Why do people hate JRPGs?

[Zhukov]

Usually,they've got good plots, good character development, good music and clever gameplay which is basically what makes a game enjoyable.

So why is it that people don't like them?

Umm... you do realise that "good" is a relative term... right? You saying that JRPGs have good this and good that doesn't make it so for everyone else.

Basically, some people don't like JRPGs because their notion of "good" differs from yours.

Oh wait, it's not cool because Yahtzee said so. I honestly can't speak for the gaming world at large, but I will make two points. One is unique to this site and it involves Mr. Croshaw basically instructing his parrots that all JRPGs are bad and that they should relentlessly mock anyone who likes them. This statement alone speaks for itself, I don't think I need to embellish further on it.

I've seen quite a few of your posts recently.

Almost every single one, or at least every single one I remember, mentioned Yahtzee and his fan base. And almost every single one contained a sentiment along the lines of, "Damn it guys, stop agreeing with someone I disagree with! It isn't supposed to work like that!"

Sir John, I'm starting to suspect you might have some... issues there.

 

[Timbydude]

I hate to say it, but a lot of people hate JRPGs because they've only played Square-Enix RPGs. The Shin Megami Tensei series, for example, still features a few conventions of the genre, but all in all its complex, non-cliche stories and excellent gameplay allow it to rise above the rest.

Of course, it's still a turn-based RPG, even if it's a very well-made one. It likely won't convert others to its cause.

Anyway, my point is that it is very easy to take one or two entries in a genre and extrapolate it to the rest of the genre. JRPGs are now considered to be stagnating primarily because of three recent entries: Final Fantasy XIII, Dragon Quest IX, and Star Ocean: The Last Hope. However, these are far and away not the only options. There are tons of quality games coming out from a multitude of developers (Atlus, Nippon Ichi Software, Sega) which innovate and take the genre in new directions. The only problem is that no one plays them.

And Persona gets a lot of love as a JRPG, but you have to shoot yourself in the head to summon demons. I'd say that's much more absurd than the swords-and-magic Final Fantasy and Neverwinter Nights. But I suppose the execution is more important than the concept itself.

Well, you don't actually shoot yourself per se (though you do use an object shaped like a gun, which sounds like a gun, to draw out your psyche, etc.), but I enjoy that because it's an important symbolic element to the story.

 

[TG MLPDashie]

They're dull, samey, involve a lot of grinding and can drag on for quite a while.
But I love 'em all the same. Well, some of them.

alright, you hate JRPG's but you have Scott Pilgrim as your avatar...


also i love them and FPS games, i guess its mainly if you love guns or swords, which time period you like ect. I love fantasy settings and being an Elf Druid/Warden, while i like being a sniper, it just mainly depends on your preferences. I for one like both while someone else might have a different preference.

 

[captainwalrus]

I like JRPGS. And to address a lot of the criticism levied against them - the linearity, the massive cut scenes, the archetypal characters, etc - well, yeah, WRPGs have more player choice, less intruding cut scenes, and characters that develop based on player choice. But sometimes I don't want to be the protagonist. Sometimes I just want to be the active observer. Sometimes, I'd rather just watch something epic unfolding - something in the interstices of suspension of disbelief and the 'just plain asinine'. For me, JRPGs fill that niche. They have that strange but relieving balance of observation and decision making.

 

[spartan231490]

I have two problems. Way too much teen drama and i really dislike turn based combat.

 

[chaos order]

The stupidity... Swords and Magic... HEY GUYS LET'S FIGHT A MOTORBIKE!!!
Wow sure FF that makes sense. Most are fine but the art style doesn't appeal to me and I downright hate all Final Fantasy...

I never understood that logic, video games were never meant to be realistic. Agreed with the art style for the most part though.

true video games are not "supposed" to be realistic, but u have to draw the line somewhere, and that line is drawn a couple of paces behind the bloody gun blade

I suppose you have a point, but some people like when a game just goes absurd with some concepts. I never really liked when a game used too much realistic features, and I know many people would enjoy fighting an Eldritch abomination once in a while instead of a human footsoldier.

And Persona gets a lot of love as a JRPG, but you have to shoot yourself in the head to summon demons. I'd say that's much more absurd than the swords-and-magic Final Fantasy and Neverwinter Nights. But I suppose the execution is more important than the concept itself.

o ya absurdity can be awesome but when the game tries to be serious when it has such absurdities is what kills it, at least for me. once again ill use the gunblade as an example for FF

 

[Quaidis]

You're just being crazy. I love JRPGs. They're like an interesting novel in game form, and you are the main character. I love playing games, I'm into books. A game and a book together, but better (with music!?), I'm in pure bliss.


I should probably mention that I am a tad drunk.

Oh wait, I'm playing Arc Rise Fantasia right now and it has some atrocious English voice acting. Though I'm sure other games have it, having to listen to the same badly voiced characters say their long mundane lines is a wee bit tiresome. If only I could turn the voices off.

My last paragraph does not represent all jrpgs. I'm personally looking at my shelf wondering what PS2 rpg to start again. WildArms3? Grandia 2? Oh man, screw the PS2, I should play FF8 and try to beat it this time.

 

[A random person]

I like JRPGS. And to address a lot of the criticism levied against them - the linearity, the massive cut scenes, the archetypal characters, etc - well, yeah, WRPGs have more player choice, less intruding cut scenes, and characters that develop based on player choice. But sometimes I don't want to be the protagonist. Sometimes I just want to be the active observer. Sometimes, I'd rather just watch something epic unfolding - something in the interstices of suspension of disbelief and the 'just plain asinine'. For me, JRPGs fill that niche. They have that strange but relieving balance of observation and decision making.

This; while it's true that WRPG's are better for non-linear plots and telling your own story, said story I create tends to be pretty silly (my New Vegas character was named Professor Layton and looked like Stalin, and the character I'll make later will probably be Tommy Wiseau)

 

[v3n0mat3]

I like them fine, but I just don't like some of the people that play them... The weeaboos.

 

[Defense]

I have two problems. Way too much teen drama and i really dislike turn based combat.

Turn based combat is a pretty broad term. For example, just look at Mother 3. You don't go up to the monster and hack away at their health or shoot them from a third person view with a reticule in the middle of the screen, but you do have to think on your feet. It has a rhythm battle system that allows you to combo more attacks depending on how you time your attacks, and you can prevent your characters from dying if you heal them quickly enough. That doesn't sound like a turn based battle system to me.

And Final Fantasy has had ATB as an option for a long time, ever since IV I think, although that isn't as significantly different from turn based battle as the combo system.

o ya absurdity can be awesome but when the game tries to be serious when it has such absurdities is what kills it, at least for me. once again ill use the gunblade as an example for FF

That sounds more like bad execution to me. The reapers aren't exactly realistic concepts in Mass Effect. I mean?

Spoiler

They look over societies until they become fully developed and then destroy said society so they can make even more reapers. As far as I know, I don't know the Mass Effect universe that much considering I never played more than 2 hours of both games.

But you still know that you shouldn't fuck around with them. I'll just say it right now, Final Fantasy XIII has a good plot once you can get past the shitty jargon.

Spoiler

You get these gods that support the humans with their lives but occasionally capture humans and make them do quests for them. If they finish their goal, they get eternal life by becoming a crystal statue, but if they don't, they turn into mindless monsters that show the efforts of those who have tried but failed. The slaves get absurd powers but are social pariahs because they were told so by the government. While that happens, the government is trying to get normal people onto another planet that's essentially hell on earth as well as trying to protect the people from the supposed evil people even though they're the real evil ones. Or so I've read, because this plot is really fucking complicated at times.

Absurd? Of course. But it isn't Earthbound "lol this guy is named poo" comedy, it's supposed to be treated as a drama, and you can see that with the conflicts between each character. Hope has to pair up with Snow, the man who got his mother killed, and Lightning as well, who thinks Snow is responsible for turning her sister(and his fiance) into a crystal statue, and for getting her turned into a "slave" in the first place. If that's not a conflict to you, then I really don't know what is.

 

[Arehexes]

WRPG are not non linear guys, you still have to do a stupid side quest which has
1) you goinggo to point b and either kill or get something, or talk to someone and/or bring them back.
2)Go back to the quest giver.

If it was non linear I could kill the quest giver take his reward and if he ran a guild take over that. Or what if I was to kill the "king" of a land, besides being chased by guards I could take over. I don't care what anyone says a rpg video game is not non linear either from east or west.

 

[Scarecrow]

the least armored guys are always the strongest D:

Just like in real life...LOOK OVER THERE!! 'runs away'

cookie for reference.

 

[flamingjimmy]

I don't like JRPG's mostly because of turn based combat, but also I disagree with the OP on the point about story. I don't think the quality of the writing is significantly better in JRPGs, just a whole lot more pretentious, and somehow simultaneously a whole lot sillier.

I like the choice (or illusion of) that you get in western RPGs, you put yourself into the character. I don't want to be forced to be some androgynous teen with spiky hair.

 

[Sakurazaki1023]

Oh and, sorry for the rather lenghty post, despite the fact that I cut myself short, having been worried it'd be far too long (and it already is despite the cut).

There's a lot of variety in JRPG, despite the cliches people give that "they're all the same".

Similar to FPS if you will. "They're all the same, just some Call of Duty X number or clone or some Halo-wannabe".

Well, that's denying a lenghty history of FPS games out there, and one of them defies this statement and should be a highly recognizeable name to any well educated gamer. "Deus Ex". Additionally, System Shock/Bioshock is also an FPS and one that has moved the genre forward nicely in it's complexities.

Sticking to tired cliches are easy. Knowing better takes the effort of learning and no longer being joyously ignorant and secure in your mistakes.

I think the main issue at play here is that Final Fantasy VII is the default go-to perception of JRPGs. The genre has expanded exponentially since the PS1 days, but people still cling to these old cliches. Saying that FFVII is the modern standard for JRPGs is like saying that all modern shooters are exactly like Quake.

The main reason that I play JRPGs is because they are not afraid to have a game with an original aesthetic and visual style. Yes, there are some bland "standard medieval" JRPGs, but can't the same thing be said for the "standard brown and ultra-realistic" FPS?

The main problem I see with recent western games is that, in a vain attempt to be as realistic as possible, they have abandoned any semblance of absurdity that makes games fun. Gaming allows for infinite possibilities and completely unique worlds, so why is everyone so obsessed with realism? I can see where realism has it's place, but I play video games in order to experience something new, not something grounded in reality.

Would Bayonetta or Devil May Cry be better games if they incorporated realistic physics?

Would Resonance of Fate be a better game if everyone was a generic brown haired male and engaged in cover based gunfights?

Would Digital Devil Saga be a better game if the Wasteland wasn't influenced by classical Hinduism and contained intricate and original architecture?

Would Shadow Hearts be a better game if everyone was a gruff stereotype without an ounce of humor?

I can admire games like Portal and Team Fortress 2 since they maintain an excellent level of art design while including absurd elements that liven up the entire gaming experience. I can even respect Mass Effect for having a very intricate (if slightly cliched) Sci-fi aesthetic. What I can't forgive is games like Fallout 3 and Grand Theft Auto 4. Instead of creating an original atmosphere and aesthetic, they did nothing but copy real life (modern or the 50s) and run it through a sepia filter. A post-apocalyptic environment is no excuse for boring visuals.

If you want a more original perspective on JRPGs, play one of these instead of Final Fantasy:

Persona 3 FES
Persona 4
Digital Devil Saga
Shadow Hearts: Covenant
Resonance Of Fate
Baten Kaitos
Baten Kaitos: Origins
Devil Survivor
Valkyria Chronicles
Any Paper Mario

 

[Defense]

I dislike them for several reasons, here are a few:

1.most of them have turned based battle systems which bore me.

2.the lead character is always some gigantic sword wielding androgynous teenager with sonic the hedgehog hair, and a fashion sense even super-villains would call ridiculous.

3.the plot lines feel like stuff from soap operas except you're a androgynous melodramatic teenager that must kill demons with your gigantic sword in between the crying.

You could say that about FPSs, just replace "androgynous teen" with "guy with overpowered suit fighting against aliens". I'd say just a space marine, but I don't want good old Gordon left out of it.

 

[_Cake_]

I use to like them but they really got stale. I still play some of the older ones.

 

[ethaninja]

I don't HATE them. Hate is such a strong word, I wish people wouldn't throw it around as much.
But I just don't care about them. I have the same feeling about them as Anime. Don't get it and never will.

 

[ethaninja]

I dislike them for several reasons, here are a few:

1.most of them have turned based battle systems which bore me.

2.the lead character is always some gigantic sword wielding androgynous teenager with sonic the hedgehog hair, and a fashion sense even super-villains would call ridiculous.

3.the plot lines feel like stuff from soap operas except you're a androgynous melodramatic teenager that must kill demons with your gigantic sword in between the crying.

This pretty much somes it up. Overcompensating weaponized hair character running around making me feel depressed.