Zero Punctuation: Metal Gear Solid 4

[Magugag]

Terra, I happen to be a DM. I went out and bought all those damn 4th edition books the day they came out (goddamn pricey I'll add) and I plan to DM for a very long time to come. Know what the key to a successful campaign is? Keep the story moving along at a good pace so that things don't stagnate. Also, I'm an avid roleplayer, but that's about as geeky as I'll go into that bit. I create character motivations and double crosses and little love interests and even the occasional silly twist. I can forgive that, that's fine, but I stand by my earlier assessment about the presentation.

 

[VMerken]

What I am saying is story is not bad, and alot of detail can be a very good thing especially when presented well. Again this is why people need to be forced to do some real RP heavy D&D once in a while.

Yes, but in MGS4's case I think the argument can be made (and defended as I've done above) that the story - with respect to the game - has NOT been presented well. As for real RP heavy D&D: I recommend Planescape: Torment and Fallout 1 and 2.

 

[UninspiringlyNamed]

I have never played any of the MGS games, but I know a couple of fanboys of the franchise and one of them tried to 'convert' me with MGS4 and if I'm honest, it didn't really press many buttons for me. Without all of the backstory I didn't really find myself at ease with the world and as a standalone story, what I saw of MGS4 wasn't all that great. It had its moments, but on the whole it wasn't good enough to base a game around, which is a shame because I like the idea of varying cutscene-gameplay ratio to 'mix things up' and make heavily-cinematic sorts of games. Good call on the necklines thing as well, hehe.

In all, an entertaining piece but it probably wouldn't deter me from buying the game if I was going to.

 

[TerraMGP]

No, though I am broke enough that I wish I was. I just hate to see Yatzee sell out and this was the straw that broke the camels back. If he has genuine issues with MGS4 then fine I can accept that, My main point is simply that I hate to see him cave to peer pressure as he seems to be and shifting to whatever mindset lets him bash the hardest.

As for making a game and reviewing, one lends itself to the other. He never said his game was perfect, but by putting it out there he said it was good enough to play, it was a reflection of the kind of work he does and now bashing someone for doing the same just because it makes him so popular. The game is still a reflection of who he is, and he is saying that someone else doing the same thing was bad. He made relatively HUGE cutscenes for someone using AGS and probably would have made longer. My problem is that he is guilty of doing what he is saying is bad for a big time producer to do almost to a T.

Also I never said I was bored with him, I'm only bored now that hes selling out and the charm is gone

Also also, to quote my cousin

4E is the absolute worst thing to ever happen to gaming.

 

[TerraMGP]

Stupid accidental double post

 

[VMerken]

Terra, I happen to be a DM. I went out and bought all those damn 4th edition books the day they came out (goddamn pricey I'll add) and I plan to DM for a very long time to come. Know what the key to a successful campaign is? Keep the story moving along at a good pace so that things don't stagnate. Also, I'm an avid roleplayer, but that's about as geeky as I'll go into that bit. I create character motivations and double crosses and little love interests and even the occasional silly twist. I can forgive that, that's fine, but I stand by my earlier assessment about the presentation.

Hehe, why not try the Kojima Way of DMing next time? It might be as awesome as some wager here.

DM: "Right, let me start with a 23 minute long introduction. [...] So, Player1, you are standing behind some trucks in a desolate, wartorn, landscape in the Orient. What will you do?"

Player1: "... huh. What?! Okay. Uhm, I'll move slightly to the left."

DM: "Good. That triggers a 5 minute event which I'll tell now. [...] So, Player1, what do you do next?"

DM: "Player1? Player2? Guys?! Where are you?"

 

[TerraMGP]

Thats usually about how most of our games go, not as cynically but we will go whole sessions with little or no rolling.

 

[tratorix]

No, though I am broke enough that I wish I was. I just hate to see Yatzee sell out and this was the straw that broke the camels back. If he has genuine issues with MGS4 then fine I can accept that, My main point is simply that I hate to see him cave to peer pressure as he seems to be and shifting to whatever mindset lets him bash the hardest.

As for making a game and reviewing, one lends itself to the other. He never said his game was perfect, but by putting it out there he said it was good enough to play, it was a reflection of the kind of work he does and now bashing someone for doing the same just because it makes him so popular. The game is still a reflection of who he is, and he is saying that someone else doing the same thing was bad. He made relatively HUGE cutscenes for someone using AGS and probably would have made longer. My problem is that he is guilty of doing what he is saying is bad for a big time producer to do almost to a T.

Also I never said I was bored with him, I'm only bored now that hes selling out and the charm is gone

How is he caving to peer pressure? Is it honestly that hard for you to believe he didn't like the game that much?

 

[SirSchmoopy]

Wait lol You don't like 4E?
Done with this thread as you must obviously be a troll. Seriously.

 

[TerraMGP]

No, its hard for me to beleive that he shifts his basic mindset about gaming that much. Its hard for me to buy that he would be unable to even grudgingly admit to doing something similar or even point to many of the other good, or hell even the bad points. I'm not saying he should have liked the game, I am talking about a bigger issue with him flipflopping on what he likes about games and what he has to say. He is giving reviews now that are totally bad and are bad for their own sake.

 

[TheSequelToTheOriginal]

The advertisement following this review contains the single funniest slogan a game has ever had. And then some handicam douchebag starts talking about Jack Thompson and I turn off. For the love of God won't gamers shut up about Jack Thompson? It's pathetic.

Oh yeah and this is a fine review because Mister Croshaw is a fine reviewer.

 

[TerraMGP]

And thats the logic that has helped to kill his credibility. Its no longer he is a fine reviewer because he does not give a damn about what others think and just sticks to his guns, apparently respectability kills off a persons integrity on the quickfast.

 

[Magugag]

Terra, I happen to be a DM. I went out and bought all those damn 4th edition books the day they came out (goddamn pricey I'll add) and I plan to DM for a very long time to come. Know what the key to a successful campaign is? Keep the story moving along at a good pace so that things don't stagnate. Also, I'm an avid roleplayer, but that's about as geeky as I'll go into that bit. I create character motivations and double crosses and little love interests and even the occasional silly twist. I can forgive that, that's fine, but I stand by my earlier assessment about the presentation.

Hehe, why not try the Kojima Way of DMing next time? It might be as awesome as some wager here.

DM: "Right, let me start with a 23 minute long introduction. [...] So, Player1, you are standing behind some trucks in a desolate, wartorn, landscape in the Orient. What will you do?"

Player1: "... huh. What?! Okay. Uhm, I'll move slightly to the left."

DM: "Good. That triggers a 5 minute event which I'll tell now. [...] So, Player1, what do you do next?"

DM: "Player1? Player2? Guys?! Where are you?"

That is freaking AWESOME.

And off-topic, I find 4th edition perfectly fine. The rules are less overbearing and a little more simple, skill challenges allow for more roleplaying involved and less dice rolling, and all classes having powers makes it so you don't do the same damn thing every round. As far as roleplaying goes, none of the freedom is taken away and the rules have been streamlined. The only problem I have is a slight lack of content, but give it a year or so and maybe it will have half as many books as 3E. The content will come.

 

[shadow skill]

You know people complained about the long cutscenes in Xenosaga and that was most definetly an RPG so I really do not believe that the type of game is the issue for some. I suspect people would still complain about the length of these scenes if MGS was an RPG.

 

[VMerken]

No, its hard for me to beleive that he shifts his basic mindset about gaming that much. Its hard for me to buy that he would be unable to even grudgingly admit to doing something similar or even point to many of the other good, or hell even the bad points. I'm not saying he should have liked the game, I am talking about a bigger issue with him flipflopping on what he likes about games and what he has to say. He is giving reviews now that are totally bad and are bad for their own sake.

A person's opinion on video games, believe it or not, is not carved in stone and the same for the rest of his or her natural life. Maybe one day, a JRPG will plod along that Yahtzee will truly love. Maybe one day, Yahtzee might play beyond the first act of The Witcher and see the game for what it really is .

People flip-flop all the time about things, depending on their experience. Thus Yahtzee as well. It's only natural.

 

[Ghostkai]

While the review raised some good points, such as cutscene:gameplay ratio, I friggin loved this game.
Call me a fanboy if you want but I like to view the MGS saga as more of a series of interactive movies than games, perhaps due to the cinematic nature of the past 4 games.

 

[tratorix]

And thats the logic that has helped to kill his credibility. Its no longer he is a fine reviewer because he does not give a damn about what others think and just sticks to his guns, apparently respectability kills off a persons integrity on the quickfast.

What in this review is inconsistent with the other reviews he has given? I don't understand what you are really complaining about other than that he insulted your favourite game.

 

[TerraMGP]

No, its hard for me to beleive that he shifts his basic mindset about gaming that much. Its hard for me to buy that he would be unable to even grudgingly admit to doing something similar or even point to many of the other good, or hell even the bad points. I'm not saying he should have liked the game, I am talking about a bigger issue with him flipflopping on what he likes about games and what he has to say. He is giving reviews now that are totally bad and are bad for their own sake.

A person's opinion on video games, believe it or not, is not carved in stone and the same for the rest of his or her natural life. Maybe one day, a JRPG will plod along that Yahtzee will truly love. Maybe one day, Yahtzee might play beyond the first act of The Witcher and see the game for what it really is .

People flip-flop all the time about things, depending on their experience. Thus Yahtzee as well. It's only natural.

That drastically? and always to the side where he is in opposition? Seems way too coincidental.

Also on 4E, no, it just took out all the rules that make it so you can actually role play and killed it.

 

[D_987]

I prepared for a stream off fanboyish moans when I clicked comments, so im suprised.

This was an excellant review in my eyes, I bought MGS 4, on the pretext it was the one game I could use to justify buying a ps3, and I was mistaken, th game is pretty poor. The graphics are excellant, but Gameplay is drastcallywrong.

The decision to dumb the games controls down and try andmakeit for everyone has ruined the series im my eyes.

That and close quarters combat is appalling.