BLARGH! I IS EVIL!: Villains who were not well fleshed out

Recommended Videos

The_Evermind

New member
Jul 7, 2009
147
0
0
Sauron is looking for his ring so that he wont die and is trying to kill everyone else basically to follow his God, Morgoth (whose backstory is that for all intents and purposes he is the devil and so doesn't need any other backstory).

But, more on topic Baron Harokeen from the Dune series is given extensive backstory and still just tortures and kills people because wait for it ... it's fun. Yeah thats it. In the series defense Erasmus tortures and kills people for a much more acceptable reason.
 

KingPiccolOwned

New member
Jan 12, 2009
1,039
0
0
orannis62 said:
Sovereign from Mass Effect. When asked why he's doing it, he responds that his motives are too complex for puny Commander Shepard to comprehend. Kind of redeemed with Saren, however.
Actually I always thought that the Sovereign and all the others of its kind are essentially trying to rip on the Lovecraftian mythos. A race of beings that exsist in the furthest reaches of space, have existed since before all life, and (supposedly) created themselves. Now that's original (not). Actually though it is a bit esoteric, so I doubt very many would actually make the connection.
EDIT: On that subject I always thought that the Elder Gods of the H.P. Lovecraft novellas were horribly characterized. The official reason for this was that their motivations were so complex that upon hearing the first 1/4 of the full reason for why they were so weird a humans mind would explode in a manner resembling this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEHU7Nv_alE .
However the more obvious reason is that Lovecraft probably couldn't think of any reason himself.
 

swytchblayd

New member
May 28, 2008
241
0
0
Space Spoons said:
swytchblayd said:
~snipped meself~
I always thought his "motivation" was entitlement. For most of his adult life, he was normal, or, as normal as a soldier working for a monopolistic power company can be. Then, he learned that he was the last of some ancient race and that his mother had been the primary subject of a series of experiments upon said race, and promptly climbed up on a pedestal.

I never got the impression that he was out to avenge his mother, because he never gave the impression that he thought his mother was dead. He constantly referred to her as though she were still alive, and given the fact that he sent her to try and kill you many times, he may have been right. Rather, he seemed to be out to destroy the world simply because he thought he had the right to, as the last surviving member of a supposedly superior race.

Now, whether he was actually right about all of this (being the last survivor of an ancient race, being Jenova's genetic son, having a childhood) is a whole 'nother can of worms. Point is, his motivation was still pretty stupid.

"I'll destroy you all because I'm so much better than you that I can wipe out the world with one spell."

Weaksauce.
Agreed with that last bit. But it seemed to me more like Jenova was just reanimated instead of alive. I know they kinda make it out that she never really died, but that's just stupid. You'd think that someone would've gotten the idea to end her pitiful existence at one point along the line... Anyhow, tis still stupid, and she was still weak as fuck in the early confrontations with her, no matter.

OK, maybe he isn't a momma's boy; no momma's boy would make their mother do the dirty work for them. So that leaves him as being a retarded asshole. Not much better.

Also, add the Shinra Corp executives in there for being the poor, dumb bastards to think it up in the first place. At what point did genetically altering a test-tube soldier using an ancient horror sound like a good idea? Kinda the same line of thought as Umbrella Corp's zombie factory.
 

Lord_Of_Plum

New member
Apr 5, 2008
215
0
0
Samuel_of_Saruan said:
Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.


3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.
I don't know if someone has said this already, but the reason ol' Galby is "evil" is because his dragon was killed, and when the other riders refused to give him another one, he got pissed and killed everyone. It's been a long time since I've read the books, and I don't really remember what evil stuff the Empire did, so maybe the rebels just don't like taxes.
 

Nomad

Dire Penguin
Aug 3, 2008
616
0
0
SebZero said:
Well, if you think of the Jedi as a religious group (embracing the light, rejecting the dark as temptation) then there's that genocide.
I'd say the Jedi are terrorists. They tried overthrowing the rightful government, after all. And if flushing out what is perceived as terrorism is evil, then there is no "good" nation in our world either.
 

Queen Michael

has read 4,010 manga books
Jun 9, 2009
10,400
0
0
ajb924 said:
Arlong from One Piece. I understand he wanted to take over a town, but why a little tiny poor one with no exports!? It's not like he couldn't take over something bigger, so why didn't he!?
I suppose he was afraid that if he conquered something bigger the Marines or someone else who's powerful might come after him. After all, he's certainly not the most powerful guy of all, so it's better to stick with something small, which doesn't have any exports the cutting off of which might motivate others to act.
 

SamuelT

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2009
3,324
0
41
Country
Nederland
JoshasorousRex said:
Samuel_of_Saruan said:
Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.

3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.
OK

1: He killed the Dragon Riders because they would not grant him a new dragon when his died so he used dark magic to make a Dragon his. The other Dragon Riders were not corrupt and didn't fight amongst themselves. He managed to get the For Swarm (or whatever the traitors are called) together and they killed all the Dragon Riders

2: After the war he took over Alagaesia and went after the elves and dwarfs. He had the Urgls and a shade (I believe) to spread terror across the land, killing people and using them to bring pain to the people.

3: He made the other Dragon Riders swear loyalty to him. You see once you kill the rider the dragon dies with it's rider so he couldn't have enslaved them. I don't know what you mean by enslaving them but like I said, when the rider dies the Dragon goes with him.
Yuss! Counter-Arguements.

1. He killed them because of a grudge, and they were not corrupt.

I disagree. Yes he killed them because of a grudge, but also for other reasons. Murtaugh and Galby himself said that the old riders were being controlled by elves, doing their bidding and not being the watchers like they should have been. This was probably because so damn many of them were elvish.

2, He used beasts to 'spread terror across the land.

Meh, I haven't seen much terror yet. Only thing from the Urgals was Yazuac (I don't know the spelling) and that was done by the Urgals. There was no evidence that they were under the control of Galby, nor that he had any hand in the attack. The only possible thing what could've been seen as terror spreading was ordering Murtaugh to set that village on fire who protected rebels. Seems fine to me, they help the rebels, they die.

The Shade wasn't really under the control of Galby. Sure, they proclaimed that he was but he still tried to convince Eragon to swear loyalty to the shade instead of the king. Durza was acting by his own agenda, and only did as much for the king as he did because he didn't want to get killed.

3, I can't sum this up in one sentance, so I'll just answer it

I meant the Eldunari. The 'heart of hearts' of the Dragons. They harbored the mind, energy and conciousness of the dragon, even after the body died, they could live on in the gem-like organs. Galby is seen evil because he enslaved the Eldunari after the Dragons did, he collected them and gained unlimited power. And that seemed right to me. When you slay your foes, use their energy for greater purposes.

Now, something I'd like to say:

Christopher is a moderate writer, in my opinion, but he could have done this from the start. He planned this 'heroic view' on Eragon and hide the fact that he is a sociopathic murderer. If he, in the finalé of the final book, showed that Galby is the sane rider, and Eragon suffers from madness (That is why the Varden let him do what he did, they fear a mad rider) that would be an awesome plot-twist.
 

The Commissar

New member
Apr 14, 2009
17
0
0
apsham said:
j0z said:
Now you're just trying too hard. >_>

There was the entire thing with the enslavement of many species, near complete racism against others that led to enslavement or shit living conditions, the building of giant death machines, etc and that's just a few. To say that the Empire was goaded on by the Rebellion is a bit of a stretch.
Any Empire is bad. I've always seen the original Star Wars trilogy as being a big analogy of the American War of Independence anyway, coupled with the fact that a lot of the Imperial Officers are British (because we play the best villains, and we are the best in the world at doing the "Oh fiddlesticks! Thwarted again!" face). The Empire isn't that badly characterised, but it's a mishmash of Imperial enemies from the past (Brits, the Nazis etc.) designed for Americans to hate, rather than being a unique organisation to challenge any perceptions of evil.

Hannibal Lecter was properly scary because I saw a part of me like him, the cracked mirror thing coming up again.
 

Lord George

New member
Aug 25, 2008
2,734
0
0
Most Disney villains come under this, they are evil for no real reason then to be fiendishly evil. Well except for a few like Scar from the lion king, but that's just copying the plot of Hamlet in the first place. (Dear god I'm watching too much Disney, damn babysitting.)
 

Malkavian

New member
Jan 22, 2009
970
0
0
Hawk of Battle said:
Any Bond villain.

Seriously they're all just like, "POWER!", "MONEY!" "MORE POWER!", "MORE MONEY!"

And all stupid as hell, with their overly elaborate deathtraps designed purely for Bond to escape from. In fact I think all the villains are jst intentionally incompetent just so that Bond can look good beating them.
Nah, I can't agree. Not all of them were moneyhoarding, powerhungry jocks. Most of the films villains are connected to SPECTRE or SHMERTZ, and are such simply fulfilling their jobs as part of that organization. Hugo Drax wanted to create a new paradise for the human race. Scaramanga was never really in it for the money - he wanted to test his prowess against the one man he still believed posed a challenge. Karl Stromberg, like Drax, wanted to give the human race a reboot, to save the human race from itself. Elektra King wanted revenge over her father, and take what is rightfully hers, not because of money(she had that already) but ebcause it was her right. Gustav Graves wanted to unite Korea again, thourgh war and conquest, granted, but it was a vision none the less.


Mad Maniac with axe-firing chainsaw said:
The whole of Umbrella Corp. Why are you doing this? Since when did it seem like a good idea to research zombies?

"Yeah, we'll totally be able to turn a profit on killing half a city. Project approved. So, my fellow board members (yes-men) are we in agreement?"

"Yes!"

Makes you wonder who would want to work for umbrella. The job security (in all senses) must be terrible!
That's just being ignorant of the actual plot. While I won't claim to know the entire Resident Evil storyline and background, I know this - Umbrella was founded by three men. They found the progenitor virus, and found it had extraodinary abilities. One wanted to use it for it's regenerative purposes, to help mankind(with profits, of course, but nonetheless...), while the two others saw a potential bioweapon.
Eventually, peace-guy is disposed off, and Umbrella turns to the development of biological weapons. However, following the mansion incident(a field test, that went somewhat wrong), rats from the sewers were accidentally infected with the - and G-virus. Umbrella never meant for Racoon to get infected - it was simply an accident.

So: They researched zombies, because, hell, why not? And in the end, there was profit tp be gained for either creating some kind of revitalizing product, or biological weapons(in the form of the BOW's - tyrant, licker, nemesis, etc.)

They didn't destroy Racoon on purpose - it was simply an accident.

And Umbrella was actually very well fleshed out in the games, I thought.

swytchblayd said:
Space Spoons said:
swytchblayd said:
~snipped meself~
I always thought his "motivation" was entitlement. For most of his adult life, he was normal, or, as normal as a soldier working for a monopolistic power company can be. Then, he learned that he was the last of some ancient race and that his mother had been the primary subject of a series of experiments upon said race, and promptly climbed up on a pedestal.

I never got the impression that he was out to avenge his mother, because he never gave the impression that he thought his mother was dead. He constantly referred to her as though she were still alive, and given the fact that he sent her to try and kill you many times, he may have been right. Rather, he seemed to be out to destroy the world simply because he thought he had the right to, as the last surviving member of a supposedly superior race.

Now, whether he was actually right about all of this (being the last survivor of an ancient race, being Jenova's genetic son, having a childhood) is a whole 'nother can of worms. Point is, his motivation was still pretty stupid.

"I'll destroy you all because I'm so much better than you that I can wipe out the world with one spell."

Weaksauce.
Agreed with that last bit. But it seemed to me more like Jenova was just reanimated instead of alive. I know they kinda make it out that she never really died, but that's just stupid. You'd think that someone would've gotten the idea to end her pitiful existence at one point along the line... Anyhow, tis still stupid, and she was still weak as fuck in the early confrontations with her, no matter.

OK, maybe he isn't a momma's boy; no momma's boy would make their mother do the dirty work for them. So that leaves him as being a retarded asshole. Not much better.

Also, add the Shinra Corp executives in there for being the poor, dumb bastards to think it up in the first place. At what point did genetically altering a test-tube soldier using an ancient horror sound like a good idea? Kinda the same line of thought as Umbrella Corp's zombie factory.
Sorry for the tall quote. Anyway...

IIRC, Sephiroth's reasoning was even dumber. He wanted to fly the planet. Like a spaceship. To conquer space. Nokidding. He wanted to truly become a "god" by gaining direct access to the lifestream, fuel said lifestream with the energy of every living being on earth, and then fly out to conquer space.

Also, IIRC, Jenova had amazing regenerative powers, and was hardly a being alike us. Apparently, individual parts of her, even if seperated from the body, could grow, mutate, and act on it's own, while still being part of Jenova, like an Ant Queen, controlling her ants. When you combat her on the ship, it's only her arm(or something, long ago...) you fight. That's also why all the Robed men are heeding her call - they have part of her inside them, at she is still in control of those parts.

As for SOLDIER not being a good idea... Why the hell not? They had a whole corps of them, and only two of them went AWOL(as far as we know), namely Sephiroth and Zack.
 

Lord RPGs

New member
Jan 31, 2009
138
0
0
Deathstalker's "Munkar". A generic fantasy villain mage ruler person, who both had lecherous ideas of what to do with his power, and had no clue on how to deal with people.

Lechery - Let's grab random villagers, throw them into boob/butt revealing costumes, then let them be basically raped by randoms in the castle!
People - Let's teleport deathstalker not into, say somewhere far, far away/a volcano, but the middle of the village. Then forget to cast spells, and hence, kill him before he nicks my McGuffin.

I probably can't explain it well enough, but really, he has to be seen to be believed.
 

Samurai Goomba

New member
Oct 7, 2008
3,679
0
0
Hiruko from Shinobi for the PS2. I'm pretty sure he just shows up all of a sudden, summons a bunch of evil creatures and acts like a jerk for its own sake.

Likewise, Angra from God Hand doesn't seem to really want anything... Except to kill you. Pity, because he's one of the weakest bosses. I mean, I know he wants freedom, but beyond that... No real motivation. Of course, God Hand is basically a series of fights held together with ridiculously silly plot, funny quips and intentionally-stupid (yet awesome) characters.

Oh, and... Ninja Gaiden, anyone? I haven't played that much of the game yet, but from what I've seen the character motivations are idiotic at best. It's just (from a story standpoint) a big pile of sleazy 80's fantasy characters, like if Heavy Metal were a video game. Don't even get me started on the absurd costuming of Rachel, and her proximity to assorted slimy monsters that just happen to be designed so as to recall various parts of the female and male anatomy.
 

systhicsfg

New member
Oct 1, 2008
139
0
0
Real Gonzo said:
Britannia Empire from Code Geass - All they seemed like were just stereotypical villains
Are you sure that Zero himself is not the villian.. Or is it merely a counterpoint to the fact that very few people are truly heroes. While the Britannian Empire does seem evil it ultimately works towards a perfect world.
GET IN HERE MAX!
Your avatar IS Lelouche...
 

Fraught

New member
Aug 2, 2008
4,418
0
0
oliveira8 said:
Ultimecia from Final Fantasy 8.

"I shall compress Time and destroy all life, for no good reason at all! MUHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH!"
I don't get it too. They must be lonely people if they want to destroy all life on the planet, and could live alone for the rest of their life.
 

Seanchaidh

Elite Member
Legacy
Mar 21, 2009
6,132
3,706
118
Country
United States of America
Nomadic said:
SebZero said:
Well, if you think of the Jedi as a religious group (embracing the light, rejecting the dark as temptation) then there's that genocide.
I'd say the Jedi are terrorists. They tried overthrowing the rightful government, after all. And if flushing out what is perceived as terrorism is evil, then there is no "good" nation in our world either.
The rightful government that took power by... what was it, organizing a mass secession from the Republic and then fighting both sides of that war to be able to declare something like a state of emergency, then killing nearly all the Jedi to avoid any credible threat of opposition? The Rebellion as terrorists is quite a bit of a stretch.
 

Aunel

New member
May 9, 2008
1,927
0
0
Diablo from the diablo series, I have not played through the whole game yet, but from what I have seen is "must conquer world, because I am Diablo"