What is Love? Does it exist?

[Fawcks]

You're right, it is incredibly easy to generalize. Incredibly easy to label someone without ever meeting them, and only reading a couple posts on the internet.

But I do not consider you a 'bad person' and I do not hate you; can't hate someone I have never met, unless we end up arguing until the mods decide to suspend us or something, which I do not want to happen.

And by 'make up more stories', I hope you don't think I was bullshitting with my examples.

My assumptions about you, and your friends may be completely untrue, I am only making assumptions from you're other posts.

But when I say what a true friend will do, I am citing examples from my life; not making things up.

(can't read the effin captcha)

It's hard to say if I'm a good person or not. I don't know. I do tend to be overly generous, and people have taken advantage of me for this in the past. So, no, I don't think I'm the kind of person who does those things like refuses to drive out to a friend. The reason I don't emotionally invest in my friends is likely because it's not of any great value. It's hard to say I wouldn't miss them when they're gone, or maybe I really don't care. Won't know until it happens (well, again, anyway). I'd be very disappointed if I were upset, however. That'd be a second error in judgment, and I should know better by now.

 

[Darkauthor81]

I'd be utterly and completely lost without her. It's a feeling of completeness that you can't even begin to describe. It's like trying to describe color to someone who's never been able to see or taste to someone who's never eaten food.

Again, been in a similar relationship. We were supposed to be married this summer. Didn't happen. So it's not that I don't understand what love feels like, I'm wondering as to whether or not it's real; or, if it's going to last.

Many people feel exactly as you do about their fiance/significant other. Do you not think 80% of people you ask wouldn't describe their relationship with the one they love the same way? If so, why does marriage end in divorce over 90% of the time?

Because those feelings are, simply put, there to trick you (in my opinion). Once they fade, people don't stay together. I have the numbers to prove it.

Then 90% of people are doing it wrong. Most of them jump into marriage within the first year. You see, we all have masks we wear. We display who we think people want to see. It takes a long time, years even, for that mask to fall away and for people to see each other for who they are and to see people for who they are and not who we want them to be. Then there's always the "I'm getting married because I'm afraid of being alone" which is exactly what my mother did and how I came into being. Which has been the guiding force in my life to never settle. Find that perfect person or find happiness being alone. There is no happiness in the middle ground.

 

[That Greek Guy]

The world is too corrupt for love to exist.

 

[funguy2121]

Jeeze, Escapists, can't we all calm down? Everyone's getting all emotional and going for each others' throats.

Why does no one on here ever ask this question?

What if there is no God, no divine plan for humanity, to all-encompassing purpose, no afterlife, no pre-existing meaning, no way to prove that our experiences are absolutely real, and love is just chemicals in the brain?

SO WHAT?

Is that really so bad? Why does that have to be such a doomsday scenario? Why can't we have fun loving anyway? Isn't this a queue to transcend older, obsolete ideas of love rather than surrendering and embracing morbid, pathetic cynicism?

 

[Flying Dagger]

I think my girlfriend put it best, and she wasn't even aware of the question.
she said: "You make me so happy, I don't know what I'd do with myself without you. I can't remember what I used to do all day before I met you."

for me, that's the essence of love.
Sure, times may change, she's about to move away for uni and I think she'll meet someone better and forget about me, that doesn't mean she isn't in love now.

She had the option of two universities, one near, one far, she really likes the one far away, and hates the one nearby. The other day she asked me which she should go to, and I said the far one. Because I love her, and the important thing is she is happy.

I don't know if I've explained this well.
I think the Long Blondes explained it better: "you can love and be in love, and they're two very different things"

I don't think love necessarily lasts forever either. People change, circumstances change, myths of everlasting love and soulmates aren't what people would have you believe they are.
But if everlasting love is a lie, and "the one" is too, does that detract from how amazing you feel when you are in love? No.
Does it feel terrible when it ends? Yes.
Does that mean it is all pointless? No.

I'll feel horrific and alone if/when my girlfriend leaves me (even though we haven't been together that long) But, think of all the things you can take away from the relationship, how much better prepared you are going to be for a new relationship with all the experience you gained from that first relationship!

It's never hopeless, you just sometimes have to look a little harder for the light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[Ohhi]

I don't know about any of that I just know that true love is a sham you won't ever be able to find a single person you can trust utterly and completely they will always try to do what is in their best interest no matter what they say in the end the only person that you can trust completely is yourself.

 

[StarStruckStrumpets]

Love is playing Borderlands with your fiancee, then having sex with her.

It's awesome.

I suppose I should put something in there about getting on very well together, knowing each other very well, blah blah blah.

Love is just one of those things that's hard to explain. Those who've never been in love, are the least qualified to try and describe it.

When you fall in love, you know. It's as easy as that.

My friend would disagree. He would say love is getting blown while you're playing Borderlands.
Yeah...he told me that. >.>

On topic: Love is...something I can't say I've felt, being 15. I do know that when infatuated however, it is much more difficult to see a flaw, and certainly defies all logic I would have if not affected by it.

 

[jamesworkshop]

I'm not following you

"seems to be some emotion"
well love is an emotion so where is the confusion

"emotion brewed up in our mind"
all emotions are brewed up in the mind, they are chemicals

"likely to promote propagation of the species"
Human mating requires a pair of humans, love facilitates (rewards) human pair bonding (since we are only talking about romantic love) says nothing of loves existance or lack of.

I'm trying to differentiate love between the romantic love portrayed in society (Which isn't exclusive to two pair love; You can also "love" your mother or father), and the sensations it causes you to feel via chemical. However, do you really feel that way? When push comes to shove, do you stand to your ideals? I don't think so.

Are you? I saw no mention of family

saying you love your parents is a syntatic issue of language

do you stand to your ideals?

What are you talking about, what ideals have I expressed for you to question

I can't prove that i feel love anymore than I could prove to you i feel hungry

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

Love is impossible to understand unless you've been in it. If you don't get it, you tend to try and analyse it too much and look incredibly stupid.

Unfortunately, it doesn't stop people from trying.

I've been in love.

It's impossible to understand a topic on a forum unless you've read it. If you haven't read it, you tend to try and respond based on only the OP, and you look incredibly stupid for your presumptions.

Unfortunately, doesn't stop people from trying...

I SEE WAT U DID THAR!!!!

Mature. Really. Great discussion.

My response was a response to the OP, in an attempt to answer the OP's question from my perspective. As such, other posts in the thread are largely irrelevant. If the OP wants to to draw attention to bits of information in the thread, there's a perfectly good edit button. Expecting everyone who posts to read the entire thread first is unreasonable.

If you say you've been in love, and you still don't understand it, then I'm not entirely sure that you were actually in love. Of course, I wasn't there and so I don't really know the ins-and-outs of the whole thing, but surely if you were in love then surely you would know what it is? Lots of people mistake something that isn't love as love, I seriously doubt that it's possible to explain love (in a non-biological sense) properly with words, which I think makes asking the question a little pointless.

 

[Fawcks]

I'd be utterly and completely lost without her. It's a feeling of completeness that you can't even begin to describe. It's like trying to describe color to someone who's never been able to see or taste to someone who's never eaten food.

Again, been in a similar relationship. We were supposed to be married this summer. Didn't happen. So it's not that I don't understand what love feels like, I'm wondering as to whether or not it's real; or, if it's going to last.

Many people feel exactly as you do about their fiance/significant other. Do you not think 80% of people you ask wouldn't describe their relationship with the one they love the same way? If so, why does marriage end in divorce over 90% of the time?

Because those feelings are, simply put, there to trick you (in my opinion). Once they fade, people don't stay together. I have the numbers to prove it.

Then 90% of people are doing it wrong. Most of them jump into marriage within the first year. You see, we all have masks we wear. We display who we think people want to see. It takes a long time, years even, for that mask to fall away and for people to see each other for who they are and to see people for who they are and not who we want them to be. Then there's always the "I'm getting married because I'm afraid of being alone" which is exactly what my mother did and how I came into being. Which has been the guiding force in my life to never settle. Find that perfect person or find happiness being alone. There is no happiness in the middle ground.

I was with mine for... Two years together, knew each other for a little longer. An external development is what ended it. Could it happen to anyone? I think so. I was closer to her than I have been to anyone else before, it was not an issue with either of us. It could happen to anyone.

 

[Darkauthor81]

I don't know about any of that I just know that true love is a sham you won't ever be able to find a single person you can trust utterly and completely they will always try to do what is in their best interest no matter what they say in the end the only person that you can trust completely is yourself.

Oh if only I too could sum up all people so cynically and succinctly. Life would be so much more simple living miserably thinking only of myself. But, alas even I'm not that bitter.

 

[Jamous]

Love is playing Borderlands with your fiancee, then having sex with her.

It's awesome.

I suppose I should put something in there about getting on very well together, knowing each other very well, blah blah blah.

Love is just one of those things that's hard to explain. Those who've never been in love, are the least qualified to try and describe it.

When you fall in love, you know. It's as easy as that.

And this man has hit the proverbial nail on its head. I didn't believe in Love with a capital L. And then I fell in Love with my girlfriend; I was incredibly surprised by how much it actually felt like it's made out to be. Pretty goddamn epic.
Also, playing Borderlands and then sex sounds epic. I tip my hat to you good sir.

Anyways, if you're asking what love -is-, then it is simply chemicals in the brain triggering certain thought patterns and reactions. It's really quite beautiful that this can be the case, despite the fact a great deal of people seem to think this degrades the status of love. It certainly isn't undying ever, I'm sure especially in times of immense emotional trauma; I'd imagine this would be because all emotions are chemical reactions in the brain, the trauma almost 'overwrites' the chemicals of love.

 

[Fawcks]

If you say you've been in love, and you still don't understand it, then I'm not entirely sure that you were actually in love. Of course, I wasn't there and so I don't really know the ins-and-outs of the whole thing, but surely if you were in love then surely you would know what it is? Lots of people mistake something that isn't love as love, I seriously doubt that it's possible to explain love (in a non-biological sense) properly with words, which I think makes asking the question a little pointless.

What I question was whether or not my feelings were genuine. Now that we're not together, I feel she had a lot more faults than I remember, but simply never addressed; that's what I was talking about. A rather extreme example of this is an abusive relationship. Can someone really love someone who beats them? Or is it just chemicals in the brain saying, "NO, you love this person"? That's what I was trying to ask.

 

[Vern5]

OH BABY DONT HURT ME NO MORE!

Waaaaaay too late to the party.

...baby don't hurt me. Don't hurt me. No more.

Lol couldn't stop myself.

You too. Troll smarter, not harder.

Fine. you want my opinion? Here it is.

Love as an emotion is a misnomer. I personally believe that love is a mutual connection between two people rather than a feeling that you can direct at another human being like a romantic guided missile. Love is what the connection between the two people is. For example, my girlfriend and I complement each other in ways that are both useful and amusing. Logically, we have compatibility in values, abilities, interests and physical preferences. We have fun together. We have deep conversations together. We function best together (barring subtle distractions).

Again, we are in love because of all of these compatibilities first and the warm & fuzzies second. Although, the warm & fuzzies do feel nice.

If you don't feel it then you don't feel it. I don't see any problems with that. Not everyone is drawing from the same pool of emotions since birth. Hell, I don't really consider myself overtly emotional.

 

[Canid117]

Love is an emotion just like Anger, Sadness, Fear and Happiness.

 

[shiaramoon]

I'm not following you

"seems to be some emotion"
well love is an emotion so where is the confusion

"emotion brewed up in our mind"
all emotions are brewed up in the mind, they are chemicals

"likely to promote propagation of the species"
Human mating requires a pair of humans, love facilitates (rewards) human pair bonding (since we are only talking about romantic love) says nothing of loves existance or lack of.

I'm trying to differentiate love between the romantic love portrayed in society (Which isn't exclusive to two pair love; You can also "love" your mother or father), and the sensations it causes you to feel via chemical. However, do you really feel that way? When push comes to shove, do you stand to your ideals? I don't think so.

That would depend on the individuals involved and how important that loved person is to them. Some will, some won't and some will land somewhere in the middle. I personally think I'm between the first and the last.

Btw, I was skimming the last few pages and gathered that you were in a relationship with a girl, but something bad happened in her life and then she broke up with you because of it. Is that more or less accurate? I really think you should consider talking to a counselor about the pain your experiencing, not because you're sick or unhealthy, but because if you can't work through this, then you'll wind up spending the rest of your life being a cynic. That's not a very happy way to live. If nothing else, talking to someone can help you gain an unbiased, professional perspective and it's always nice to vent to someone who is legally bound to keep their mouth shut.

I should know, i recently came out to my family as bisexual, and told them my female roommate of the last 3 years or so is also my girlfriend (I'm a girl btw). Since my family is a very southern Baptist, that didn't go over so well, better than i originally expected, but still not well. I spent months thinking over the way I felt about my girlfriend before finally asking her to go out with me and it hurts so much for the family I have grown up with loved for so long to just try and dismiss that. At the same time, my girlfriend feel betrayed by my family because she feels they wouldn't have an issue if she was a guy. They're bashing her, she's bashing them and I'm stuck in the middle of it. It sucks, it really does. That coupled with the fact that I have dependency issues led me to decide I should start talking to a counselor. I currently seeing one that I saw back in high school for some other stuff and she's been really great for helping me sort through all this mess around me. Even if there wasn't anything stressful going on or personal growth that I need help with, it would still be nice to talk to someone whose only job is to listen to and help me. Emotionally, I own her nothing in return, but I have gained a lot.

I really hope you'll at least go talk to a counselor just a couple of times, just to try it. Make sure they have good references though, there are a few really crappy counselors out there and I'd hate for you to have to suffer any more than you already have. I hope you can eventually find some sense of peace in all of this that you're going through, I really do. I can only imagine the pain and sense of betrayal you must be feeling after something like that.

 

[Fiz_The_Toaster]

What I question was whether or not my feelings were genuine. Now that we're not together, I feel she had a lot more faults than I remember, but simply never addressed; that's what I was talking about. A rather extreme example of this is an abusive relationship. Can someone really love someone who beats them? Or is it just chemicals in the brain saying, "NO, you love this person"? That's what I was trying to ask.

That abusive example, by admission it is extreme, is Stockholm Syndrome. Yeah they are a nice person, when they are not beating the other person in the relationship. Yes, it is irrational and to everyone else looking in on that relationship makes no sense what so ever, but they were conditioned to have compassion, and yes, even love them. Abusive relationships don't start off as such, every one knows that, I assume, and yes it is the chemicals telling them that, only after the conditioning.

 

[GenericAmerican]

It's hard to say if I'm a good person or not. I don't know. I do tend to be overly generous, and people have taken advantage of me for this in the past. So, no, I don't think I'm the kind of person who does those things like refuses to drive out to a friend. The reason I don't emotionally invest in my friends is likely because it's not of any great value. It's hard to say I wouldn't miss them when they're gone, or maybe I really don't care. Won't know until it happens (well, again, anyway). I'd be very disappointed if I were upset, however. That'd be a second error in judgment, and I should know better by now.

I think there are two different interpretations of yourself. One is your own interpretation, which can be unreliable as it can change with your current mood, state of mind, actions, ect.

Then there are what other people think of you in general. I personally hate it when people call me a nice guy because I don't think I am. But everyone keeps saying I am a nice person. There are one or two people that hate my guts, but that is normal.

It's contradictory. I don't think I am a good person, some of my actions are not nice either; but the majority of people I know, label me as a nice person.

Who do I believe, myself? Or the masses? My own opinion, or the collective opinion of all my fellow humans?

When you can't figure it out (like me) it eats away at you, makes you angry, sometimes miserable. You second guess yourself all the time, and it isn't fun.

Hell, my first impression of you was someone stuck on a woman leaving him, and whining on the interwebs, arguing all those with something to say.

But this post makes me stop and re-evaluate because you have explained a little more about the friends deal. (Which is the whole reason I was angry in the first place, don't mess with my friends; I won't let it happen, even if my friends do.)

Am I reading the end right? You would be disappointed with yourself, if you lost a friend, and you were upset by it? Because you knew better.

So you try and remain unattached to friends and the like? To avoid any pain or unpleasant feeling if you lost that friend?

Almost like that grizzled old sergeant in a war movie, he doesn't learn other people names, and doesn't become friends with the FNG's; so that when they end up dead, it doesn't affect him(as much)?

^Am I interpreting things right?

 

[dragonslayer32]

Love is your soul's recognition of it's counterpart in another. I love wedding crashers...

 

[AgentDarkmoon]

I'd be utterly and completely lost without her. It's a feeling of completeness that you can't even begin to describe. It's like trying to describe color to someone who's never been able to see or taste to someone who's never eaten food.

Again, been in a similar relationship. We were supposed to be married this summer. Didn't happen. So it's not that I don't understand what love feels like, I'm wondering as to whether or not it's real; or, if it's going to last.

Many people feel exactly as you do about their fiance/significant other. Do you not think 80% of people you ask wouldn't describe their relationship with the one they love the same way? If so, why does marriage end in divorce over 90% of the time?

Because those feelings are, simply put, there to trick you (in my opinion). Once they fade, people don't stay together. I have the numbers to prove it.

First off, divorce rates are NOT at 90%, I doubt you can find anywhere in the world where they are that high. Closer to 40-50% at this point in America, and lower in other countries based on the research I just did. I think part of the increase in divorce rates as of recent times has to do with shifts in society as a whole.

Secondly, there's no real way to know if love is real or going to last except to go through with it. You don't even know if you're going to die today or not. So it's a call of if you're willing to let other people in, and take the risk of getting hurt for the reward the relationship will provide.

I personally feel that people can stay together just fine because if they're in the right relationship, happy feelings don't fade. I've been with my boyfriend for 2 and a half years, we have rough times but we work together and have far more bad than good. We can accept each others "flaws" and that neither of us is perfect. Emotional trauma (such as happened in your relationship) is a tricky subject though, and I can't guarantee that I would react to it the same way that he would, and it is true that it might split us apart. That wouldn't take value away from the love we shared when we were together, though.

Yes, that sentence is my answer to the question you most recently present. Problems in the future don't take away from the value of the love you share in the present. Your feelings are/were genuine. There's a saying that hindsight is 20/20- so yes, you will be able to "objectively" look at your relationship once it's over and see the flaws you might have glossed over. You might also be hurt by her leaving and look at it in a negative view, magnifying small flaws into massive problems. But, when you and her were together, you did love her, and that's what matters.

I can't speak for people in abusive relationships. I think that its part loving the person who once existed/exists in their mind and part Stockholm syndrome. But I can say that IMHO, people who end up breaking up normally and had normal relationships did have valid feelings while they were together.

Here's hoping I haven't offended you. Cheers.