Another Incident in Portland

[Kae]

My mom makes that stuff.

It's kinda weird.

Yeah my mom makes it too, mostly on Christmas, to be honest I've never really liked it.

 

[fOx]

It is reputedly the best selling book in history. Judging by other threads and posts you've made, you're pretty familiar with it.

Judging by other threads and posts, I'd say he's never read it.

 

[Iron]

You know, this describes a business owner incredibly well. Thanks for the meme, I'll just edit the picture. Definitely keeping the daddy money thing … you know, because generally they are using daddy's money and didn't earn it themselves. Or exploited their workers

Not sure what you expect a marshmallow fruit salad to do under these circumstances
View attachment 698

It's (not actually) weird to see political protests not getting the same leeway sports celebrations get. Like, if somebody loots a convenience store while people are in the streets celebrating a sportsball win, it's downright easy for people to say "well that's not the fault of the happy sportsball people". But a dude gets shot during a robbery a couple miles away from a protest against police brutality and that's definitely connected, I guess

topkek.
I meant this:

Biden literally said he wants to arrest all the anarchists doing the looting.

He'll probably forget about it in a couple of hours

 

[Trunkage]

View attachment 703

I mean, I didn't insult you. It's just that, without the flag there, I could have sworn you were talking about rich people. What was that about bantz?

 

[Trunkage]

Don’t give him this, he said “31 killed by rioters.”

I like to be truthful. De Blasio being a monster doesn't make protesters kill 31 people. I know some will pretend there is a link but I'll (pointlessly perhaps) point out otherwise

Also, I'm very cranky with De Blasio and Cuomo. Those guys are raging a-holes and only got there because Bloomberg and Guiliani make them look like saints.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

The problem at present is there seems to be no direction. No goal. No end point being presented.
Before it was Police with body camera which started to happen.
Now?
Justice? But the court case is happening so is that not Justice?
It seems more like a mob demanding mob justice.
There's some in there that are pushing this further. I mean is it any wonder with van load of riot gear and illegal fireworks and other stuff being driven to places by groups like Riot Kitchen?

Truth doesn't seem to matter anymore and hell I worry justice won't either soon

Biden literally said he wants to arrest all the anarchists doing the looting.

yes specifically just the Anarchists I'm sure lol

I don't disagree that you said this

I was also quoted you, again, stating that once someone is killed, the whole protest is a riot.

Like, I'm never going to blame Jake Paul shenanigans in Arizona on the protesters but it sounds very much like you would...

You know, like the FBI counting all the deaths and blaming only the protesters in the 60s. Just to say how bad the civil right movement was.

We've seen all this before.

Jake Paul's a moron whose gonna moron.


Even leaving out deaths from Police (who in 1/2 or more were taking down armed people) the death count was ~20

This isn't the 60s civil rights stuff this is people taking advantage and wanting to smash stuff. We had a version of it happen in the UK years ago and you know what stopped it? A heavy crackdown, admittedly in the UK we don't have as easy access to firearms so a crackdown was far easier. We didn't have any end up dead or full on places being burned down though.

Yeah, I can see you've done a whole lot of that in this topic by constantly haggling down the number of people killed and whether or not they should be classified as "protesters" or "rioters"

and he still ended up with near 20 which he couldn't haggle out of.

 

[Dwarvenhobble]

I like to be truthful. De Blasio being a monster doesn't make protesters kill 31 people. I know some will pretend there is a link but I'll (pointlessly perhaps) point out otherwise

Also, I'm very cranky with De Blasio and Cuomo. Those guys are raging a-holes and only got there because Bloomberg and Guiliani make them look like saints.

There are at least 31 dead but not all due to the actions of rioters I'll admit to being wrong initially on how many could be blamed on rioters. Some of it is Police over-reaching though some is also Police valid action as if you have a guy walking round or taking shots at people and refusing to surrender they have to make the choice to protect more people from being shot.

 

[Revnak]

There are at least 31 dead but not all due to the actions of rioters I'll admit to being wrong initially on how many could be blamed on rioters. Some of it is Police over-reaching though some is also Police valid action as if you have a guy walking round or taking shots at people and refusing to surrender they have to make the choice to protect more people from being shot.

Should I have just said “well, some of those deaths were duplicates or not protest related so your argument is invalid?” Seems a line of logic you convince yourself with.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

The problem at present is there seems to be no direction. No goal. No end point being presented.
Before it was Police with body camera which started to happen.
Now?
Justice? But the court case is happening so is that not Justice?
It seems more like a mob demanding mob justice.

Court case for which one? Which court case for which incident?

Because the cops just can't stop killing people and lying about why. The DA in Louisville just tried to give a plea deal to Breonna Taylor's boyfriend offering him parole if he just lied and said Breonna was involved in some drug stuff.

 

[Agema]

The problem at present is there seems to be no direction. No goal. No end point being presented.

The problem is that it's thirty years since the Rodney King incident, and the police have failed in those 30 years to restore many people's faith in them.

The protestors want reassurance that policing will be improved. This is the point a wise president would lead from the front and mollify them. Unfortunately, the current president is neither wise nor interested in improving America's social divisions, so they're still on the streets.

 

[tstorm823]

The problem is that it's thirty years since the Rodney King incident, and the police have failed in those 30 years to restore many people's faith in them.

The protestors want reassurance that policing will be improved. This is the point a wise president would lead from the front and mollify them. Unfortunately, the current president is neither wise nor interested in improving America's social divisions, so they're still on the streets.

With a group of this scale, people's faith won't be restored so long as there are others dedicating themselves to advertising all the worst things. "Police in the US" is just too large a group to avoid problems everywhere, and so long as people continue being riled up by occasional anecdotes, nobody will ever notice improvement. (And some people would rather have revolution than progress, and are perfectly content to disguise improvement.)

 

[Agema]

With a group of this scale, people's faith won't be restored so long as there are others dedicating themselves to advertising all the worst things. "Police in the US" is just too large a group to avoid problems everywhere, and so long as people continue being riled up by occasional anecdotes, nobody will ever notice improvement. (And some people would rather have revolution than progress, and are perfectly content to disguise improvement.)

Yes, but the police seem to have been very slow to learn stuff. I accept individual policemen are going to make bad decisions, but I'm less impressed by what the common reaction of the authorities are. The desire to cover up and excuse is strong. I think a lot of PDs are still overfond of use force. It's things like the near-paramilitary equipment and stylings some police adopt. That many places have such poor police-community relations.

However, I think it's mostly a political failure. Ferguson, a few years ago, a shooting kicked it off, but it really needs to be seen in the context of a heavily majority white police force aggressively fining a heavily majority black populace just so the local government could increase revenues. That's going to hurt the relationship of police and community, with added aggravation because of the racial element. These "anecdotes" are actually occurring within this backdrop of systemic problems. They are sparks for which fuel is at risk of catching light.

And then it does go to the president. I really do think any other president from the last 40 years, who had a shred of empathy and a feeling they should represent all Americans, would have come out and soothed everybody until they went home. But the current president is a man without those values, who electoral schtick is sticking a crowbar into the divide in US society and yanking it for all he's worth.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

Yes, but the police seem to have been very slow to learn stuff. I accept individual policemen are going to make bad decisions, but I'm less impressed by what the common reaction of the authorities are. The desire to cover up and excuse is strong. I think a lot of PDs are still overfond of use force. It's things like the near-paramilitary equipment and stylings some police adopt. That many places have such poor police-community relations.

However, I think it's mostly a political failure. Ferguson, a few years ago, a shooting kicked it off, but it really needs to be seen in the context of a heavily majority white police force aggressively fining a heavily majority black populace just so the local government could increase revenues. That's going to hurt the relationship of police and community, with added aggravation because of the racial element. These "anecdotes" are actually occurring within this backdrop of systemic problems. They are sparks for which fuel is at risk of catching light.

It's interesting how everyone likes to gloss over Ferguson (Including BLM) since the actual shooting doesn't play into the narrative, including all the rumor-mongering that came out of it to lead to that point.

 

[tstorm823]

And then it does go to the president. I really do think any other president from the last 40 years, who had a shred of empathy and a feeling they should represent all Americans, would have come out and soothed everybody until they went home. But the current president is a man without those values, who electoral schtick is sticking a crowbar into the divide in US society and yanking it for all he's worth.

But... you know the BLM movement as it is started under Obama... and was basically continuous for 3 years... and then largely faded and probably only rose back to such prominence because of a pandemic. Like, why was BLM so huge and then basically disappeared for a couple years? It's not because of which president's in office. The first height of activity was Obama, his rhetoric stopped nothing. The local minimum was during Trump, his rhetoric didn't provoke activity. I'm not trying to draw the opposite conclusion, I'm not trying to blame Obama. BLM settled down because things got better, policing got better, the economy got better. I guarantee someone is going to dispute my claim that things get better because they want to believe everything is always horrible and we need to burn down human civilization, but the BLM article on wikipedia has a timeline of activity that skips the entire year 2019 because things were genuinely that good before covid.

 

[Seanchaidh]

With a group of this scale, people's faith won't be restored so long as there are others dedicating themselves to advertising all the worst things. "Police in the US" is just too large a group to avoid problems everywhere, and so long as people continue being riled up by occasional anecdotes, nobody will ever notice improvement. (And some people would rather have revolution than progress, and are perfectly content to disguise improvement.)

You don't get a movement like this one if the lived experiences of a very large number of folks doesn't back it up. Unfortunately, some people want an official gang of thugs around to beat up protesters, force striking workers back to work, and terrorize the poor and black folk and others don't really give a shit as long as they don't have to hear complaints too loudly too often.

The protestors want reassurance that policing will be improved.

By and large, protestors in the United States want systems of social control (which is to say policing) curtailed and replaced with systems of social support whenever and wherever possible. Our police have become a law unto themselves with a toxic culture in opposition to the people they theoretically "serve" and "protect"; this is not a problem that can be fixed by merely adjusting laws and regulations or with increased "oversight" and "review"; these have been tried and failed. The organizations themselves need to be disempowered and their personnel removed from situations in which they have the opportunity to harass, assault, and murder people. Also, white supremacists (and those adjacent) must be purged from police organizations (no doubt to the horror of police unions everywhere).

but the BLM article on wikipedia has a timeline of activity that skips the entire year 2019 because things were genuinely that good before covid.

That is remarkably thin reasoning.

 

[tstorm823]

snip

I knew I could count on this group!

 

[lil devils x]

I mean, I didn't insult you. It's just that, without the flag there, I could have sworn you were talking about rich people. What was that about bantz?

I thought it was actually about Trump.

 

[Trunkage]

I thought it was actually about Trump.

Trump's just the best example

Think of some normal big investors. Most literally have no idea what business they own do or could do anything productive in it. The only benefit they could provide is during the start and most investor dont have the knowledge to do that

 

[Iron]

Sure, I have anecdotal sources too, of two friends who came from "peasant" class and were admitted to specialist schools in the USSR because they showed talent.

I'm sure there was corruption and places were taken by the well-connected undeserving, but at least the access was still there. Doesn't matter if you have the talent, bar a tiny proportion of scholarships, you're not going to private schools and the likes of Harvard unless your parents are flush.

When did they serve in the army

I mean, I didn't insult you. It's just that, without the flag there, I could have sworn you were talking about rich people. What was that about bantz?

You're spongebob, and your whole post was a sad attempt at a "No U".

Also, white supremacists (and those adjacent) must be purged from police organizations (no doubt to the horror of police unions everywhere).

Labor Unions for me - but not for thee.
Do you even have self awareness.

 

[Revnak]

Labor Unions for me - but not for thee.
Do you even have self awareness.

No Unions for professional Union busters.
Edit: seriously, the logic here is so purely idealistic. You’re basically saying we should give power to our oppressors to “avoid hypocrisy.” I don’t care about hypocrisy because I live in a real world where defying Platonic ideals doesn’t cause things to explode. Utterly nonsensical.