K, so, japanese game devs hate us now?

[LilithSlave]

I m saying that it's kind of silly to say that we are xenophobic in a direct comparison to a country who is MORE xenophobic. It makes the statement not only meaningless, but outright wrong.

And no one is saying we are xenophobic and Japan is not.

Both countries have a variety of people.

Though I still don't think your claim that Japan hates our games has much weight. Skyrim did pretty well in Japan and a lot of mods, as usual, are from there.

 

[AyaReiko]

"now"? Under what rock did you live the past years? Even as someone who doesn't really care for most japanese games I saw this trend ~6 years ago.

This. They went from owning about half of market to struggling to hold onto a tenth of it. (And a fifth of that is Nintendo's alone.)

The problems with Japanese games are numerous... I'll just give the bullet points.

*Xenophobic market. Not us. THEM. Just look at what sells well over there as opposed to anywhere else in the world. Japanese players buy strictly japanese-made games with the exception of maybe 2 or 3 token non-jp games.

*With western games all but shut out of the jp market, jp devs obviously stayed with genres that sold in Japan, totally unaware as to which genres were really dominating the global market. Virtually all attempts made by Japanese devs to reach the global market (without relying on old franchises) has largely failed, due to a lack of experience and failing to understand the audience.

*The devs have lagged WAAAY behind tech-wise. While western devs moved on to HD gaming and the like, jp devs opted to stay behind with PS2 level of graphics. The West has long since figured out how to make things graphically impressive while keeping costs down. Japan has not, and dev costs has ballooned while playing catch-up.

*Zero QA. Only Nintendo has been known to use playtesting prior to release.

 

[TehCookie]

Western games are doing well over there, not as well as native games but they seem to be doing better than foreign games here. As for consoles, people like to support local businesses. I live in Flint so everyone drives a GM, they don't hate other cars they just wanted to try to help the industry (it's still shit though).

Ok, prove it because I find that completely unbelievable. Even when Microsoft made 2 JRPG's so they could increase 360 sales the Japanese showed little interest. Why then would I believe they are buying more western games (on other consoles) than we buy of their game here?

Depends on whether or now you include Nintendo. I excluded them since they mostly focus on a casual market, but if you did include them then we would be buying more.
I just compared:
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/USA/[/link] to
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/Japan/[/link]

You can point out how it's only the top 100 or say Nintendo is important, but at least provide other proof for your point if you think that's a bad source. The only non Nintendo Japanese game on there is Marvel vs Capcom at 86. Japans list has CoD at 35 along with two others. Though that list did make me realize how xenophobic both countries are.

 

[LilithSlave]

I hate the anime art style.

Well, I love it.

I became a fan of anime when I was a small kid because I enjoyed the art style in video games I played back then. And I go back to playing anime games a lot of times, because I want to play an anime for a change, instead of watching it(non-interactive media of any kind, gets boring after a while). And there's hardly a way for me to get sick of anime or particularly Japanese influenced games because there's less of them being made anymore. Or at least ported to West. Because there's not enough of an industry for it anymore, the West has started to take it's own and expel Eastern influences in one of the few global media that had an Eastern influence.

I may be a bit of a bitter minority, but I want what I like to at least do just as well as the things I don't. Which they are not. I shouldn't have to want to give up enjoying anime inspired games when, I loved that as a kid so much, they turned me into anime fan. What are anime fans supposed to do, stop playing video games and spend all their money on anime and manga? Video games have always been a part of the anime and manga family, so to speak. But one member of that family, anime, is dying right now. As a person who is a fan of anime, Japanese video games on the downturn makes me just as sad as Japanese comics being on the downturn would be. And as a fan of all three, I have to say that Japanese games are the most fulfilling of the three. Because they are actually interactive. jRPGs seem to take everyone one likes about a typical anime, and multiply it by giving you the ability to have more than situation and shake things up.

I'd hate to just have to buy anime DVDs to get my anime fix when I enjoy it in video games much better. But with the direction things are moving, I may have to someday.

[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/Japan/[/link]

72
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception (PS3)
Sony Computer Entertainment, Action
9 167,169 167,169
76
Call of Duty: Black Ops
Call of Duty: Black Ops (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
59 161,600 385,839
35
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
7 315,559 315,559
Well, would you look at that.

 

[Mahoshonen]

If you love Japan so much, why don't you move there? :smug:

 

[Mahoshonen]

72
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception (PS3)
Sony Computer Entertainment, Action
9 167,169 167,169
76
Call of Duty: Black Ops
Call of Duty: Black Ops (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
59 161,600 385,839
35
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
7 315,559 315,559
Well, would you look at that.

Wow, way to be completely disingenuous. The games you listed as "Japanese Made" are all made by Western developers. And both Sony and Square Enix are so international in scope that calling them "Japanese" is something of a stretch.

 

[kaioshade]

"now"? Under what rock did you live the past years? Even as someone who doesn't really care for most japanese games I saw this trend ~6 years ago.

*Zero QA. Only Nintendo has been known to use playtesting prior to release.

Skyrim says hi.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

They need to update their game design. They are lagging behind because, like the Anime industry, an emphasis is put on quantity over quality. They make games on shoestring budgets that are mass produced, and manage to homogenize the entire jrpg subgenre. There are a few standouts, but there are so many that are just bland and forgettable.

 

[Epona]

I m saying that it's kind of silly to say that we are xenophobic in a direct comparison to a country who is MORE xenophobic. It makes the statement not only meaningless, but outright wrong.

And no one is saying we are xenophobic and Japan is not.

Both countries have a variety of people.

Though I still don't think your claim that Japan hates our games has much weight. Skyrim did pretty well in Japan and a lot of mods, as usual, are from there.

Skyrim sold well everywhere, did it outsell all the Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest games we have bought (to say nothing of all the other Japanese games)?

 

[Epona]

Western games are doing well over there, not as well as native games but they seem to be doing better than foreign games here. As for consoles, people like to support local businesses. I live in Flint so everyone drives a GM, they don't hate other cars they just wanted to try to help the industry (it's still shit though).

Ok, prove it because I find that completely unbelievable. Even when Microsoft made 2 JRPG's so they could increase 360 sales the Japanese showed little interest. Why then would I believe they are buying more western games (on other consoles) than we buy of their games here?

So wait, because Microsoft funded the development of two JRPGs which sold ok, but not brilliantly, that's now proof that Japan hates Western games?

I'm glad you can see the logic in that statement, because I sure as fuck can't see any.

Microsoft published two JRPGs for the 360, Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon. Blue Dragon was overwhelmingly met with average/negative reviews, meaning its lack of sales can quite easily be chalked up to lack of perceived quality on the part of gamers. Just like how any negatively received game will generally tank in sales.

You're essentially saying that the inclusion on one decent JRPG among countless games like Gears Of War and Halo is all the reason Japan needed to start buying the 360 in droves? Again, logic, I see none. Especially when the PS3 was initially banking on the appeal of having the next Final Fantasy game, which is something of a big deal in Japan's gaming community.

I am using those two games as examples of how difficult it is to get the Japanese to buy American games and consoles but you twist it any way you like.

 

[LilithSlave]

Wow, way to be completely disingenuous. The games you listed as "Japanese Made" are all made by Western developers. And both Sony and Square Enix are so international in scope that calling them "Japanese" is something of a stretch.

Errr, what? I was using them against the claim that Japan is prejudiced against Western games.

If you love Japan so much, why don't you move there? :smug:

I seriously hope that wasn't directed at me, either.

I think Japan is a terrible country and I would never want to live there. I just like their games.

Japan is not an anime-esque jRPG. It is a country so hard to work in many work themselves to DEATH, or kill themselves out of shame or general misery, the bullying is schools is some of the worst in the world, and thousands of people who never leave their house because they're scared of the real world. The gaming industry in Japan is also very oppressed and gamers are thought of as otaku, rather than in the West, where gamers are thought of as fairly normal.

It's the more minor things, like the status quo of the gaming industry here today, that annoy me. I think if one of the few things you have to complain about a culture, is it's pop culture, you're doing pretty well.

 

[Epona]

Western games are doing well over there, not as well as native games but they seem to be doing better than foreign games here. As for consoles, people like to support local businesses. I live in Flint so everyone drives a GM, they don't hate other cars they just wanted to try to help the industry (it's still shit though).

Ok, prove it because I find that completely unbelievable. Even when Microsoft made 2 JRPG's so they could increase 360 sales the Japanese showed little interest. Why then would I believe they are buying more western games (on other consoles) than we buy of their game here?

Depends on whether or now you include Nintendo. I excluded them since they mostly focus on a casual market, but if you did include them then we would be buying more.
I just compared:
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/USA/[/link] to
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/Japan/[/link]

You can point out how it's only the top 100 or say Nintendo is important, but at least provide other proof for your point if you think that's a bad source. The only non Nintendo Japanese game on there is Marvel vs Capcom at 86. Japans list has CoD at 35 along with two others. Though that list did make me realize how xenophobic both countries are.

Of course I would include Nintendo, are they not Japanese all of a sudden?

The thing is, the entire video game industry was ruled by the Japanese until last gen. Sega, Nintendo and Sony were the only real players until Microsoft came along and even last gen Microsoft was in last place. This gen Nintendo, a Japanese company is in first place so unless the Japanese are buying all the damn games and console then I would say that everyone is buying more Japanese consoles and games.

 

[Epona]

Wow, way to be completely disingenuous. The games you listed as "Japanese Made" are all made by Western developers. And both Sony and Square Enix are so international in scope that calling them "Japanese" is something of a stretch.

Errr, what? I was using them against the claim that Japan is prejudiced against Western games.

If you love Japan so much, why don't you move there? :smug:

I seriously hope that wasn't directed at me, either.

I think Japan is a terrible country and I would never want to live there. I just like their games.

Japan is not an anime-esque jRPG. It is a country so hard to work in many work themselves to DEATH, or kill themselves out of shame or general misery, the bullying is schools is some of the worst in the world, and thousands of people who never leave their house because they're scared of the real world. The gaming industry in Japan is also very oppressed and gamers are thought of as otaku, rather than in the West, where gamers are thought of as fairly normal.

Out of curiosity, why do you think Japan is a terrible country?

 

[LilithSlave]

Because of the reasons I just stated that you quoted.

Japan is an incredibly stressful society for children and adults alike.

 

[Erttheking]

Because everyone bashes games like final fantasy for being about angsty teenagers fighting Satan, that's why.

 

[Epona]

Because of the reasons I just stated that you quoted.

Japan is an incredibly stressful society for children and adults alike.

Have you been there?

 

[AyaReiko]

72
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception
Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception (PS3)
Sony Computer Entertainment, Action
9 167,169 167,169
76
Call of Duty: Black Ops
Call of Duty: Black Ops (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
59 161,600 385,839
35
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3
Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 (PS3)
Square Enix, Shooter
7 315,559 315,559
Well, would you look at that.

Try harder on the research. Both COD games are Activision titles. And Uncharted 3 is from Sony Computer Enterainment America.

 

[TehCookie]

Western games are doing well over there, not as well as native games but they seem to be doing better than foreign games here. As for consoles, people like to support local businesses. I live in Flint so everyone drives a GM, they don't hate other cars they just wanted to try to help the industry (it's still shit though).

Ok, prove it because I find that completely unbelievable. Even when Microsoft made 2 JRPG's so they could increase 360 sales the Japanese showed little interest. Why then would I believe they are buying more western games (on other consoles) than we buy of their game here?

Depends on whether or now you include Nintendo. I excluded them since they mostly focus on a casual market, but if you did include them then we would be buying more.
I just compared:
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/USA/[/link] to
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/Japan/[/link]

You can point out how it's only the top 100 or say Nintendo is important, but at least provide other proof for your point if you think that's a bad source. The only non Nintendo Japanese game on there is Marvel vs Capcom at 86. Japans list has CoD at 35 along with two others. Though that list did make me realize how xenophobic both countries are.

Of course I would include Nintendo, are they not Japanese all of a sudden?

The thing is, the entire video game industry was ruled by the Japanese until last gen. Sega, Nintendo and Sony were the only real players until Microsoft came along and even last gen Microsoft was in last place. This gen Nintendo, a Japanese company is in first place so unless the Japanese are buying all the damn games and console then I would say that everyone is buying more Japanese consoles and games.

I was referring to "hardcore" games, not things like wii sports and nintendogs. Nintendo blows everyone out of the water with their sales. Now if only I could find out how popular bejeweled and plants vs zombies were over there.

 

[Epona]

Western games are doing well over there, not as well as native games but they seem to be doing better than foreign games here. As for consoles, people like to support local businesses. I live in Flint so everyone drives a GM, they don't hate other cars they just wanted to try to help the industry (it's still shit though).

Ok, prove it because I find that completely unbelievable. Even when Microsoft made 2 JRPG's so they could increase 360 sales the Japanese showed little interest. Why then would I believe they are buying more western games (on other consoles) than we buy of their game here?

Depends on whether or now you include Nintendo. I excluded them since they mostly focus on a casual market, but if you did include them then we would be buying more.
I just compared:
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/USA/[/link] to
[link]http://www.vgchartz.com/yearly/2011/Japan/[/link]

You can point out how it's only the top 100 or say Nintendo is important, but at least provide other proof for your point if you think that's a bad source. The only non Nintendo Japanese game on there is Marvel vs Capcom at 86. Japans list has CoD at 35 along with two others. Though that list did make me realize how xenophobic both countries are.

Of course I would include Nintendo, are they not Japanese all of a sudden?

The thing is, the entire video game industry was ruled by the Japanese until last gen. Sega, Nintendo and Sony were the only real players until Microsoft came along and even last gen Microsoft was in last place. This gen Nintendo, a Japanese company is in first place so unless the Japanese are buying all the damn games and console then I would say that everyone is buying more Japanese consoles and games.

I was referring to "hardcore" games, not things like wii sports and nintendogs. Nintendo blows everyone out of the water with their sales. Now if only I could find out how popular bejeweled and plants vs zombies were over there.

Not including Nintendo because they blow everyone out of the water seems a bit dishonest. I mean, why would we limit this to hardcore games?