Of course video games are murder simulators! The violent ones anyway. Games like CoD, GTA, Far Cry 2, Half-Life, Halo, Fallout, Dawn of War all simulate [http://www.thefreedictionary.com/simulate] murder [http://www.thefreedictionary.com/murder] and you would have to have never played them to not know that. The only way that you could argue they aren't murder simulators is because the killings are often lawful (in military games anyway) and usually in self defense more than anything, meaning that technically they're closer to self defense simulators, but only if you want to be pedantic.
Games can simulate other things as well. Afrika [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrika_(video_game)] is an African/safari simulator while Guitar Hero is a guitar (and later Drums and Vocal) simulator.
That doesn't necessarily mean that games cause people to be murderers and Jack Thompson is probably insane but are we honestly going to ignore the definitions of two words and the nature of many games just because we don't like him?
Wow, I didn't think people here would miss the fact that video games are simulators...
You have a mission in a war game where you need to snipe a person from so many yards away. In the game you do have to accomidate for timing, bullet lag, gravity, wind. You need to think like a sniper. With enough practice on the real thing do you think you can take that 'training' and apply it to the real thing? killing in a war and killing in a neighborhood is still killing.
When you play Forza or Gran Tourismo you learn about things like drafting, how to take the inner lane, when to accelerate, how to turn. If you were seated in a car with the engine on, and with enough practice could you apply it to the real thing?
We have war simulators, driving simulators, daily life simulators, being a badass simulators, cooking simulators, owning a pet simulator, Rock Band simulator (might as well have been called Rock band Simulator). there are video game simulators for just about everything (imagine series).
People are raised partially based on their environment. Are you all saying that Video Games, perhaps one of the most important things to a growing child, does not influence how they think in any way?
My brother is an Army Sharpshooter, and he has been asked many time, "How many Headshots have you gotten?" "How many kills do you have?" by little kids. It is amusing, but quite disturbing. When I was there age, the only armed forces I was concerned with were the Power Rangers.
I'm not saying that video games are the only factor in a growing child, but it is one of the many factors.
I've learned more about guns from Tom Clancy books. But having Hunt for Red October on a killer's bookshelf hasn't led to people clamouring for Clancy books to be banned.
My friend took it another step further, he's made (or making) a map of our school for Counter-Strike.
I shall relish the day when I can blow up the school computer library whilst being in it and not get hurt at all!
/evil laughter
But anyway, any game could be a muuder simulator.
Even Viva Pinata, just mod it up a lil' bit, and voila!
Well... I wouldn't know the difference between a buttstock and a handguard if it wasn't for the glorious sport of Airsoft, with its VERY realistic 'weapons'.
Incidentally, I think airsoft makes me less inclined to go on a "video game murder spree" since its a very stimulating (and physical!) sport, and I tend to die alot when playing it.
And since I'd rather not die IRL, no rage-killing for me!
None from any game, mind you I'm a gun nut and know a bunch just from looking them up and reading about them, I get American Rifleman and that has no end to cool weapons in it.
Also the average firearm a civilian can get their hands on isn't in any of those games(well the pistols are a dumbed down versions but nothing like what you play with)
orangeapples said:
How many of you think you can reload a gun based on what you saw from a video game?
Yet again since I have been trained and it's not hard to do, and I wouldn't say that games give away any big secret, believe me it's pretty self explanatory(M Blocks can be a ***** though)
orangeapples said:
How many people here have looked at their school and said, "man this would make an awesome map."
No I feel like I'm holding a damn dangerous weapon that if handles wrong can do serious damage.
I still don't see how what your saying makes sense, guns in games are far from what they are in real life. Examples would be the safety and how to maintain the gun so you can actually fire it.
you know it has been found that every single person who committed a violent act in history have had water at some point in time. maybe we should go out and ban that too.
the people who are doing these tests are doing the same approach. they say that a person who committed a violent act played video games and therefore the two are related. that is complete bullshit.
ya know, Oxygen has a 100% chance of killing you. every person who has died; at one point in their life has been exposed to oxygen. Oxygen kill people. You should get away from oxygen. Like stop breathing it; NOW.
When did I call for a ban on video games?
And what tests are you talking about?
I'm saying that video games provide people with a visual aid to killing. and give them a place where those thoughts can build.
do you just have a copy/paste response for the idea that video games kill people?
but you are coming into this argument with a pre-existing knowledge of guns and firearms before getting into video games. You've been trained to do that. I'm talking about the average kid teenager.
If a person who has never seen a real gun, but has been playing MW2 for months on end, walks into a room and is handed their favorite gun form the game. do you think they would know what to do with it? Not expertly, but have an idea of what to do?
you know it has been found that every single person who committed a violent act in history have had water at some point in time. maybe we should go out and ban that too.
the people who are doing these tests are doing the same approach. they say that a person who committed a violent act played video games and therefore the two are related. that is complete bullshit.
ya know, Oxygen has a 100% chance of killing you. every person who has died; at one point in their life has been exposed to oxygen. Oxygen kill people. You should get away from oxygen. Like stop breathing it; NOW.
When did I call for a ban on video games?
And what tests are you talking about?
I'm saying that video games provide people with a visual aid to killing. and give them a place where those thoughts can build.
do you just have a copy/paste response for the idea that video games kill people?
apologies. i just watched the penn and teller episode that someone posted earlier and was more so responding to that. the tests that were described in the show were pretty much as i described them. didnt mean to come off like a copy paste response. and there were some people calling for a ban on fps and a fairly well known video of hilary clinton calling video games pretty much murder trainers
Man, I need an actual crazy person to post in here. None of the people here seem to be understanding this from a crazy person's point of view. All of these normals are driving me nuts. What do you think? really? well that makes sense.
but you are coming into this argument with a pre-existing knowledge of guns and firearms before getting into video games. You've been trained to do that. I'm talking about the average kid teenager.
If a person who has never seen a real gun, but has been playing MW2 for months on end, walks into a room and is handed their favorite gun form the game. do you think they would know what to do with it? Not expertly, but have an idea of what to do?
They would have no idea how to make the thing fire, Hell I bet most people don't know you have to chamber a round before it will do anything, let alone take the safety off, and your average AR/BR can go around 5 clips before needed to be cleaned properly or else it starts jamming(the M4 is increasingly bad with this, AK's not so much).I don't think most people would know how to properly aim, breath and squeeze the trigger, not to mention reloading a magazine or hell how to load anything that isn't a mag(strip clips and M-Blocks mostly).
Edit: I have plenty of friend I have had to teach how to properly fire a weapon after they decided they wanted to when MW came out, turns out they had no idea how to and lost intrest in 10 min of me trying to explain it.
Um.....not many actually. I don't really pay attention to much of that stuff. I just test each gun in the game to see what suits me best. Half the time I still say the name wrong of a gun I've been playing with for more than a few months. Also, just throwing this out there, what if I never played a game with guns in it? Kind of a hole in the theory.
How many of you think you can reload a gun based on what you saw from a video game?
I thought I could, then my uncle who's a cop took me to a shooting range. I don't have the arm strength or will power necessary to reload a gun more than a few times. PLus, sometimes my hand gets caught when pulling back on the handguns, which hurts. So no, I am far to incompetent an individual to do any simple tasks properly in reality, no matter the amount of simulated hours I've spent doing it in a game, assuming the game is even showing me the right way.
How many people here have looked at their school and said, "man this would make an awesome map."
Yeah, I have(not my school exactly, but other places, like churches and stuff), but sometimes I also look at a wall and think "man this would make an awesome climb" or look at a recipe and think "man this would be delicious". But do I climb the wall? No. Do I make the recipe? No. I'm lazy. Thinking doesn't make it so. Also, people who look at places and think "aw, this would be an awesome part of a game" are not murderers, they're game designers.
When you are holding a knife, do you feel like you are in a video game?
Now, tihs I actually had to think hard about, because it seems like the sort of thing we all do, but never notice.
And after a nice deep cognitive run through, I can assure both you and myself that never once have I ever mistaken reality for a videogame. Ever. I think "oh, it's just like a game." But like is the keyword there. Like, not is.
Eh, no we all haven't. Some of us think. I understand if you don't, but don't lump me in with the likes of you people.
now, for a person to actually go out and kill a person, that takes a certain level of crazy that must pre-exist in a person, but is it possible that if it weren't for video games, that crazy person might not have had a place for those thoughts to incubate and focus and grow?
video games on their own are not a problem, but they act more like a catalyst when combined with crazy person.
cra·zy
   /ˈkreɪzi/ Show Spelled [krey-zee] Show IPA adjective,-zi·er, -zi·est, noun,plural-zies.
?adjective
1.
mentally deranged; demented; insane.
2.
senseless; impractical; totally unsound: a crazy scheme.
3.
Informal. intensely enthusiastic; passionately excited: crazy about baseball.
4.
Informal. very enamored or infatuated (usually fol. by about): He was crazy about her.
5.
Informal. intensely anxious or eager; impatient: I'm crazy to try those new skis.
6.
Informal. unusual; bizarre; singular: She always wears a crazy hat.
7.
Slang. wonderful; excellent; perfect: That's crazy, man, crazy.
8.
likely to break or fall to pieces.
9.
weak, infirm, or sickly.
10.
having an unusual, unexpected, or random quality, behavior, result, pattern, etc.: a crazy reel that spins in either direction.
cra·zy
   /ˈkreɪzi/ Show Spelled [krey-zee] Show IPA adjective,-zi·er, -zi·est, noun,plural-zies.
?adjective
1.
mentally deranged; demented; insane.
2.
senseless; impractical; totally unsound: a crazy scheme.
3.
Informal. intensely enthusiastic; passionately excited: crazy about baseball.
4.
Informal. very enamored or infatuated (usually fol. by about): He was crazy about her.
5.
Informal. intensely anxious or eager; impatient: I'm crazy to try those new skis.
6.
Informal. unusual; bizarre; singular: She always wears a crazy hat.
7.
Slang. wonderful; excellent; perfect: That's crazy, man, crazy.
8.
likely to break or fall to pieces.
9.
weak, infirm, or sickly.
10.
having an unusual, unexpected, or random quality, behavior, result, pattern, etc.: a crazy reel that spins in either direction.
that was supposed to be more like crazy is a metaphor for tension.. think of that it like a crossbow
A crossbow has the initial tension of the string on the frame. thats' the crazy. On it's own it's pretty scary, but not enough to worry about. Video games increase the tension loading the bolt. okay, now this is scary. then the person snaps, pulls the trigger and someone ends up dead.
cra·zy
   /ˈkreɪzi/ Show Spelled [krey-zee] Show IPA adjective,-zi·er, -zi·est, noun,plural-zies.
?adjective
1.
mentally deranged; demented; insane.
2.
senseless; impractical; totally unsound: a crazy scheme.
3.
Informal. intensely enthusiastic; passionately excited: crazy about baseball.
4.
Informal. very enamored or infatuated (usually fol. by about): He was crazy about her.
5.
Informal. intensely anxious or eager; impatient: I'm crazy to try those new skis.
6.
Informal. unusual; bizarre; singular: She always wears a crazy hat.
7.
Slang. wonderful; excellent; perfect: That's crazy, man, crazy.
8.
likely to break or fall to pieces.
9.
weak, infirm, or sickly.
10.
having an unusual, unexpected, or random quality, behavior, result, pattern, etc.: a crazy reel that spins in either direction.
that was supposed to be more like crazy is a metaphor for tension.. think of that it like a crossbow
A crossbow has the initial tension of the string on the frame. thats' the crazy. On it's own it's pretty scary, but not enough to worry about. Video games increase the tension loading the bolt. okay, now this is scary. then the person snaps, pulls the trigger and someone ends up dead.
but video games could be one of any number of catalysts for violent activity. if the person is legitimately crazy even if you withhold all video games from them something else will set them off, whether it be movies, being picked on by other people, or even a book that they get the wrong message from. it seems like video games are just the newest scapegoat on what sets people off.
A crossbow has the initial tension of the string on the frame. thats' the crazy. On it's own it's pretty scary, but not enough to worry about. Video games increase the tension loading the bolt. okay, now this is scary. then the person snaps, pulls the trigger and someone ends up dead.
Instead of a metaphor, lets use the actual word.
Stress.
I know games can cause anxiety, but if your at teh point that your going to kill someone, than worse stuff has happened to you than "I got pwned in halo". That or you have some serious mental issues, in which case I can't see how games are to be blamed for your disability.
Games don't kill people.
People kill people.
And in the spirit of protecting humanity,
we should gather up all the people and burn them.
Only then, will we be safe.
I don't really see why video game fans get their knickers in a knot when they hear the term 'murder simulator'.
The cold hard fact of the matter is that a great many games simulate the act of murder.
Not that there's anything wrong with that. One of my favourite games ( and one that I mention way too often) allows you to attack a man with a swarm of angry bees, then freeze him solid and beat him to within an inch of his life, then thaw him out with a flamethrower, then electrocute him when he tries to douse himself in a nearby puddle, then finally have him brutally bludgeoned to death by an overprotective golem.
So, as horrible as it sounds to hear these words coming out of my mouth, Jack Thompson has a point. Sort of. Well, maybe half a point. Not that it matters, since even the non-gaming world considers him to be a nutjob.
Anyway, I enjoy me some simulated murder, and I'm not ashamed to say it.
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