So according to some feminists, this anti-rape ad campaign is sexist

[Necrofudge]

While I disagree with the notion these feminists are spouting, I see where they're coming from on this. In an indirect way, the ad campaigns DO sort of blame women for being victims.

Who knows? Maybe someone could come up with a really interesting campaign for the "Don't Rape" angle of it and everything would get better. It'd have to be one hell of a commercial, I can say that right now.

 

[Captain Booyah]

And how would you even go about teaching this "Don't rape" message? I agree with the sentiment, but normal guys don't need to be told not to rape women. If you are a rapist, then a poster telling you it's bad probably isn't going to make a whole lot of difference.

If you consider yourself a rapist, yes. Alot of men who commit rapes don't, that what they are doing isn't that bad, really.

That's what I mean. There doesn't seem much of a way to get through to someone who doesn't even realise that what they're doing is wrong.

 

[Xin Baixiang]

We haven't even begun to define consent, and that's even more scary. Men can withdraw consent during intercourse, and you SHOULD stop there. I say should, because many won't, and that's rape. Men can withdraw consent before, during, and even after.

Consent is used as a panacea in these conversations, but it honestly isn't a cure-all. It's a nebulous, scary idea that is almost impossible to nail down a definition for. You want to focus advertising? Focus it on consent. Almost like the OP's ad does.... Scary.

 

[Thaluikhain]

And how would you even go about teaching this "Don't rape" message? I agree with the sentiment, but normal guys don't need to be told not to rape women. If you are a rapist, then a poster telling you it's bad probably isn't going to make a whole lot of difference.

If you consider yourself a rapist, yes. Alot of men who commit rapes don't, that what they are doing isn't that bad, really.

That's what I mean. There doesn't seem much of a way to get through to someone who doesn't even realise that what they're doing is wrong.

Hey? Aren't they the ones that need to be told?

 

[L-J-F]

Apparently if a girl/guy is drunk it's not consensual and therefore rape, so:

If BOTH are drunk then what? Did they both rape each other?

 

[Yoshisummons]

Wait. Doesn't the concept of women having sex while drunk is rape, but if a man is drunk and has sex it is not? Am I missing something here?

 

[LiquidSolstice]

Instead of justifying this mindset by telling women not to dress revealingly, maybe we should be explaining to (potential) criminals that wearing provocative clothing does not mean their (potential) victim wants to have sex. Presuming revealing clothing was actually the reason most rapes occur, which it isn't.

LOL? So criminals all sit down around a round-table to discuss their past and future exploits, and there's always an empty seat for some activist to come every week to try and convince them not to do it?

That's completely insane.

What are you talking about. You think we shouldn't address criminals when attempting to prevent crime? What's the point of ad campaigns against speeding or drink driving if you think that criminals can't be reasoned with? Sure, there are some people who will do something just because they can, but others simply might not understand how harmful their behavior really is. They might not realize that they shouldn't wait for a girl to say "no" before they stop, but they should wait for her to say "yes" before they start. Is that really so absurd? Or do you think encouraging girl's to dress like nuns and pushing society back to the fifties is a more reasonable solution.

Fine. Let's put up signs that say "Attention rapists: stop it." Forget ANY sort of preemptive measures or awareness campaigns, because obviously any time someone does so with a purely honest intention, you'll whine about it.

That would be acceptable to you, right?

 

[Nouw]

Apparently if a girl/guy is drunk it's not consensual and therefore rape, so:

If BOTH are drunk then what? Did they both rape each other?

I really shouldn't have laughed at that. Being a bit mature though, I think that in some areas of the world it would be considered rape on the man's part. Double standards and all.

 

[LiquidSolstice]

And how would you even go about teaching this "Don't rape" message? I agree with the sentiment, but normal guys don't need to be told not to rape women. If you are a rapist, then a poster telling you it's bad probably isn't going to make a whole lot of difference.

If you consider yourself a rapist, yes. Alot of men who commit rapes don't, that what they are doing isn't that bad, really.

That's what I mean. There doesn't seem much of a way to get through to someone who doesn't even realise that what they're doing is wrong.

Hey? Aren't they the ones that need to be told?

Sure. Why don't you try talking to them, then? If it's that easy, of course.

 

[ZeZZZZevy]

My greatest problem with anything concerning rape is how the law defines it. Unless it's been recently changed (probably not) the law usually defines a man having sex with someone who has not given consent to be rape. You wanna know what's funny? That is how the laws are usually worded.

"The crime, committed by a man, of forcing another person to have sexual intercourse with him, esp. by the threat or use of violence." -google's standard definition of rape (easiest example I can give)

So apparently a woman cannot rape. Because she isn't a man. Food for thought.

OT: I'd respond directly to the ad by questioning the edgy imagery, but I suppose they need to get attention somehow.

 

[lacktheknack]

Rape is the rapist's fault. Target your ads at them, not the victims.

Again, what will ads towards rapists do? They know it's wrong, they know the punishment, etc. They just straight up don't give a damn.

Thus, if rape commercials are going to be effective in any measure, it'll be from helping to arm women with basic know-how and situations to avoid.

 

[LiquidSolstice]

You're claiming that women should know better than to dress provocatively because some men might think that she should expect to get raped for doing so, and they interpret that as a form of consent. That is victim blaming.

Wow guy, just wow. It is not victim blaming, it is FACT. Just like it is FACT that you increase your chances of injury by not wearing a helmet at a construction site.

Women can dress however they want. I'd be a liar if I told them I wanted them to dress in sweaters, because I appreciate the female body as much as the next guy. But with every action there are RISKS. Men seeing cleavage will be sexually attracted, it's as inevitable as gravity.

I've seen posters try to tell men this isn't a lead on before. Who knows whether it actually worked?

Telling a woman to take precautions and wear a helmet does NOT equal blame.

Try this on for size:

Oh no, a video of a proud woman telling us that the look of her skirt being related to her rape risk is ridiculous.

Well shit, I guess that means that guy at the bar DIDN'T say "She's asking for it", because that never happens. Ever. At all. It's soooooooooo misunderstood.

 

[manic_depressive13]

Wow guy, just wow. It is not victim blaming, it is FACT. Just like it is FACT that you increase your chances of injury by not wearing a helmet at a construction site.

Women can dress however they want. I'd be a liar if I told them I wanted them to dress in sweaters, because I appreciate the female body as much as the next guy. But with every action there are RISKS. Men seeing cleavage will be sexually attracted, it's as inevitable as gravity.

I've seen posters try to tell men this isn't a lead on before. Who knows whether it actually worked?

Telling a woman to take precautions and wear a helmet does NOT equal blame.

It isn't a fact though. You're completely wrong. You're misconstruing the reason rape occurs, then presenting your opinion as if it is fact. "She was too frigid" or "too uptight" has been used as an excuse for rape just as often as "her clothes were too revealing" or "she was asking for it". Furthermore, the vast majority of rapes are perpetrated by the victim's close friends or spouse, who mistakenly feel they are entitled to her body. They think since she has consented in the past, it's too late for her to be saying "no". She can't possibly have any objections to them having sex with her again if they have already had sex with her before. Otherwise, they might feel she "owes" them, or they presume consent.

The random person on the street who attacks and rapes stranges is a very rare scenario. They are usually misogynists who want to prove their dominance over women and couldn't care less what she looks like or how she is dressed, as long as she has a vagina and they can put her in her place. I fucking read through case after case of these for my law studies course. You randomly construed an opinion based on what you thought sounded believable, without actually looking at the evidence. You thought "I like tits. I guess rapists like tits too, and they just have far less self control than I do". It doesn't actually work like that.

And telling someone that they should wear a helmet implies that if they choose not to wear a helmet, they are responsible for any head injury they sustain. This is justified because repeated tests have shown that helmets reduce injury. After all, accidents happen and it's important to take preventative measures. But rape isn't an accident, it's a deliberate crime.

 

[Smooth Operator]

I find this extremely offensive, so men are rapists and women are victims?! That is just super sexist.

Joking aside, yes they took only one aspect of the rape issue and rolled with it and while the presentation is bad they do have a point.

 

[Jak23]

This is why I hate feminists...

 

[Xin Baixiang]

Wow guy, just wow. It is not victim blaming, it is FACT. Just like it is FACT that you increase your chances of injury by not wearing a helmet at a construction site.

Women can dress however they want. I'd be a liar if I told them I wanted them to dress in sweaters, because I appreciate the female body as much as the next guy. But with every action there are RISKS. Men seeing cleavage will be sexually attracted, it's as inevitable as gravity.

I've seen posters try to tell men this isn't a lead on before. Who knows whether it actually worked?

Telling a woman to take precautions and wear a helmet does NOT equal blame.

It isn't a fact though. You're completely wrong. You're misconstruing the reason rape occurs, then presenting your opinion as if it is fact. "She was too frigid" or "too uptight" has been used as an excuse for rape just as often as "her clothes were too revealing" or "she was asking for it". Furthermore, the vast majority of rapes are perpetrated by the victim's close friends or spouse, who feel they are entitled to her body. They think since she has consented in the past, it's too late for her to be saying "no". She can't possibly have any objections to them having sex with her again if they have already had sex with her before. Otherwise, they might feel she "owes" them, or they presume consent.

The random person on the street who attacks and rapes stranges is a very rare scenario. They are usually misogynists who want to prove their dominance over women and couldn't care less what she looks like or how she is dressed, as long as she has a vagina and they can put her in her place. I fucking read through case after case of these for my law studies course. You randomly construed an opinion based on what you thought sounded believable, without actually looking at the evidence. You thought "I like tits. I guess rapists like tits too, and they just have far less self control than I do". It doesn't actually work like that.

And telling someone that they should wear a helmet implies that if they choose not to wear a helmet, they are responsible for any head injury they sustain. This is justified because repeated tests have shown that helmets reduce injury. After all, accidents happen and it's important to take preventative measures. But rape isn't an accident, it's a deliberate crime.

Count how many times you use a female pronoun in that post.

Think about why I'm asking that.

 

[Escapefromwhatever]

I fail to see why you guys are responding so vehemently against this. Is it because someone said the magic f word? No, not that one, the other one. Because this ad campaign is victim blaming at its best. It's telling women to avoid getting raped as opposed to telling men not to rape. It's making them the problem, not the rapists. That's wrong. Why make this ad as opposed to making ads saying "Don't get drunk and take advantage of women, ya prick." I mean, imagine if you were raped while drunk and then someone said it was your fault. How would you respond? All you were doing was having a typical fun night out. It's the rapists fault for raping you, not the other way around. Yes, you should always take precautions to protect yourself, but isn't always walking around in fear of rape counterproductive to having a fun night out? Should you not party on the grounds that you might be raped, just like you shouldn't drive a car in case a drunk driver hits you? Of course not.

Rape is the rapist's fault. Target your ads at them, not the victims.

That's a fail campaign from the start, for any number of reasons. I'll try to list them:

1. Telling blameless guys not to rape just insults them.

2. Rapists often don't think of themselves as rapists, just like terrorists don't refer to themselves as terrorists. They shift blame to the victim, to society, to their parents, whatever. They aren't the problem. Some don't even think what they are doing is rape. Some might even agree with this sort of campaign and look down on other rapists.

3. Telling serial rapists not to rape is like telling a drug addict not to shoot up. Whether or not they do it again will not be determined by some crappy poster campaign.

On the other hand, telling reasonable women to take precautions, stay with friends, check their drinks, beware going overboard, etc. are things that can actually help reduce rape rates. I don't see any blame going on in the poster. The worst I see is scare tactics.

I really doubt any kind of poster campaign is gonna make much of a difference regardless, but this one is preferable to yours.

I fail to see why you guys are responding so vehemently against this. Is it because someone said the magic f word? No, not that one, the other one. Because this ad campaign is victim blaming at its best. It's telling women to avoid getting raped as opposed to telling men not to rape. It's making them the problem, not the rapists. That's wrong. Why make this ad as opposed to making ads saying "Don't get drunk and take advantage of women, ya prick." I mean, imagine if you were raped while drunk and then someone said it was your fault. How would you respond? All you were doing was having a typical fun night out. It's the rapists fault for raping you, not the other way around. Yes, you should always take precautions to protect yourself, but isn't always walking around in fear of rape counterproductive to having a fun night out? Should you not party on the grounds that you might be raped, just like you shouldn't drive a car in case a drunk driver hits you? Of course not.

Rape is the rapist's fault. Target your ads at them, not the victims.

Of course it's the rapist's fault, and of course some women are simply in the wrong place at the wrong time, but you absolutely cannot deny that if you get so drunk that it impairs your judgement and common sense, then you are making yourself an easier target. To declare "I'm going to get as drunk as I want because I should be able to without getting molested" is correct in theory, but something that could only ever work in an ideal world. We do not live in an ideal world. Failing to recognise that and take precautions in order to protect yourself -- i.e. perhaps it's not such a good idea to down this sixth shot of straight vodka -- is irresponsible.

And how would you even go about teaching this "Don't rape" message? I agree with the sentiment, but normal guys don't need to be told not to rape women. If you are a rapist, then a poster telling you it's bad probably isn't going to make a whole lot of difference.

It's telling women to avoid getting raped as opposed to telling men not to rape. It's making them the problem, not the rapists. That's wrong. Why make this ad as opposed to making ads saying "Don't get drunk and take advantage of women, ya prick."

Because, genius, as has been pointed out many times... non-sociopathic people (men AND women) don't NEED a fucking poster to tell them not to rape somebody. The same reason we don't have posters saying "Don't chop up your neighbors and put them in your freezer." And If you ARE the kind of twisted fuck who would do it, then what the hell is an 11x20 poster going to do. Is a rapist going to see a poster and go "Oh damn! What the fuck was I thinking! I'm going to go work at a soup-kitchen, instead?" Somehow, yeah, I think not...

I mean, imagine if you were raped while drunk and then someone said it was your fault. How would you respond? All you were doing was having a typical fun night out. It's the rapists fault for raping you, not the other way around.

And this is the problem with feminists crybabying over this same thing every time. It's not any more "blaming the victim" then telling someone to lock their car doors if forced to drive through a city during a riot is 'blaming the victim'

There's an old saying: "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure."

Kay', so I've decided to address you all at once. Of course, a straight up "don't rape" message is wrong. But there are certain subsections of guys who consider themselves normal that think that it's okay to molest women while drunk. To cop a feel, even try to reach underneath dresses and skirts and go for the privates (It's happened at my college). There are guys who will try to force sex or won't take no for an answer, and there are guys who will attempt to take advantage of drunken women.

This sort of behavior is not okay. This sort of behavior can and does lead to rape. And if people are trying to control any portion of their population to prevent rape, it should be these a-holes, not their victims. Rape isn't usually committed by some big, scary, crazy man in an alleyway. It's done by otherwise rational friends, boyfriends, dates, and even family members. And anti-rape ads should focus on making this belittling behavior socially unacceptable rather than blaming the victims.

 

[Lazier Than Thou]

It is kind of sexist that the ad is treating it as the woman's fault. However, like it was said above, psychopaths don't need a rape ad to dissuade them.

You are assuming that rapists equate to psychopaths.

There's a massive amount of people who don't consider themselves rapists, because they don't consider what they have done to be rape. They've just had sex with someone who hasn't given consent, but it's somehow ok because she was unconscious, wife/girlfriend/whatever etc. There are loads of people who could benefit from knowing not to rape people.

...

You can't tell women they should bear the responsibility for not being raped without blaming them for it when it happens.

Secondly, of the 1 in 5 US women that are raped during their lives, only about 8% are raped by strangers.

http://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/nisvs/index.html

Funny thing about that statistic. It's a lie.

The FBI puts rape at occurring approximately 90,000 times in the year of 2010.

http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/offenses/violent_crime/forcible_rape.html

Assuming that the trend continues(and it's actually been falling the past few years), you're looking at about 6.3 million rapes over the course of 70 years, which means that less than 3% of women ALIVE TODAY(this is not counting the people that will be born, this is just the numbers for today) will be raped.

1 in 5 is straight out bull crap and they inflate their numbers to make it seem like a much larger problem than it actually is. The include in it things like(and I'm quoting from the report)

"Sexual coercion is defined as unwanted sexual penetration that occurs after a person is pressured in a nonphysical(LTT note; should be non violent, but they're dishonest scumbags) way. In NISVS, sexual coercion refers to unwanted vaginal, oral, or anal sex after being pressured in ways that included being worn down by someone who repeatedly asked for sex or showed they were unhappy; feeling pressured by being lied to, being told promises that were untrue, having someone threaten to end a relationship or spread rumors; and sexual pressure due to someone using their influence or authority.

Asking your wife repeatedly for oral sex is NOT rape. Lying to a woman and telling her you're not married is NOT rape. Telling your girlfriend that her lackluster sexual drive is NOT rape. Promising someone a gift in exchange for sex is NOT rape(it's actually theft, since technically you're stealing from a prostitute). Blackmail very well could be rape and I'm willing to agree that it is, just because the argument sucks. Sexual pressure due to influence is sexual harassment, not rape.

Very few women and men will be directly impacted by rape. It's a heinous crime committed by a minority of criminal men, but it is not the epidemic people let on to be.

1 in 5 is a lie.