Yeah I hate it when McDonald's gives me just a bun because they started production of the rest of the burger after they started production of the bun. And now they want some more money for the rest of the burger which they are demanding at the same time they give me the bun so I can complete my burger experience? That must be fair, I mean I could enjoy my non-burger-complete burger without paying so I guess it's fair.
You people are ridiculous
- Thread starter Phlakes
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But things made by Biowhere don't make me vomit every time. Yeah the ending was bad but not that bad. I fucking hate McDonald's. Sorry had to say that.
And Bioware PR answers to EA, which I trust far less than my own judgment. I'm not paranoid if I'm always rightPhlakes said:
No, but we do have track record of EA doing very questionable things in a large number of previous games, so that's why gamer's are not putting anything past EA to have fucked with ME3, as we are seeing those same very questionable actions in ME3.Phlakes said:
If this was a one-off, people would be like.. well, that's odd, not normal, but I'll go with it. But this isn't a one off. EA is a large corporation that needs to answer to share holders to earn big money. EA needs to make money, and they have shown they will engage in every shady back-handed greedy tactic that they can get away with. Each game they grow bolder and bolder in the amount and type of content they hold back, for a higher and higher price each time.
First it was paid weapons and armor skins, then it was paid maps (dungeons, maps, etc.etc), then it was paid additional side characters, and now its paid characters that are center to the games lore.
EA has now messed with a very respected developer with a very passionate (if somewhat irrational) fan base. Of course the outrage is going to be - big.
Well there is the thing about part of the DLC being on the disk. The whole character is there. You can go to a game file (if you have pc), change a simple line around, and you'll be able to use him. You just can't get his starting mission and he won't appear on the Normandy.Phlakes said:
To me that says two things.
1: They stopped the game sooner than they should have to start making DLC (time which they could have spent refining the ending of the game). This is what most people are saying.
or
2: They created the guy but couldn't finish him because of constraints, then in a money-grubbing maneuver slapped on a quick (and i mean really quick. His mission is very short and pretty much involves running around in a small area fighting off generic cerberus enemies) starting mission and gave him a room in the normandy.
I compared From Ashes to Kasumi: Stolen Memory in another thread.
It's obvious Kasumi: Stolen Memory had a lot more work put into it. The mission area was bigger and more complex, the gunship fight was created from scratch and worked pretty well, and even Kasumi herself had more new powers than Javik (Kasumi got the flash bang grenades and shadow strike, while Javik only got dark channel).
And Kasumi was made well after the release date, meaning they didn't include making the character in the original budget.
Oh and Kasumi only cost $7.
Maybe those "amazing" in engine flashback cinematics cost them so much they had to charge twice what it was worth..
Didn't read past the image. Mostly because your McDonalds point was entirely flawed.
McDonalds has to purchase (or, spend money on) every slice of cheese that comes into their possession. They need to charge for people wanting extra cheese because every slice is an expense.
DLC is a piece of software. Once it exists, it doesn't stop existing, and the people distributing it (in this case, Bioware and EA) don't need to purchase every copy of it that they sell.
I say this to point out the flaw in your argument, not because I am against it.
I too am sick of the complaints about the Day One DLC.
McDonalds has to purchase (or, spend money on) every slice of cheese that comes into their possession. They need to charge for people wanting extra cheese because every slice is an expense.
DLC is a piece of software. Once it exists, it doesn't stop existing, and the people distributing it (in this case, Bioware and EA) don't need to purchase every copy of it that they sell.
I say this to point out the flaw in your argument, not because I am against it.
I too am sick of the complaints about the Day One DLC.
Ok disclaimer here is I was never going to buy ME3 in the first place but I played the first two so I have no bias here or whiny fanboy agenda. I get what you mean but let me explain the other side more eloquently than other entitled sounding teens who don't quite understand why they are so angry themselves.Phlakes said:
What you are saying is there has always been DLC in the form of expansions small sequels and more prominently mini DLC for a few bucks, and that given the way modern game development works it makes perfect sense to make a side project while the QA is being done. As you probably noticed the vast majority of gamers were fine with this sort of DLC in small doses when this started a few years back. A couple of new weapons here and some character skins there and gamers feel slightly irked but not offended enough to not dish out a little extra or pre order.
Why this feels different to fans of Mass Effect is because this isn't something one part of the team can do as a side project to keep their jobs safe, this is a project requiring the collaboration of multiple teams with coders 3D modelers artists and a voice actor. On top of that any Mass Effect fan can't ignore this DLC because it contains a character pivotal to the story which would be no problem to gamers if this was some expansion released a couple of months down the line but on launch day real fans feel trapped into spending the extra cash. Its not like a regular game where you can play without the extra stuff but feel it would add the the experience, this feels like an important part of the story (which is what Mass Effect is all about) that they are forced to buy. Yes the people who made it deserve to be paid for their hard work, but the way this DLC was planned felt like a trap, and people don't like feeling trapped. Because normal people worked hard for their money too and worry they are being played for their devotion.
Anyway as I said I was never going to buy Mass Effect 3 long bfore this nonsense, the DLC thing is overblown by gamers sure but most developers can make money without resorting to holding plot elements hostage like this. (Pay extra to find out what happens to Snape in the Deathly Hallows! Its totally optional if you don't care about that entire character/story arc!)
Dunno about you, I just order a cheeseburger. If you wanna argue a cheeseburger is a burger with cheese, I can argue tea's water with a little bag thrown into it for 15 seconds. Also, you're not buying a tasty way to get diarrhea here, we're talking about a product, an entertainment one at least and an artistic one at best.Phlakes said:
When I go to the movies, there isn't a guy in front offering me to pay an extra 5$ to see the director's cut, cut scenes and so on. That shit comes LATER, on the special edition DVD. When I buy a music CD, I don't have to pay extra to hear an extra jingle in the song - there's usually a bonus CD right there with my regular CD.
Day 1 DLC is bullshit. If content is ready for Day 1, it should be on the CD. It's on the fucking Collector's Edition, it's not like it's somehow impossible to put it into a standard one, it's just a "give us more money" marketing thing.
I plan to loudly champion this boycott, but I will secretly buy a block of cheddar tonight and enjoy its sweet, sweet taste.Redlin5 said:
Down with the cheese industry *munch munch* They are greedy *munch* and horrible *munch* and...*burp*
That's right, brother! Enjoy that delicious delicious cheese!Vegosiux said:
I'd congratulate you on your grasp of the obvious, save for the "everyone" part.Dansen said:
This implies that if multiple teams finish their work early, they should all work on individual, smaller pieces of DLC rather than together on something larger. It would be rare for just one team to be finished its work, especially as you near release date. As teams finish their work, they can begin working on making something like this together, rather than individual, smaller, sets of DLC.Mr Companion said:
I have now almost finished ME3 and I can confirm that the DLC character is in no way pivotal to the story. It will give you a small extra war asset, its recruitment mission, and some funny lines of Dialogue, but that's it. It is in no way required to finish the game, and I have played the majority of the game ignoring it and its flowed quite smoothly still. It is in no way pivotal to the story, angry Internet users just want to believe that it is as it gives them something to complain about. Is it cool, interesting and something quite unexpected to the story? Yeah. Pivotal? In no way.
Actually, it is like a regular game. This DLC is no more important than Zaeed was for ME2. An extra squadmate is all that he is, nothing important to the story at all.
Yeah, classic paranoia on the Internet. OH NO! SOMETHING I HAVE TO PAY FOR! WHY ARE YOU SO GREEDY [Insert Company Here]. There are a lot of reasonable people too, and a lot of people who misunderstand things and make assumptions based off what everyone else is saying without looking up the facts themselves, but there are also those who will complain about anything they have to pay for because they trust their paranoia more than anything else. Somewhat sad, but I get it to an extent.
As I've already said, its not essential to the story. More accurate than you Snape analogy would be 'Pay extra to have Harry gain the Ghost of Gryphindor as a companion! Comes complete with comedy lines, cool spells, and an interesting scene where he finds her. Buy now!'.
Would having the Ghost of whoever that Gryphindor founder was be awesome, cool and interesting? Yeah. Would it be essential to the plot? No, as you can see the plot flowed quite nicely without her.
That implies that making the DLC is free. You pay the designers, artists, coders, ect. their pay to make the DLC when you buy the DLC, and then you can talk. Problem is, that would be more than unreasonable for most people. So instead, they cut that cost down and sell the DLC for less than its production cost to a lot of people, making up the production cost through the number of small purchases adding money to repay that. Its like a tollway. It cost the government a lot of money to make, but rather than charging the first driver to use it the full cost to make it, they charge everyone who uses it a significantly lesser amount to slowly regain the money through large amounts of small 'purchases'. Though yes, the McD analogy was somewhat flawed too.Mr Goostoff said: