So, it looks like the L4D2 boycott will die

[Nigh Invulnerable]

Wow, this debate is ridiculous. If Valve hasn't updated things as quickly as you like for the original L4D I have to wonder why you're surprised by this. Remember, we're only on Episode 2 (soon to be 3) of HL2, which came out 5 years ago if I recall correctly. This is the company that said they were introducing episodic gaming to give us smaller bits at more frequent intervals. Considering how many games get full sequels produced within that same time period, I'm shocked that gamers expected anything significant for L4D so soon.

Basically, my thoughts on the matter boil down to this: if you don't want to pay for it, don't. Valve will hear your dollars more than any boycott or forum posts complaining about things. I do agree that it's a little shady to be releasing a sequel for a game they said was going to be all about DLC and such, but anything I say at this point has zero effect on them releasing the game.

 

[Crux2]

I can't help but feel that the only reason this new campaign is so short is that Valve is trying to rush it to appease the boycotters: to give them what they wanted so they can make the sequel and do what they wanted to do with the game in the first place. So complaining about the shortness of the new campaign is pointless, because you guys aren't willing to give them the time to make new ones.

They also claim it was because people found the VS mode too long on the normal camps. People leaving 1/2 way through and such, this new one is meant to be tailored to VS games so people can have a campaign designed for competetive action.

 

[SomeBritishDude]

I seriously doubt the boycott will die from this. It may have been started for a faily good reason, and they had some interesting points way back when we didn´t know anything about l4d2.

Now they´re just hating for hatings sake.

 

[HEXYDEZiMAL]

Alrighty. This, I have to object to.

You only got "screwed" in the sense that not all of what was promised is being delivered. But to be honest, does L4D really NEED all the new content? The four campaigns, as is, are long, arduous, and FUN: even you can admit that, right?

My current playtime on L4D currently stands at 13 hours and counting: and it's only that low because I have a lot of other games that I like playing. If I didn't, I would probably have something closer to 25 hours. I'd call that getting my money's worth out of the game, REGARDLESS of what promises that the developer made with regards to extra content. Am I a little disappointed that Valve didn't release bucketloads of DLC for it? Yeah, a little. But they DID release stuff: Survival Mode mainly, which IS a good addition. People have complained about it for all sorts of reasons, but I've found that the main one was "IT ISN'T A NEW CAMPAIGN!"

Well, jeez. Considering that the four campaigns were all that the game consisted of originally, it probably takes a LONG time for Valve to properly construct them, eh?

I can't help but feel that the only reason this new campaign is so short is that Valve is trying to rush it to appease the boycotters: to give them what they wanted so they can make the sequel and do what they wanted to do with the game in the first place. So complaining about the shortness of the new campaign is pointless, because you guys aren't willing to give them the time to make new ones.

The way I got screwed had nothing to do with promises. Remember the beforementioned two campaigns that I could play Versus in?

Can you imagine yourself playing the same ten levels for five months straight?

Also, Valve had promised quite a good number of weapons. We didn't know that number was inclusive of gas cans and such. The actual number of player usable firearms is, as you know, pretty slim. For those of us who believed them, we didn't react very well to that.

You really have to view the bugs to realize that we're getting screwed, because nothing illustrates it so strongly. In fact, you'll notice that the exploit ones had to be removed, because people were likely abusing the list.

I'm not concerned with DLC at this point, because it's obvious Valve isn't putting out. I want them to fix the damned game.

Is that too much to ask, do you think?

 

[Ezekel]

Also its not like Gabe Newell is under some kind of oath or contract for what he says. They also are releasing all the things he claimed they would, just not in DLC but an actual new game, sorry that you have to actually pay for the work they are doing.

 

[HEXYDEZiMAL]

The boycott still won't end, people who are boycotting are idiotic bastards who whine and complain that they aren't getting what they want like they used too.

We get this a lot, and you're typically the type of person who eats a ban from spamming our group. Nothing new, and it still isn't any more true no matter how many times you say it.

Just as a side note, aimed at Crux2: I'm pretty much done with responding to you, because I was repeating myself a while ago. To say you're naive would be an understatement. I've stated the problems and the promises, and you refuse to believe that your gods might lower themselves to such a thing. We'd obviously not be getting anywhere, anytime soon.

 

[Strider_07]

Two maps?! A two map campaign?! What is this shit? I want a full five map campaign like the others, not some two map shit because people whined about length. Valve, I'm disappointed in you.

All needless rage aside, at least they're finally adding more DLC. Hopefully another full camapign before L4D2 comes out, otherwise I'll just keep fanboy-gasming over the Dawn of the Dead campaign.

 

[maddawg IAJI]

560 isn't too much...but still not worth it considering L4D 2 is coming out later in the year making this DLC rather invalid.

I guess if it comes out late this month or mid Sept. I may change my mind. Until there is a release date it seems rather useless to finally plop one out now.

I heard rumors about Valve trying to make it playable in L4D2.

 

[HEXYDEZiMAL]

Tell me then, how is it not true? Tell me, how are you and your fellow group-members not being whiny complainers?

Because we're merely exercising our rights as Valve's customers. We bought this from them, and we are not happy. This is what you do in a capitalist society when you seek to have a company take you seriously. You declare your intent to deprive them of profit. If you read what I've stated, none of my facts are whining, and a good deal of it is failure on Valve's part to deliver on their promises, patch the game, or more.

It'd be whining if I was crying about them tweaking my beloved weapon's damage down or something. A legitimate complaint about their systematic failures is not whining, it's what good customers should do when they receive inferior or unacceptable products and services.

If more people did this kind of thing, these companies wouldn't think we'd put up with this shit.

 

[Strider_07]

Yay for the DLC! I just read about it yesterday. The only two things that disappoint me are that it is only 2 levels, and I have to pay 560 for it. In all honesty, I would pay 500 or 600 for it, because you can't do much with 40 Microsoft points. I just wish it was a full length campaign, because I enjoy campaign and find it entertaining and more relaxing than versus.
Just a curious side note:
Is the computer version a lot more bugged than the 360 version? I am just wondering because I keep reading HEXYDEZiMAL's comments about how the game has numerous bugs, and through my game play I have experienced very few.

It's just fine, I'm just a little miffed the new campaign is only two levels long, I'd like it to be five. Then again, at least they're giving us some DLC.

 

[lordgazoontite]

its not at all surprising the boycott failed because they always do. Back when devil may cry 4 was announced as multiplatform people threatened to boycott capcom all together.

 

[Bhuggy]

I wouldn't mind if L4D2 was maybe a $20-30 expansion becuase, your gonna two games almost identical so why not randomize the weapon spawns in the old maps give the selection of the new characters and all the campaigns added on. It seems like it'd be alot easier than valve making a whole new game out of it.

 

[HEXYDEZiMAL]

its not at all surprising the boycott failed because they always do. Back when devil may cry 4 was announced as multiplatform people threatened to boycott capcom all together.

Threatening and doing are two different things. We currently have 41,396 members in the group, and like myself, you have to assume that at least some of those are quite serious.

From their actions so far, Valve seems to take us fairly seriously.

This isn't a popularity contest. I knew I was in for the long haul when I joined up.

 

[UncleOvid]

I've played L4D soon after its release and go back to it for a few games every now and then, if the PC version has issues then welcome to the world of modern gaming. I sympathyse, I really do. I've only recently been able to play PC games again after getting a new laptop but bugs and compatability issues are, regrettably, part and parcel of the modern industry - as games get rapidly more and more complex the days of basement development teams are all but over. Bugs can be game breaking and annoying but they're much, much more likely due to the nature of technology getting complex, it's not just developers getting lazy - although that can happen. The line between unacceptable and irritating is very grey and very vague, at the end of the day it's only opinion that makes the difference and they will be very varied due to the seemingly random way some people get bugs and some dont.

Hrm. This I take issue with. Compatibility issues is one thing, given the ridiculously varied configurations and platforms available these days, but I don't think you can (well, should) blame performance bugs on technology outstripping developers. To put it another way, releasing a buggy game is lazy. If I buy a $6000 high-mark gaming rig, and plop down $50-$60 bucks for a game to play on it, and it doesn't work because the production team could't figure out how to code for the system, then, well, I'm gonna feel ripped off. Yes, things are complex; yes, it's hard work; and yes, this is a corporation with, one would hope, the resources and the expertise to make a game that runs on the hardware you release it on. I think this is a reasonable thing to expect, and I entirely understand getting grouchy when you get let down.

You only got "screwed" in the sense that not all of what was promised is being delivered.

Isn't that what "getting screwed" means? After all, isn't that why everyone hates politicians? Mind you, the issues here seem to be, "What, if anything, did Valve promise, is it reasonable to expect them to deliver all that they do promise, and how far does this new release go in filling in the gaps?"

Anybody else miss the days when you bought a game and knew that that was it, nothing would change on until the sequel came out (except for PC games)?

You, dude. Right there. DLC can suck one.

 

[scotth266]

The way I got screwed had nothing to do with promises. Remember the beforementioned two campaigns that I could play Versus in?

Can you imagine yourself playing the same ten levels for five months straight?

Yes, actually. I played the same ten levels for five months straight, after all.

Besides, they added Versus support for the other two campaigns. What more could you ask for?

Also, Valve had promised quite a good number of weapons. We didn't know that number was inclusive of gas cans and such. The actual number of player usable firearms is, as you know, pretty slim. For those of us who believed them, we didn't react very well to that.

What? The weapons in the game, as is, are incredibly well-balanced, and when you throw in all the stuff you can do with gas cans, there's plenty of ways to kill things. There simply isn't a need for more weapons: the balance of the game as is with regards to guns is spot on.

You really have to view the bugs to realize that we're getting screwed, because nothing illustrates it so strongly. In fact, you'll notice that the exploit ones had to be removed, because people were likely abusing the list.

I'm not concerned with DLC at this point, because it's obvious Valve isn't putting out. I want them to fix the damned game.

Is that too much to ask, do you think?

I have not once encountered a bug in Left 4 Dead. Perhaps you're just unlucky, in which case I'm sorry: but there are always going to be bugs in games, especially games like Left 4 Dead. Online multiplayer games ALWAYS have glitches, bugs, and exploits: but Valve has been diligently patching L4D since release to counteract this.

Instead of complaining about the bugs, why not take your bug report to a forum that will do you some good, like the Steam one? If you tell Valve about the bugs you encounter, they can fix them faster. Just complaining about the fact that there ARE bugs does nobody any good, and if you don't submit a bug report, Valve never knows about the problems you've encountered.

 

[HEXYDEZiMAL]

I don't see it as an inferior product or service though, I thought they fulfilled most of their promises well. I mean the replay value of the original was terrific, even without the new campaign and Survival Mode. And it looks like they're doing better with L4D2.

That's because you didn't read some of my other posts then, where I detail how they have lied to us before and during release, reneged on promises that they made, have failed to fix a long list of major, glaring bugs in the game, screwed us out of the gate with about five months of two campaigns that were versus-compatible, gave us a beta SDK that doesn't cut it, and so on. Also stated in the boycott is the worry that L4D2 will kill most of L4D1's community right off, less than a year after release. If they're not compatible, that's very feasible.

None of this should be acceptable. You just choose to accept it.