live without eating meat. Making appeals to our ancestors is pointless, because they did all kinds of crap that we wouldn't tolerate in our society. We can make choices. We have options. We can think for ourselves.

It doesn't matter, for the sake of our morality, what our ancestors did. We're here now. We're not going to go backwards if we eat plants instead of meat.

Uhm. Yeah, we do need to eat meat.

And you get proteins from... which vegetable? Broccoli and beans? Hope you don't fart a lot. Hmm, might explain why they are so smug...

I didn't talk about our ancestors' moral values, because their date was about knocking the female out and doing her, few times in a row. I'm talking about our bodies. If they didn't NEED animals to live, they wouldn't have to eat them. You can't tell me our DNA changed enough in few hundreds of years to suddenly be independant from meat at all?

You kinda missed the point... big time. Re-read my post, will ya?

 

[Numbert]

I've been a vegetarian (even fish) for almost two years now, and I haven't really had any problems. As long as your not vegan their is minimal risk of dietary problems. Just be sure to drink milk and eat plenty of nuts to balance your lack of protein from flesh. If you want their are protein bars and protein supplement pills if you find yourself having less energy throughout the day. Honestly I don't miss flesh at all. Even that fake soy meat stuff makes me gag now, so really after only a few weeks it won't even feel like your giving anything up. Good luck.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

If humans were to eat only vegetables, I think our ancestors would just stay in one place and grow crops instead of moving around and hunting for animals. I mean, an animal might attack, hurt you! Most of the plants people grow for harvest can't hurt you, unless you shove them up your nose.

Humans are omnivores! You can't make a lion eat only grass and vegetables or turn a cow into a blood-thirsty monster. Just like animals' bodies need what they need, we need both vegetables and meat.

Yeah, but we don't need to eat meat. We can get along just fine with vegetables and beans. Indian food is mostly vegetarian, it's primarily the West that's bought into the heavy meat meals. The problems come in when people assume they can just live off of salad. Lettuce doesn't have much in the way of protean, or anything besides water, but broccoli and beans do.

We're not lions - we can live without eating meat. Making appeals to our ancestors is pointless, because they did all kinds of crap that we wouldn't tolerate in our society. We can make choices. We have options. We can think for ourselves.

It doesn't matter, for the sake of our morality, what our ancestors did. We're here now. We're not going to go backwards if we eat plants instead of meat.

Uhm. Yeah, we do need to eat meat.

And you get proteins from... which vegetable? Broccoli and beans? Hope you don't fart a lot. Hmm, might explain why they are so smug...

1) That was uncalled for. Why the personal attacks?
2) We don't need to eat meat. Vegetarians who eat properly are actually healthier because they don't eat red meat.
3) It depends how you prepare the beans.

 

[Donbett1974]

Tofu aka soy turns out to changes males hormones. Take Asain males they look more feminine than any other males in the world mainly because of their high soy intake.
As for if we're meant to eat meat well we got Binocularity vision and K9s which are only found in preditors.