Mass Effect 3 being 'tweaked' for a larger market - EA.

[lapan]

I call it, in mass effect 3 the reapers and you travel back in time and the whole game will just be a realistic military shooter for 75% of the game ;P

 

[Saulkar]

Oh. Dear. God.

Thinking of economic implications is why the human race cant have nice things. Like space travel.

*Rant incoming*

To the tards in charge: We dont want an interactive movie, or a multiplayer FPS. We want a strong shooter-RPG with a signature Bioware storyline. Like ME1, but better, because ME2 felt like an interactive movie with over the shoulder shooting sections thrown into it. Not that the shooting mechanics werent an improvement (Good God they were!)... its just that ME2 lost ME1's enormous sense of scope in a vast alien galaxy. At no stage in ME2 did I park my Mako and look up at an alien, hostile sky and think... FUUUUUCK: this is beautiful and I feel tiny and insignificant and OH FUCK Earth so small and precious and SHIT Saren and the Reapers are coming to wipe us the fuck out.

Dumbing down and playing to the lowest common denominator isn't a good way to retain moments like that. I dont want a Call of Duty clone in spaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace. Dear Bioware, we love you, but play to your strengths. Dear EA and shareholders, without you this enormous enterprise is impossible, and for that we thank you. Trust Bioware, let them do their thing and the fans will come- hell, I've bought three versions of ME1 and two of ME2. But if you mistreat us again, eat shit and die.

*Rant over*

Email this to Bioware and E.A. my good sir or I will set your chair on fire and steal your Nyan Cat. :3

 

[Zeraki]

Can't say I'm surprised. 'Tis EA after all. I'm just sad that they seem to be running Bioware into the ground.

It's EA.

I've never resorted to using such language during times of distraught and anguish, but here it goes.

Mass Effect is FUCKED.

Another franchise bites the dust.

Great speculation. Now all you have to do is wait for the game to actually come out so you can be proven right/wrong. I'm going to assume the latter. You do realize that DA and ME are worked on by two different teams, right?

If anything, the delay was so ME3 wouldn't make some of the mistakes DA2 did, so I'm hopeful.

Most say DA2's issues were because it tried to appeal to a much broader audience. EA is saying they're going to make ME3 appeal to a broader audience. Since EA's the ones with the money, and is known for doing stupid things, its kind of hard for me to be hopeful...

Dragon Age 2's issues came from its ridiculously short development time(whether BioWare or EA is to blame for that, I do not know). Considering what they managed in the short time they had, it was a good game. And now I'm going to get ripped to pieces because I had the audacity to enjoy Dragon Age 2.

I actually enjoyed it as well. I was pretty disappointed at the lack of polish, but I admire it for trying something different with the story and not using Bioware's standard stuff.

Thank you, that was honestly not the response I was expecting. And I agree with you wholeheartedly. If only the game had at least another year of development it could have been even better.

 

[Always_Remain]

We don't really know that many things about ME3 and the things we do know are either little things or vague at best . . . SO THAT MEANS BIOWARE IS DEAD AND EA POISONED THEM! HOW DARE THEY CHANGE THINGS/TRY TO MAKE BETTER GAMES. HOW DARE THEY POTENTIALLY FAIL. OH? DID I SAY POTENTIALLY? FUCK THAT! I ALREADY KNOW THEY FAILED! HOW DO I KNOW THEY ALREADY FAILED? BECAUSE DA2 WAS AVERAGE SO THAT MUST MEAN ME3 WILL BE GARBAGE! JUST BECAUSE ONE GAME WAS AVERAGE AND ME2 WASN'T THE SAME EXACT THING AS ME1 MEANS EVERYTHING BIOWARE DOES NOW IS SHIT! ALL THANKS TO EA! EA'S AND BIOWARE'S HEADQUARTERS SHOULD BURN AND THEY SHOULD BOTH GO BANKRUPT SO PEOPLE WILL LOSE THEIR JOBS JUST BECAUSE I THINK THEIR GAME WAS BAD! FUUUUUU- . . . *starts frothing at mouth and has a seizure induced by hatred*

In other words Escapist, CALM. DOWN. Sure this sounds bad but we don't exactly know what this means. Maybe when we get a few more details all this Bioware cursing will be justified but for now I think we all need to relax a little. The worst thing I've seen is Ashley's redesign but there's only one photo of that so it's not really enough to judge. (I approve of Kaiden's)

Spoiler: A photo with the Ashley redesign

I found it in the thread about the delay over at the Bioware forums. [link]http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/129/index/7294706/3http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/129/index/7294706/3[/link]

 

[kelevra]

2. Personally, I DONT'T want "Bioware's signature storyline". Because, and I am in the minority about this, Bioware storylines are awful. They are good for video games, don't get me wrong - but that's like saying "fast for a turtle". Song of Ice and Fire is a good fantasy storyline. Solaris (by Lem) is a good science fiction storyline (OK, best of all time, but you get my point). I want something of similar quality from the medium, I don't want Bioware's cookie-cutter template-based writing to be considered good.

@ Volkov:

You brought up Lem! You're right sir, we're easily impressed by game story sci fi storylines. Its no Ender's Game or Dune. But... I like it. It's kitschy... a 'so bad it's good' kinda presentation. But otherwise, I digress... Bioware let me feel like I was on an alien planet. There's more to storyline than just the plot, and at that moment, Bioware were storytelling Gods. ME1 sucked me in. And we're gonna lose more and more of that if they dumb it down.

As for your 'there are more of them argument'... its sad but true.

I pretend to myself that buying multiple copies (regular + collectors edition) might change things... but then, I cant exactly send a FUCK YOU note to EA and Bioware's dumber devs for ME2 and a I FUCKING LOVED THIS BIT HERE! DO IT AGAIN! note to Bioware for ME1.

 

[Canadish]

Oh no! They are delaying Mass Effect 3... to make it worse?

I really don't see any logic in this thread. It has only been delayed a couple of months, which in relation to how many months they already intended to spend in development means nothing. Chances are if Mass Effect 3 sucks, it is not due to this minor change, it's because it was going to suck from the get-go.

But we all know it is not going to suck. Relax.

Read what the EA guy says carefully. He's saying they're using the extra time to shift the focus of gameplay for a broader audience.
And "broader audience" translates to 12 year old COD fanboys and the same kind of people who thought Transformers 2 was "awesome".

It will be "better" for that kind of player. It will be worse for those looking for quest variety beyond "Murder all the dudes brah!"

 

[infohippie]

I think that a lot of you are reading this the wrong way.

Marketing the ME universe to a wider audience is exactly what the series needs. I love the ME series, but it has been essentially a pendulum for me. Too much RPG in ME1 at the expense of combat, and too much TPS in ME2 at the expense of meaningful character development or story. Both games have had their detractors for this very reason. If in ME3 they end up striking a balance, which the fist hints from Gameinformer seem to have indicated, then this might be the "wider audience" that they are hoping to court- keeping the RPG'ers and shooters happy with a middle ground will be just what the series needs.

I can't see that working. Shooter fans will still complain there's too much dialogue to click through when they just wanna go out and shoot someone in the face then teabag his corpse. RPG fans will be annoyed at how limited the game is. I mean, I thought ME1 was a bit RPG-lite. ME2 had hardly any RPG at all. What I'd prefer to see for ME3 would be more like Baldur's Gate in space. I know it's not gonna be like that, though, but as long as it's not too heavily tilted in the shooter direction I will probably enjoy it.
I think most of the complaints from the RPG end are mainly due to the fact that nobody develops with us in mind any more (except maybe CD Projekt), but shooter fans already get their pure shooters, by the truckload. Why does nobody make pure RPGs with a space opera setting? Why does hardly anybody make pure RPGs at all any more? It's not like there isn't a market there.

 

[Bobbity]

So they're going to Dragon Age II it?

Fuck.

Who wants to buy the torches and pitchforks?

Looking at Dragon Age 2's sales, I think that they'll be taking the opposite approach, and have made this change to the game so as to avoid everything wrong with DA2. If anything can motivate EA, it's money.

Also, there are two different Bioware studios at work on the DA and ME franchises, so what happens to one doesn't necessarily reflect on what's going to happen to the other.

 

[Fanboy]

Oh no! They are delaying Mass Effect 3... to make it worse?

I really don't see any logic in this thread. It has only been delayed a couple of months, which in relation to how many months they already intended to spend in development means nothing. Chances are if Mass Effect 3 sucks, it is not due to this minor change, it's because it was going to suck from the get-go.

But we all know it is not going to suck. Relax.

Read what the EA guy says carefully. He's saying they're using the extra time to shift the focus of gameplay for a broader audience.
And "broader audience" translates to 12 year old COD fanboys and the same kind of people who thought Transformers 2 was "awesome".

It will be "better" for that kind of player. It will be worse for those looking for quest variety beyond "Murder all the dudes brah!"

I hate COD as much as the next person, but I will admit its gameplay is way more refined than any game Bioware has released. Developers don't take extra time to change story elements or RPG elements, they take that time to refine gameplay.

I found ME2's gameplay to be a vast improvement from the first game, and you could argue they were tweaking it for a larger market there to. Even then the gameplay wasn't up to par with similar third person shooters like Gears of War, which despite it's terrible story, characters and everything else, had very tight gameplay. So there is always room for improvement.

 

[kelevra]

Casey Hudson has said that ME3 will invariably be compared to the top shooters on the market, such as COD and GOW and the way in which they deliver action to the player.

But WHY? Mass Effect is meant to be an RPG series, not a goddamn shooter! In no way should it be compared to the top shooters, it isn't one. It should be compared to Dragon Age, KOTOR, even The Witcher. Those are it's peers, not bloody Call of Doody.

Exactly.

EA. Murder of IP's, slaughterer of franchises, the chopping block of all games, & the bane of quality.
We need to find out exactly the executive that called his order down so we know who to lynch.

Okay, lets keep our perspectives here... Bioware has indeed mentioned that ME3 is going to be more RPG-ey. Weapon customisation is back (yay!)

I think that this is an ideal time for a discussion on PIRACY lads I'm gonna try this one before I buy it. Have done this in the past, with CnC3- I liked it, and bought an actual copy. If I dont like ME3... I'm gonna go a step beyond lynching the EA guys involved- I'm gonna punch them right in the dick and I'm gonna withold my damn money. And STILL play the game. In fact, I'll keep the game. Then slag it off in forums the world over.

Ahh, the impotent rage of the interwebs. At least I can hit back with my wallet.

Dear Bioware: Dont fuck this up. If you dont, you'll have my bussiness- but more- you'll have my undying fandom

 

[Saint Anaeis]

seriously if Bioware and/or EA fuck ME3 up, Violence will ensue.

 

[demotion1]

I do not see the problem. Dragon Age 2 was obviously rushed and now they are delaying Mass Effect 3 so that they can polish it. It feels that they are learning from their mistakes to me. Besides, marketing guys are a bunch of liars why would anybody care what they say?

 

[PurpleLeafRave]

This COULD mean adding multiplayer. You never know.

 

[BemaniAK]

I think this can be taken a different way.
When you look at DA2, they simplified so much and cut so many corners it's not even funny, as a result it barely broke 1 million on console (Dragon Age: Origins sold almost 3.3 Million on Consoles alone)

When you look at it, Dragon Age Origins is their most successful title (On console, thanks for abandoning PC, NPD, faggots) and it is their most "RPG" title in the current generation.
When you really look at it, EA isn't run by a bunch of monkeys, I honestly do believe that the audience they want, is the RPG audience.
ME2 was simplified, less RPG, less talking, more corridor shooting, it didn't significantly increase sales on the Xbox (Where the majority of CoD kids are lurking, the numbers don't lie)
They tried it with DA2, and it was a blunder.

If ME3 is even more of a shooter and less of an RPG, I won't even be mad (Okay maybe a little...... Okay, I'll probably break a wall) I will laugh, and laugh, and laugh, and laugh.
Delaying a game to come out AFTER the holiday season just to casualize it which HAS NOT WORKED BEFORE, is downright RETARDED. Plain and simple.

 

[Legion]

Why do all these companies keep signing up with EA, all they care about is the money. It's one thing to want success, but it's quite another to want it at the expense of the satisfaction of your customers.

 

[Still Life]

Casey Hudson has said that ME3 will invariably be compared to the top shooters on the market, such as COD and GOW and the way in which they deliver action to the player.

But WHY? Mass Effect is meant to be an RPG series, not a goddamn shooter! In no way should it be compared to the top shooters, it isn't one. It should be compared to Dragon Age, KOTOR, even The Witcher. Those are it's peers, not bloody Call of Doody.

ME is a RPG/Shooter hybrid. Bioware have stated this from ME1.

Two things:

1. Tightening up the shooter mechanics doesn't mean Bioware are ignoring the RPG aspects.

2. As I said prior, Bioware have released info that states the inclusion of richer RPG features and emphasis on story.

This implies that the Mass Effect series has a strong role-playing element. It does not. They also said the same stuff with ME2. Didn't turn out like they said it would.

Contrary to popular belief, stats =/= RPG. Being able to shape the protagonist into what you want, and able to influence the world/universe is. You can't do that in Mass Effect. You are Shepard, and no matter what you try to do, your playing as Shepard. ME1 had very bare-bone RPG elements. Most likely to set up stuff to happen in the sequels. ME2 didn't really deliver on your choices. Most were regulated to email/news stories, others were just small conversations.

This is in direct contrast to games like The Witcher, Alpha Protocol, and to a lesser extent New Vegas. Where your control over the character and his/her ability to influence the world is pretty impressive.

Not saying Mass Effect's ways of doing things are bad, not at all. But when they promise more "RPG" aspects, they're just talking about stats.

That's totally cool if you define an RPG in that way. I disagree, as I define an RPG 'experience' differently, but I think that is another debate. Bioware -- judging from all the interviews -- know exactly what they are doing with ME gameplay-wise and I admire them for doing something different; it is a formula that is working for me. I have a feeling that most people in this thread are taking the article out of context.

 

[johnnnny guitar]

FUCK just today i was like nah it wont turn out like dragon age 2 they got the gameplay right just a couple of tweaks are needed theyve figured out what works then this comes out you better not mess this up EA OR Your dead I will literally bomb your company

 

[Pontifex]

I know that the developers have said that since ME2's combat was shooter-tastic, they were being compared to COD and Battlefront, and on that front the game fell a little short. They've said that they are beefing up shooter aspects like weaponsfire sounds, and adding ladders, more varied levels, and other similar things.

Hopefully, that is what they were referring to when they said "tweaked" for a larger market.

 

[The Human Torch]

Ah yes, this thread has plenty of angry fans that base their opinion on absolutely nothing. Funny to see how people flip out over next to no information. It's even more hilarious to see "I am not going to buy it now!" protests, I am curious to see how many of these 'protesters' will actually buy the game, I am thinking around 90%. Gamers always have a spine made out of expired jelly.

Fans are indeed the worst people out there.

Guys, it is one thing to voice concerns, but at least be adult about it. Or if you can't, blame yourself the next time someone doesn't think that gaming is a serious and adult hobby.