Final Schmantasy 13

[Quaidis]

I don't have the game yet. Still waiting patiently for Microsoft to force a PC version.

But complaining about a Japanese game having Japanese mannerisms is a tad odd of you.

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

I'm curious, are the Pulsian characters supposed to sound Australian or New Zealandian?

Probably. FFXIII did much the same thing. Every major location featured a different Commonwealth accent.

Dalmasca was canadian, and I don't remember which was which otherwise, but there were Australian, south african and english accents by city as well.

-m

No I mean, WHICH? Clearly they've got an island commonwealth accent. It sounds Kiwi, but my untrained ear can't say for sure.

The sexualization of Vanille is kind of creepy... She's legal right? please tell me she's legal.

She's probably between 14 and 17, likely 17 (but this is a tough call as I'd peg Lightning as being 25 while the game says she's 21). So no, not really legal.

The sexualization of the character is likely caused by what my Girlfriend calls the "Trapped in Highschool" mentality that many Japanese males have. You see as soon as they leave highschool they lose almost any chance to "meet people" because of all those 12 hour work days, 6 hour work weeks and all that binge drinking to cope with it. Hence a lot of Japanese Men end their sexual development somewhere in highschool and hence find highschool mannerisms and the like attractive whereas anyone outside of highschool is likely married or as crushingly devoted to their career as anyone else and hence isn't as sexy as the "carefree" highschooler.

It's just a theory mind you, but it explains a LOT about Japanese Games, Anime and Japanese Pornography. Hell I'm sure a lot of American's have the same issue, hence the prevalence of R-Rated Teen Comedies and Cheerleader Porn.

 

[Sir Ollie]

The sexualization of Vanille is kind of creepy... She's legal right? please tell me she's legal.

She's meant to be 19 but she seems alot younger.

But the truth is...

Spoiler: Only see this if you really want to know

She's actually a few centuries old!

 

[Xshu]

Like, really guys? Are we not beyond this when it comes to more complex, imperfect female characters?

I don't usually do this because it always seems so obnoxious, but I just have to:

 

[wooty]

I think Sazh is the embodyment of what most people would be feeling or thinking in these situations, much like Jonathan in "The Mummy".

But I'm keeping an eye on Vanille, theres more to her than meets the eye in this one, plus shes the narrator. And a red head.....

 

[Onyx Oblivion]

Wow...A Japanese game with Japanese mannerisms.

*dies of shock*

I hate Hope. I like everyone but Hope. 9 hours in...I hate Hope. I hope Hope dies.

Except here's the weird thing. The game doesn't take place in japan does it? It's something I never got. If a game doesn't take place in japan/europe/whereverthefuck then why do the developers include mannerisms specific to that location just because they live there?

It's not like they're in the US with these mannerisms. This is a world they made, they can have whatever mannerisms they want.

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

Wow...A Japanese game with Japanese mannerisms.

*dies of shock*

I hate Hope. I like everyone but Hope. 9 hours in...I hate Hope. I hope Hope dies.

Except here's the weird thing. The game doesn't take place in japan does it? It's something I never got. If a game doesn't take place in japan/europe/whereverthefuck then why do the developers include mannerisms specific to that location just because they live there? It damages what little immersion there might be because these people who live in a world where there is no japan act so japanese it's bizarre rather then putting in just the slightest amount of effort to give their fancy magical land its own culture and mannerisms.

Um... they did that in FF12 and nobody in North America gave a flying whatever, but this time you notice? I dub thee a nitpicker!

 

[Onyx Oblivion]

Wow...A Japanese game with Japanese mannerisms.

*dies of shock*

I hate Hope. I like everyone but Hope. 9 hours in...I hate Hope. I hope Hope dies.

Except here's the weird thing. The game doesn't take place in japan does it? It's something I never got. If a game doesn't take place in japan/europe/whereverthefuck then why do the developers include mannerisms specific to that location just because they live there?

It's not like they're in the US with these mannerisms. This is a world they made, they can have whatever mannerisms they want.

That is the worst defense argument ever next to "I'd like to see you do better." Just thought I'd let you know that. You might as well just shove in an image macro and leave it at that for all it contributes to anything, it means nothing and is just an utter cop-out because you most likely have absolutely nothing to say.

Fine. You want a defense? You got one...

Let's take two RPG developers...Bioware and Square Enix

Not every developers wants to do like Bioware and create incredibly detailed fucking universes down to the last detail. Where you are in life influences you, whether you develop games in Canada or Japan, some things will slip in. Not that Bioware actually does much better at creating universes...Seeing as how every major alien race (ones that you can have in your party/team) is human shaped in Mass Effect. So, not even Bioware tries that hard, actually. Because they don't wanna give you a Hanar in your party and have to program combat movements for each of its tentacles and what-not. And all the alien races still use similar hand gestures to everyone else. Like pointing and whatnot. So, Bioware actually isn't much better after all. Huh. I just taught myself something in this rant.

 

[PedroSteckecilo]

Wow...A Japanese game with Japanese mannerisms.

*dies of shock*

I hate Hope. I like everyone but Hope. 9 hours in...I hate Hope. I hope Hope dies.

Except here's the weird thing. The game doesn't take place in japan does it? It's something I never got. If a game doesn't take place in japan/europe/whereverthefuck then why do the developers include mannerisms specific to that location just because they live there?

It's not like they're in the US with these mannerisms. This is a world they made, they can have whatever mannerisms they want.

That is the worst defense argument ever next to "I'd like to see you do better." Just thought I'd let you know that. You might as well just shove in an image macro and leave it at that for all it contributes to anything, it means nothing and is just an utter cop-out because you most likely have absolutely nothing to say.

Fine. You want a defense? You got one...

Let's take two RPG developers...Bioware and Square Enix

Not every developers wants to do like Bioware and create incredibly detailed fucking universes down to the last detail. Where you are in life influences you, whether you develop games in Canada or Japan, some things will slip in. Not that Bioware actually does much better at creating universes...Seeing as how every major alien race (ones that you can have in your party/team) is human shaped in Mass Effect. So, not even Bioware tries that hard, actually. Because they don't wanna give you a Hanar in your party and have to program combat movements for each of its tentacles and what-not. And all the alien races still use similar hand gestures to everyone else. Like pointing and whatnot. So, Bioware actually isn't much better after all. Huh. I just taught myself something in this rant.

Don't forget all those Western Canadian Accents, apparently Alberta/BC took over the future.

 

[Matt_LRR]

Wow...A Japanese game with Japanese mannerisms.

*dies of shock*

I hate Hope. I like everyone but Hope. 9 hours in...I hate Hope. I hope Hope dies.

Except here's the weird thing. The game doesn't take place in japan does it? It's something I never got. If a game doesn't take place in japan/europe/whereverthefuck then why do the developers include mannerisms specific to that location just because they live there?

It's not like they're in the US with these mannerisms. This is a world they made, they can have whatever mannerisms they want.

That is the worst defense argument ever next to "I'd like to see you do better." Just thought I'd let you know that. You might as well just shove in an image macro and leave it at that for all it contributes to anything, it means nothing and is just an utter cop-out because you most likely have absolutely nothing to say.

Fine. You want a defense? You got one...

Let's take two RPG developers...Bioware and Square Enix

Not every developers wants to do like Bioware and create incredibly detailed fucking universes down to the last detail. Where you are in life influences you, whether you develop games in Canada or Japan, some things will slip in. Not that Bioware actually does much better at creating universes...Seeing as how every major alien race (ones that you can have in your party/team) is human shaped in Mass Effect. So, not even Bioware tries that hard, actually. Because they don't wanna give you a Hanar in your party and have to program combat movements for each of its tentacles and what-not. And all the alien races still use similar hand gestures to everyone else. Like pointing and whatnot. So, Bioware actually isn't much better after all. Huh. I just taught myself something in this rant.

Don't forget all those Western Canadian Accents, apparently Alberta/BC took over the future.

We also ruled dalmasca.

and cocoon, for that matter.

-m

 

[x0ny]

I finally got to play a little bit last night and an hour today, took the ps3 to work ^^. I already hate vanille, she is the kind of girl I despise the most, overy girly, annoying voice, extravagant dress code, she's like the female version of Tidus, a fucking prick. The one thing I don't like is the datalog, why make me read background info to understand the story of the game. This stuff used to be given in a cutscene. Not a big deal though, just takes me away from the gameplay for about 5 minutes.

 

[CmdrGoob]

snip

Like, really guys? Are we not beyond this when it comes to more complex, imperfect female characters?

-m

I don't see that. Lightning is comparable to Cloud and Squall, and I've seen plenty of people who dislike both of those characters and call them jerks and douchebags. The fact that a comparable number of people dislike Lightning, who is a similar character, and call her a ***** is completely unsuprising and positing sexism to explain it seems like entirely unnecessary posturing about 'oh sexist gamers', especially when Lightning goes even further with being a jerk to the point of actually punching her companions.

 

[TsunamiWombat]

I'm curious, are the Pulsian characters supposed to sound Australian or New Zealandian?

Probably. FFXIII did much the same thing. Every major location featured a different Commonwealth accent.

Dalmasca was canadian, and I don't remember which was which otherwise, but there were Australian, south african and english accents by city as well.

-m

No I mean, WHICH? Clearly they've got an island commonwealth accent. It sounds Kiwi, but my untrained ear can't say for sure.

The sexualization of Vanille is kind of creepy... She's legal right? please tell me she's legal.

She's probably between 14 and 17, likely 17 (but this is a tough call as I'd peg Lightning as being 25 while the game says she's 21). So no, not really legal.

The sexualization of the character is likely caused by what my Girlfriend calls the "Trapped in Highschool" mentality that many Japanese males have. You see as soon as they leave highschool they lose almost any chance to "meet people" because of all those 12 hour work days, 6 hour work weeks and all that binge drinking to cope with it. Hence a lot of Japanese Men end their sexual development somewhere in highschool and hence find highschool mannerisms and the like attractive whereas anyone outside of highschool is likely married or as crushingly devoted to their career as anyone else and hence isn't as sexy as the "carefree" highschooler.

It's just a theory mind you, but it explains a LOT about Japanese Games, Anime and Japanese Pornography. Hell I'm sure a lot of American's have the same issue, hence the prevalence of R-Rated Teen Comedies and Cheerleader Porn.

That makes a disturbing amount of sense. Highschool is the last place where alot of people really socialize in either country. We also idealize highschool because we didn't have to work.

 

[Quiet Stranger]

I find it really interesting how people, (particularly males) perceive the flawed female protagonist. It seems to me there continues to be an underlying thread of sexism in the gaming population, and while it doesn?t surprise me at all, it is curious and worth of note.

The last two Final Fantasy games have both featured a very strong, but flawed female lead. In the case of XII It was Ashe ? a dethroned monarch, noble, but power hungry, and willing to do nearly anything to see her nation restored. She was disinterested in romance, having lost her husband, and only sort of put up with Vaan and Penlo to the extent that they had something to offer her in terms of support on her quest. For much of the game, Vaan and Penelo were kids, tagging along with the grownups, and only included as much as they were useful.

In XIII Lightning is (so far as I?ve gotten) a very driven, but very grounded character. She?s been dealt a bad hand, her sister has been (as far as she?s concerned) killed, and she clearly blames herself for that (though she directs much of that anger at Snow [though only when he?s talking about how he can fix everything and essentially rubbing in Lighning?s failure]). She is aware of the situation, powerful, and willing to do whatever it takes to get the job done. She?s in the moment to be sure ? thinking less about how to make everything better, and more about how to survive the present ordeal, but she?s the party?s tie to reality, she?s not off in space thinking about how she can be the hero; she is very aware that as far as anyone outside the party is concerned they are public enemy #1 and that is the most pressing concern.


Both of these characters are complex, interesting, flawed, and believable. And both were taken by the gaming audience at large to be ?total bitches?.

I think this is a phenomenon worthy of note and consideration. Particularly since I think the perception of the characters would flip entirely into the positive if Lightning were a man.

For Example:

2. I hope Snow beats the ever-loving shit out of lightning becasue she needs a beating. I mean the guy is trying to save your SISTER for crying out loud and all you'd rather do is have periods and punch people

I get the feeling that the scene in chapter 3 would have been interpreted differently if both characters had been guys. People seem to be taking it as lightning being a giant ***** to snow ? but consider the context. Lightning is a soldier and powerful fighter. She was unable to save her sister. Then some untrained upstart comes along and talks about how he?s going to save her and bring her back. Lightning sees this as an insult. TI?s not about him saving her sister, it?s about the fact that she never expected snow to be able to protect her, and she hates the fact that she herself couldn?t. She can?t see any way that she could possibly undo what?s been done, and snow claiming that he will is, to her, an impossibility.

If they were both guys, the ?she isn?t protected now, is she? line would have been eseen entirely differently. It wouldn?t be ?No one can save her, and I blame you for what happened because I?m a *****? it would be ?back the fuck off, If anyone?s going to save her it?s going to be me, if you want to come along for the ride, feel free?. In the hands of a male, that scene is powerful, proactive and assertive. In the hands of a female it?s perceived as domineering, irrational and bitchy.

Is that fair? I really don?t think so. The implication that Lighting wants to be in control is clearly there in that scene, and the subtext of the scene is clearly the second scenario ? but because she?s a woman it?s much more emotionally complex, it?s not just two dudes and their conflicting machismo.

It's Lightning's harshness that gives off more of a Cloud vibe to me than an Ashe; but to be fair I didn't finish 12 so I'm not as familiar with Ms. Dalmasca as I am Mr. Eiffel Tower Hair.

Mr. Funk here is quite right ? there is a lot of Cloud in Lightning, and she is harsh (as was cloud) ? but there?s an underlying complexity in both characters. In Cloud, that was a positive. In Lightning people seem to be just overlooking it and writing her off.

besides that Cloud wasnt a jerkish dickhead who slapped his friends (Chapter 3).

Also Lightning is a total ***** and Snow lets her do too much to him (her being Lightning)

Lightning is worse than Cloud as far as personality. Cloud was crass but atleast he had some cocky swagger to back it up, Lightning is just cold and bitchy.

Like, really guys? Are we not beyond this when it comes to more complex, imperfect female characters?

-m

Well, she IS a *****, she's a cold hearted *****, not just to Snow but to everyone (except Serah)

 

[Citizen.Erased]

Combat is enjoyable, everything else is shit.
I mean the graphics are pretty and stuff, nice swishy hair, but the characters are unbearable and I skipped about 3/4 of the cutscenes because there are way too much of them and as I previously said, everyone pisses me off.

BUT! this is a final fantasy game afterall and it is what I expected when I picked it up and I'm now just having fun with the nice turn-based combat and that is enough for me.

ps. I wish we'd have a full adult cast just once, i'm sick of pretty 14 year old boys.
also, jesus who the fuck chooses names because I think he should get fired. Vanille is a french name (not really, because no one is stupid enough to name their kid that), yet that girl is possibly japanese with an english accent. make up your mind square enix.

 

[TsunamiWombat]

Combat is enjoyable, everything else is shit.
I mean the graphics are pretty and stuff, nice swishy hair, but the characters are unbearable and I skipped about 3/4 of the cutscenes because there are way too much of them and as I previously said, everyone pisses me off.

BUT! this is a final fantasy game afterall and it is what I expected when I picked it up and I'm now just having fun with the nice turn-based combat and that is enough for me.

ps. I wish we'd have a full adult cast just once, i'm sick of pretty 14 year old boys.
also, jesus who the fuck chooses names because I think he should get fired. Vanille is a french name (not really, because no one is stupid enough to name their kid that), yet that girl is possibly japanese with an english accent. make up your mind square enix.

I think your missing the point if your skipping the cutscenes...