Wait, Why the Hell is That Considered "Legendary?"
- Thread starter Julianking93
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Praising it for being influential I could understand. It being held on a pedestal based on the literary critics' opinions of it's quality, a purely subjective measure, I cannot.s69-5 said:
I am aware this is pretty old literature (compared to modern stuff) but I HATED Tom Sawyer, what a boring book.
Please tell me this is a joke. That is one of the worst songs I ever heard. It's a joke right? One I'm just not getting? No offense to you, but the way you speak of them I expected something, well, good.redarmyagent said:
there are some things that totally worthy of being 'legendary'. like Sun Tzu's the Art of War. Ovid (the odyssey and the illiad are essentially war-porn. the greeks were awesome for that), Socrates, Charles Dickens, Walt Disney, Banksy (look him up!), Thelonious Monk, Beethoven, Ella Fitz Gerald, Miyazaki, Michealangelo, Machiavelli, Einstein. to me, Legendary isn't just about being ground breaking (though that is important), it's about being so great that not only will your name never be forgotten, that even a long time afterwards people will strive after you.
to me, that is not what the white stripes are, or Halo, or Catcher in the Rye are. though I suspect that Catcher in the Rye is quite similar to many other genres, in that it is mostly appreciable from an internal perspective. I mean, let's take the white stripes as an example that has played out in front of us. Julian clearly knows (beyond doubt I'm quite sure), that the White Strips are Genius. and if I saw it from his perspective (having seen the detroit garage scene spring up around Jack White), then I'm sure I would be mighty impressed too, but I haven't. I can't appreciate that aspect. an artist will tell you a million things about gradients and how the application of a brush affects how a painting comes out, but it's largely lost on most people. I see a pretty picture. I find the 50$ deviant art print just as appealing as the 2,000,000$ painting (or perhaps more appealing). Catcher in the Rye is most likely a similar case. If you wrote books, I'm sure you would notice many details that failed to catch your eye the first time. like maybe the main character was supposed to be a douche, and it allowed the author to portray something that acted as clever social commentary. the idea that a book is necessarily supposed to have a happy ending, or have appealing characters has mostly been foisted on us by myth and Hollywood (though Hollywood was following a very long tradition). or maybe there are just cases of mass social insanity, and that's what we should call 'legendary'.
it's the same thing for everyone here and videogames. first we started out with Pong. then tetris, etc etc etc. you all know the history of videogames I'm sure. fast forward, modern day. biggest videogames out right now: World of Warcraft, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, Starcaft 2, Farmville, Bejeweled. if you had a twitch right there, when you read Farmville, and you agreed that CoD:MW2 is a good game, and SC2 is a good game, then you're an elitist snob. CoD:MW2 and SC2 are completely unaccessible to a regular person. both games make huge assumptions about who you are, and what you have experienced. to a normal person, they are horrifying monsters out to destroy their mind. much like catcher in the rye. Farmville and Bejeweled are straight forward. they are Harry Potter. to a normal person, Portal is inappreciable. tell your grandma to sit down and play portal, and she will think you are insane for liking it. same thing.
now for half a dozen TL
R.
to me, that is not what the white stripes are, or Halo, or Catcher in the Rye are. though I suspect that Catcher in the Rye is quite similar to many other genres, in that it is mostly appreciable from an internal perspective. I mean, let's take the white stripes as an example that has played out in front of us. Julian clearly knows (beyond doubt I'm quite sure), that the White Strips are Genius. and if I saw it from his perspective (having seen the detroit garage scene spring up around Jack White), then I'm sure I would be mighty impressed too, but I haven't. I can't appreciate that aspect. an artist will tell you a million things about gradients and how the application of a brush affects how a painting comes out, but it's largely lost on most people. I see a pretty picture. I find the 50$ deviant art print just as appealing as the 2,000,000$ painting (or perhaps more appealing). Catcher in the Rye is most likely a similar case. If you wrote books, I'm sure you would notice many details that failed to catch your eye the first time. like maybe the main character was supposed to be a douche, and it allowed the author to portray something that acted as clever social commentary. the idea that a book is necessarily supposed to have a happy ending, or have appealing characters has mostly been foisted on us by myth and Hollywood (though Hollywood was following a very long tradition). or maybe there are just cases of mass social insanity, and that's what we should call 'legendary'.
it's the same thing for everyone here and videogames. first we started out with Pong. then tetris, etc etc etc. you all know the history of videogames I'm sure. fast forward, modern day. biggest videogames out right now: World of Warcraft, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, Starcaft 2, Farmville, Bejeweled. if you had a twitch right there, when you read Farmville, and you agreed that CoD:MW2 is a good game, and SC2 is a good game, then you're an elitist snob. CoD:MW2 and SC2 are completely unaccessible to a regular person. both games make huge assumptions about who you are, and what you have experienced. to a normal person, they are horrifying monsters out to destroy their mind. much like catcher in the rye. Farmville and Bejeweled are straight forward. they are Harry Potter. to a normal person, Portal is inappreciable. tell your grandma to sit down and play portal, and she will think you are insane for liking it. same thing.
now for half a dozen TL
R.
Usually its a mixture of nostalgia and the time period that said 'thing' was revealed.
halo for example is a standard shooter ultimately with various 'power' weapons. Yet it is viewed as one of the best shooters of all time, because of the fact that when it came out. There was nothing like it.
halo for example is a standard shooter ultimately with various 'power' weapons. Yet it is viewed as one of the best shooters of all time, because of the fact that when it came out. There was nothing like it.
Some things are a "you had to be there" thing and others...well...the world would have gotten along just fine without them. Well, you could consider Twilight legendary at being indicative of the current drought of creative and thought-provoking literature as well as the shallowness of the younger public and the exploitative nature of commercialism. Not to call Twilight fans bad people (believe it or not I have a couple as friends), it's just that you're being content with the mediocre.
I also don't get Twitter. It strikes me as communicating things to other people for the sake of doing so.
Aside from those I think the rest of my are a matter of taste or opinion.
I also don't get Twitter. It strikes me as communicating things to other people for the sake of doing so.
Aside from those I think the rest of my are a matter of taste or opinion.
As with almost every socially related question, this can be answered with a standard "people are stupid" response. Firstly, it is so difficult for us to differentiate between a quality something and something that we merely enjoyed, to distinguish between the subjective and the objective, that we confuse our personal appreciation for something to mean that it was actually good. Secondly, we are a herd species, and will blindly follow others if given the opportunity, so when other people say "this shit is the best!" then of course we will agree, which is why popular things are almost always considered to be good by the fanbase while those outside of it are more varied. Take Shakespeare's works for example: entirely average plays that were the medieval equivalent of blockbusters, full of sex jokes and political parody to get as many people to buy tickets as possible, but after centuries of endless praise they have been elevated to the crowning achievement of the English language.
That's the problem. Any literature held in very high regard by the academia is invariably absolute shit. They're women's books about emotion and feeling, and usually make some kind of bullshitty political point.Julianking93 said:
Can I ask what was so legendary about the Halo 3 Legendary Edition? I mean, a helmet that fits a cat for Alice Cooper's sake? (And Alice Cooper deserves his legendary status)
Who?redarmyagent said:
I don´t know a single Person you just listed.
And if you say I that I am not paying attention to music then yes, fuck...it´s just music. And not even my genre. And quite frankly I don´t think that the OP is an expert in music either, really, he just sais how certain things doesn´t seem so impressive from the outside.
And I have to agree.
The White Stripes revolutionized german footballfan singing tho, humming "Seven Nation Army" through the Stadions throughout...
This saved peoples lives? It´s fucking terrible...I personally know Metal guitarists who can play better while drunk and on fire...redarmyagent said:
Now my ears ring from the stupid tune and that guys voice.
catcher in the rye is good because it has a classical structure, a unique storyline, hits on pretensions, goes counter culture, and is rather open to interpretation. Like any good work it is not about what happens to the story but what happens to the characters the story is more of a backdrop for the main character and how he grows. Also most literary scholars would debate about what would be the best book in 100 years but many would land on The Crying of Lot 49 not Catcher in the Rye.
I have heard lots of praise for Catcher in the Rye but you are going a little extreme with it, it was a great literary work but it is out classed by many other works and is by no means the greatest literary achievement or best book of the last 100 years.
As for the white stripes i am not a music buff and wont pretend to be.
Critically praised games, music, movies etc. are usually very good for more than there surface aspects and you have to be a geek in that particular area to really get it. eg fallout 1, i love it, you love it, give it to most pepole they will call it crap. Fallout is a great game but it is not what most pepole are looking for, its fun but it is made for gamers and is packed full of things that we love that most pepole dont care about anymore. Pop culture is not for geeks but for the casual observer, and while critically praised may appeal to the masses it often has more meaning to the geeks in the audience.
Note: i chose fallout 1 because it is a classic example of how to make a good game, but it is not something most pepole would devote their time to playing now, because it is not a linear guided hold your hand in an "open world" game, it tells you to go get shit done, and leaves you alone, and it has a great story in the main game, it is a different breed of game then what comes out now, and it is a style of game we never see anymore, feel free to replace fallout with any game you could spend a good deal of time praising, but a non gamer would not enjoy half as much.
I have heard lots of praise for Catcher in the Rye but you are going a little extreme with it, it was a great literary work but it is out classed by many other works and is by no means the greatest literary achievement or best book of the last 100 years.
As for the white stripes i am not a music buff and wont pretend to be.
Critically praised games, music, movies etc. are usually very good for more than there surface aspects and you have to be a geek in that particular area to really get it. eg fallout 1, i love it, you love it, give it to most pepole they will call it crap. Fallout is a great game but it is not what most pepole are looking for, its fun but it is made for gamers and is packed full of things that we love that most pepole dont care about anymore. Pop culture is not for geeks but for the casual observer, and while critically praised may appeal to the masses it often has more meaning to the geeks in the audience.
Note: i chose fallout 1 because it is a classic example of how to make a good game, but it is not something most pepole would devote their time to playing now, because it is not a linear guided hold your hand in an "open world" game, it tells you to go get shit done, and leaves you alone, and it has a great story in the main game, it is a different breed of game then what comes out now, and it is a style of game we never see anymore, feel free to replace fallout with any game you could spend a good deal of time praising, but a non gamer would not enjoy half as much.
Fixed it for you.naab said:
But you have a point. When something comes to the public awareness is much more important than (objective) quality. I mean, I love me some Nirvana cuz I was 12-13 back then and "Smells like teen spirit" was the best thing ever created, but most of what Cobain did was just shit.
I agree with you I watch a movie or play a game and I like it if it was enjoyable, if it is not I sell it.RaphaelsRedemption said: